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  • The Evolution of a Single Dad: Balancing Sacrifice, Support, and Self-Discovery

    The Evolution of a Single Dad: Balancing Sacrifice, Support, and Self-Discovery

    · Dads With Daughters

    Fatherhood is a deeply personal and transformative journey that challenges individuals in unexpected ways. In the podcast episode of Dads with Daughters, guest Rob Rohde shares his profound experiences as a single father to five daughters, shedding light on the complexities and rewards of parenting. Through his candid reflections and discussions with Dr. Christopher Lewis, Rob's story unveils the evolution of his role as a father, from initial fears and struggles to moments of growth and resilience.

    Embracing Vulnerability:

    Rob Rohde's admission of neglecting self-care early on as a single father resonates with many parents who prioritize their children's well-being above their own. By falling into the trap of self-sacrifice, Rob recognized the detrimental impact it had on his mental and emotional health. Through support from his family and other men, Rob acknowledged the importance of self-care and the necessity of addressing his own needs while being a pillar of strength for his daughters.

    Facing Challenges and Self-Reflection:

    The journey of fatherhood is not without its challenges, as Rob Rohde discovered through personal struggles and moments of feeling lost. His realization of the fractured relationships with his older daughters prompted introspection and personal growth. By asking himself tough questions about his parenting and taking responsibility for his role in the family dynamics, Rob embarked on a path of self-discovery and improvement.

    Supporting Through Loss and Trauma:

    The loss of the girls' mother posed a significant emotional hurdle for Rob and his daughters, highlighting the importance of navigating grief and supporting each child's unique needs. Rob's account of being asked to identify his late wife's body by the sheriff's department illuminates the profound depth of his challenges. Despite the traumatic event, Rob's unwavering dedication to his daughters' well-being and his commitment to open communication and support illustrate the resilience of the human spirit in times of adversity.

    Lessons in Connection and Bonding:

    Rob Rohde's emphasis on understanding nonverbal cues and fostering meaningful connections with his daughters underscores the power of effective communication and emotional intelligence in parenting. By prioritizing quality time and creating a safe environment for his children, Rob cultivates strong bonds built on trust and understanding.

    Empowering Other Fathers:

    Rob's journey as a single father inspired him to become a coach for other dads facing similar struggles, providing personalized support and guidance. By acknowledging the common challenges and complexities of single fatherhood, Rob aims to customize his coaching approach to address individual needs and empower men on their parenting journey.

    In the realm of fatherhood, each experience is a unique tapestry of growth, challenges, and triumphs. Rob Rohde's narrative exemplifies the transformative power of self-reflection, vulnerability, and unwavering support in navigating the complexities of parenting. As fathers embrace their roles with openness and authenticity, they pave the way for meaningful connections and enduring bonds with their children.

    By sharing his story and insights, Rob Rohde inspires a community of fathers to embrace their journey with grace, resilience, and an unwavering commitment to supporting their daughters through every twist and turn of life's tapestry. Through vulnerability and self-discovery, fathers can truly become the anchors of love and support that their children need to thrive and blossom.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week and every week I love it. I'm being able to just be here to be part of this journey that you're on. And you're a part of my journey too. I have to tell you about my kids, and I love hearing about the journeys that you're on as well. And I appreciate so much that you come back every week and are able to learn and grow with all of the dads and all of the people that we have on the show. It has been an amazing ride over these last few years as we have had so many amazing guests that have shared their own journey, shared resources and more to help you be that dad that you wanna be for your daughters. And that's important because none of us have all the answers.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:07]:
    None of us have to do this alone. And it's important to be able to reach out to learn to be able to be a little vulnerable. Yes. I said that word vulnerability. Yes. Being a little vulnerable and knowing that you don't have to do this alone and that you can reach out. You can learn about other ways of doing things and incorporate things into your own parenting journey that makes sense. Not everything you're gonna hear on every show is gonna make sense for you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:37]:
    I get that. And what's most important is that you're here, you come back, you listen every week, and you're willing to learn. This week, we've got another great guest with us today. Rob Rode is with us. And Rob is a single dad of 5 daughters. Yes, I said 5 daughters. And and I said single dad. So we're gonna be talking about that as well and the journey that he has been on with his own daughters. I'm really excited to have him on and to have him share some of the journey that he's had. Rob, thanks so much for being here today.

    Rob Rohde [00:02:10]:
    Hi, Chris. I am happy to be here. Thank you for having me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:13]:
    It is my pleasure having you here today. Love being able to talk to you about this journey that you're on. And I wanna turn the clock back in time. I know you've got 5 daughters and your oldest daughters are in their twenties. So adults now, but I wanna go all the way back because I know your oldest are twins.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:28]:
    Let's go all the way back to that first moment. That first moment when you found out that you're going to be a dad to a daughter, what was going through your head?

    Rob Rohde [00:02:35]:
    Wow. Well, my story is actually a little bit different in that my oldest daughters were already born when I met them. So I started dating their mom when they were about 2 years old. And so I, you know, I knew at the time that I started seeing their mom that she had daughters and she had twin daughters. And so if I was gonna make a decision to continue in that relationship and to, go down that path, I I knew that being a father was part of it. And so there wasn't this single moment in time where I realized, oh, you're gonna be a dad to daughters. It was more of a kind of a a slow journey. But I will say this, one of the more kind of unique and exciting things that I get to tell my oldest 2 daughters is that I got to choose to be their dad.

    Rob Rohde [00:03:22]:
    I got to choose them specifically. And that's something that's kind of unique and kind of exciting. And so the story is, is that after their mom and I got married, their father, biological father, was never in the picture. And so I wanted to start the process of trying to adopt them. And so after several years of going down that road, I did adopt them. And so, now they are not just mine in spirit, they are fully mine and will always be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:50]:
    I love that story and the journey that you're on. And and so one I guess one other question is that so you had a few years with just those 2, and then you ended up having your next daughters. And at that point, that had to have been a little bit more of a surprise because of the fact that that you didn't come into the relationship where those daughters were there. So talk to me about that reaction that you had when those next daughters came into your life.

    Rob Rohde [00:04:17]:
    It was definitely different, but I I have to tell you, I I was so excited. We did not with my 3rd daughter now, so the one the first one that you're talking about, we did not know whether or not she was going to be a girl or a boy. So that moment came in the delivery room when she was actually born. And so, you know, when I always wanted to have a large family, and I was excited about that. And I was excited for to already have the 2 older girls and now to be kind of starting a expanding that family further. And so the moment that I saw her, it was amazing. I mean, I think the thing that a lot of a lot of people don't tell you is just they talk about the fear, and they talk about the all the worries, and they talk about the stress. But they don't talk really about how you literally fall in love with this little child in a different way, but a similar way to how you you fall in love with a spouse. And that it but it happens so quickly for some of us. And in this situation, it happened almost right away from the moment I saw her.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:23]:
    Now you just mentioned fear in a lot of dads that I talked to talk about that with having daughters, that there is some fear that went along with that. For you having 5 daughters. What's been your biggest fear in raising your daughters?

    Rob Rohde [00:05:37]:
    You know, initially, my biggest fear was just simply fear that I was going to screw them up. You know, I mean, that sounds so simple and so basic, but it was just fear that maybe I wasn't equipped to connect with them in the way that they needed or to or I wasn't patient enough or, you know, I didn't really have all the tools that I needed in order to to really take care of daughters and to to be that type of dad that they needed from me. But I will say that that fear changed significantly as they started to get older. And once I became a single father, that anxiety turned into just into a complete lack of knowing whether or not I had the ability to take care of them on my own, and a feeling of overwhelm and everything that goes along with that. But now that the kids are a little bit older, the anxiety that I face or the fear that I face is more around whether or not I did the work and did the things that I needed to do when they were younger to really build that foundation for them. And whether or not they you know, every dad is going to fear for the safety of their kids, and in particular, their daughters. I think that that's just always there. And there's only so much you can do to protect them as they grow and as they become older.

    Rob Rohde [00:06:57]:
    And, you know, your hope is that you have done the work early on so that now that they are in this stage of their life, that they have the tools that they need, they have that sense of self worth and security. They have the love for themselves and the the knowledge that they have value to offer the world. And, you know, you we really just want to raise daughters who are confident, secure, love themselves, and treat others well. And the fear is whether or not we've done our work early on in order to set them up to be successful.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:28]:
    Now one of the things that you just talked about was that anxiety that you felt, especially as became a single father and the questioning of your own abilities to be able to manage things to to deal with things. I'm sure that during that process, you had to do some things for yourself to be able to manage that anxiety, to get past that anxiety, to be able to then be there for your daughters. Talk to me about that journey for yourself and what you had to do to get yourself in a place where you were able to get to that point of, I'm gonna say acceptance in some ways, but but how it's in getting to that point where you were okay with where you were, but then at the same time, where you were okay with where your daughters were and able to support them for what they needed?

    Rob Rohde [00:08:15]:
    Well, so if I'm being fully honest, I did not do a good job of taking care of myself early on. I fell into the trap that so many of us dads fall into, which is trying to be that rock of stability and trying to make sure that we're that pillar for our children. And we put all of our energy and all of our resources into making sure that they have what they need. And we almost do it, or I almost did it, almost like a badge of honor. Like, I'm gonna put my needs to the side and make sure that they have everything they need. I'm gonna always put them first. And I did that to my detriment. And I it took me time to realize that that was not helpful for them, and they were not getting the best version of me when I was trying to go that direction.

    Rob Rohde [00:08:59]:
    So the help that I did have, though, from the beginning is I did have a strong support group within my family. I had a group of of relatives, uncles, cousins, my father, other men who were in my corner and who kept me grounded and helped provide me with the confidence that I needed and kept me kind of going in that positive direction.

    Rob Rohde [00:09:19]:
    But there was also this period of time where I felt lost, and I felt like I was not doing what to do, and I was not taking care of myself. And when I first became a single father, I went into this trap of I was drinking single father, I went into this trap of, I was drinking too much, I wasn't sleeping well, I was not exercising, not eating healthy. I wasn't doing any of the things that I needed to do to take care of myself. And it really took those men that I, that I spoke about earlier kind of stepping into my life and saying, hey, Rob, you need to make a change, and you need to really take a look at the example you're setting for your daughters and kind of get out of this funk that you're in. And I will say that I did seek out help after that, and I I sought out help in the form of of counselors and mentors and other men, And I just leaned on people and started doing my own work. And I went through this period early on where I was just blaming everybody for everything. And I was blaming my ex wife for maybe saying derogatory things about me, and I was blaming my job for forcing me to work so much. And I was blaming my older daughters because I not appreciating everything I did because my relationship with them was fractured.

    Rob Rohde [00:10:30]:
    And we really had a a challenge early on. And so it took me a while to get out of that place of blame and start working on myself as opposed to just pointing the finger outward and pointing the finger at others. And to me, what was this turning point for me is I was listening to the words of a host on a leadership podcast who was talking about a situation where him as a leader fell short on his goals. And he had to report up to his boss, and his boss asked him this question. He asked him, how has your leadership contributed to this result? And I heard those words, and I immediately went to my older daughters. And I turned that back at me and asked myself, how has your parenting contributed to this result? How has your parenting led to these fractured relationships that you're currently in with your older daughters? And that was a moment that really just sunk in. Those were words that just sunk in and really entered into my mind. And I remember sitting alone when I heard this, when I was listening to this.

    Rob Rohde [00:11:35]:
    My kids were at their mom's house. I was alone in the house, up in my room, and I remember turning to the mirror and looking at myself and just being disgusted with the person that I had become, disgusted with this person who was blaming everybody else for everything and who was not taking responsibility for my own actions. And I knew I needed to make a change. And so I did. I told myself that I need to be doing things better moving forward. My daughters need a better version of me moving forward. And so to to answer your question, at that point, I became completely engrossed in learning everything I could possibly learn about leadership, parenting, raising daughters, raising sons, which I didn't even have. But just anything I could come up with that would help me be a better parent, a better leader for my family, and really kind of diving back into my own personal growth.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:29]:
    I appreciate you sharing that because I think that many dads can fall into that trap and fall into that situation where you, as you said, you blame yourself and you start spiraling down that and not every person is gonna be willing to admit that and to deal with it the way that you have. So I appreciate you sharing that and being willing to share that with everyone today. Now, as you were going through that, and going through your own process of being able to get to a better place to be able to then be there for your own daughters. As you go through that yourself, as you're raising your daughters, it's not always easy. There are definite hard points. What would you say has been the hardest part of being a father to a daughter?

    Rob Rohde [00:13:11]:
    I would say the hardest part is really recognizing the uniqueness in each individual. And that was especially hard for me starting off with twins who were already 2 years old when I met them, 4 years old when we got married, and 7 when the adoption finally went final. And I kind of had it in my head that, okay, I know how I wanna be a parent. And if I do things a certain way, then it's going to be effective. If I do it from a place of love, then I do it from a place of caring, then it'll be effective. But it really wasn't. The things that I was trying were not working. And you know, there's this uniqueness when you're raising twins, in that the primary person that they turn to for recognition, for support, and for a the person that they wanna please more than anyone else in the world is not their parents.

    Rob Rohde [00:14:07]:
    It's each other. And that's a unique dynamic that I didn't appreciate. And even as twins, they're quite different. And so, I will say the hardest thing for me was the recognizing that I needed to be a different parent to each of my children. Same level of accountability and the same level of responsibility for them, but a different person. The way that I connected with them had to be different. The way that I related with them had to be different. And the way that I showed them that I love them and I cared for them had to be different.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:41]:
    Now you and I have had a conversation at the beginning of our talk today before we went live. And one of the things you shared with me was also a really hard story and something that you had to really work with your daughters on. And that was the loss of their mother or their for your daughters. Talk to me about that and what you had to do as a father to be able to support your daughters through that loss and help them to be resilient through that period. Because at that point, they would have been in their early twenties all the way down to 8. And as you said, you need to understand how you need what the needs are for each child. But the needs of that vast age range is gonna be very different in the loss of a parent.

    Rob Rohde [00:15:28]:
    Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, that was a difficult it's an understatement to say that that was a difficult time. I was working in healthcare at the time, and I was at work in the middle of the night. And the way that all this happened after there's a series of events that happened that led up to this, without going into all of those details, I received a phone call in the middle of the night on my shift at the hospital I was working at, and it was the sheriff's department, and they were asking me to help identify the body of the girl's mom. And even though there were a lot of challenges during that time, I was not expecting this. It was a huge shock. And in that moment, after I processed my own feelings, the quick version of processing my own feelings, I was sitting in this place where I felt like I am completely ill equipped to give my daughters what they need from me in this situation. And that was the worst day of my life really up to that point.

    Rob Rohde [00:16:24]:
    And as bad as it was for me, I knew that it was 10 times more difficult for my daughters. And that following morning, when I had to have that conversation with them and let them know what had happened, I mean, it was horrible. It was awful. And, you know, I did not know what they needed. I did not know how to support them. All I knew how to do was to share the information with them in a sensitive way and to hold them and be there for them and to let them try to process their feelings in that moment. And over time, we used all the resources that were available to us. And there were resources that the court helped provide us with, victim's advocate resources and counselors and things along those lines.

    Rob Rohde [00:17:08]:
    But as you said, each one of the children is different. And so I it's impossible for me to talk about this story and talk about this situation as if it's in past in the past because we are still dealing with this right now today. And I suspect that the girls in particular will be dealing with this for the rest their lives, at least on a certain level. For instance, my one of my daughters who is now 21 has spent years in counseling and has gone through a lot of work and done a lot of processing and really is in a really good place. But now that she's in a serious dating relationship, there are some aspects of this that are coming back up, and it's affecting her in ways that she didn't know, she didn't know enough to work through those feelings until they actually, till she was actually in this situation. And so it's an evolving process. And so the best thing that I felt that I was able to do is to just give the girls a space where they felt comfortable and safe sharing the feelings that they were having with me, and then listening to the emotions, listening to the words that they were saying, and providing them with the support out beyond myself when I was not able to give them everything they needed. I firmly believe that one of the best things that we can do as parents, one of the most effective things we can do as parents to truly connect and bond and have life changing meaningful relationships with our kids is to take the time to study them, to legitimately, thoroughly study them, to be able to learn their nonverbal cues, to be able to learn their body language, to be able to see the expressions and know when they're feeling anxiety, to know when they're feeling a sense of of fear or despair or any emotion.

    Rob Rohde [00:18:58]:
    And I think that we don't spend enough time doing that as parents. And the fact that I had a little bit of a foundation doing that, I think helped me in that situation, but I had doubled down on that and really tried to understand their nonverbal cues and to really get to to understand their feelings and where they were at.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:17]:
    I really appreciate you sharing all of that. And I can only imagine that it is ongoing and it will continue to be ongoing. And just being there, like you said, is so important to be able to help your daughters to process and work through this to be able to help them in so many ways. Now, all of these things, all these things that you've been talking about, the journey that you've been on as a single dad to be able to be the father that you wanna be for your girls has led you to becoming a coach, a coach for single fathers. And I guess I'd love to hear a little bit of that origin story and what led you down this path of wanting to coach other single fathers in the journey that they're on?

    Rob Rohde [00:20:00]:
    Yeah, thank you for asking. I'm gonna tell a little story that kind of leads into this. And I'm kind of telling this in reverse order because I kind of told a portion of it a few minutes ago. But, you know, there was a moment shortly after the girl's mom and I separated when I was in the car driving over to pick up my daughters for their parenting time with me. And I remember as I was driving over, thoughts were racing through my head because I was struggling a little bit in my relationship with my older girls. I was working a ton. I was I would lose my patience at times. They blamed me for the divorce.

    Rob Rohde [00:20:35]:
    They were upset at me, and the truth is they had a right to be. But I was really genuinely trying. And I remember as I pull into the driveway thinking, this time is going to be different. This time I'm going to be more patient. This time, I'm gonna put their needs before mine. This time, I'm gonna put away all my distractions and give them my undivided attention. And as these thoughts were racing through my head, I froze as my, as the girl's mom walked out to the car alone and told me that the girls, my oldest girls, were not coming over to see me. That they didn't want to spend time with me.

    Rob Rohde [00:21:13]:
    They were upset with me. And I felt like a complete failure. My own daughters did did not wanna spend time with me. And that's when I kind of went through this place of really feeling all of this blame, putting all this blame on everyone else. And until I until over time, I realized that a very, very simple truth, which is that I can only control my reaction to situations. I cannot control other people. And I know how basic that is. I know how simple that is.

    Rob Rohde [00:21:41]:
    But sometimes the most simple truths make the biggest differences in our lives. And that was when I really started just educating myself and learning everything I I could learn and really trying to put myself in that place. But I had these feelings of exhaustion and fear and anxiety and inadequacy, and feeling like a failure, and feeling like there was a lack of resources to support me when I was in that place in my journey. And I'm telling this because that, along with all of my experiences that I've had, have led me to this place where I decided that I really wanted to provide the support and guidance to other men who are in the situation that I was in, but really the support and guidance that I didn't have, that I wish that I had had because it would have changed my journey, and it would have sped up my recovery with my daughters, and it would have sped up my growth, and it would have just made all the difference in the world. I didn't have that. I think that there is a lack of resources out there for single fathers in particular, and I wanted to step into that place based on my experience and my knowledge. And so I went and I got my degree, and I I got my master's degree in leadership, and I've taken coaching courses, and I've done everything I could to prepare myself. But I also have this breadth of experience that is unique, that not a lot of people have.

    Rob Rohde [00:23:07]:
    And so that is what went on inside my heart that led me to this place. And then what went on inside my mind and with my actions is is really that play wanting to step into that gap that existed so that I could help support other men. I mean, you've talked about this often on your podcast, which is that we do better when we link arms with other men. We are not meant to do this alone. We need accountability. We need mentorship. We need partnerships. And, you know, I could not agree with you more.

    Rob Rohde [00:23:38]:
    And that is a big piece of what I what I'm trying to provide.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:42]:
    So you've opened yourself up to being that coach, that person that helped to other dads, as you've been going through that or yourself as you've been working with different dads, what are you learning? Oh, wow. I

    Rob Rohde [00:24:00]:
    Oh, wow. I am learning so very much with every conversation I have. I, some of the things that I have learned is how common some of these struggles are. And also, the similarities that exist regardless of age, regardless of age of the children, regardless of socioeconomic background, we all have a lot of the same fears and we all have a lot of the same desires. I think that my goal is to really meet people where they are at on their journey. I do have a step by step process that I take Minh through, but it is 100% customizable. And so the process is about the steps that we will take, but the ability for it to be customized is starting out by really understanding what it is that that individual man father wants out of this journey. What is his end goal? What is his desire? And really starting out with just trying to help that individual figure out what it is they want, and then we can customize that process to get there.

    Rob Rohde [00:25:10]:
    And some of the, you know, one of the first things that I do is we just walk through and see what is going on in their life that needs to be addressed right away. You know, we all have when we are in the middle of a chaotic situation, when there are fires going on in all aspects of our life, we're not in a position to really move forward and grow and learn. We need to set up some boundaries and set up our life so that we can optimize our ability to learn. And so we start by just identifying what is a single biggest issue that is holding you back right now and what are the steps we can take to address that issue. And that's the starting point. And then we go all the way through the process of talking about goals and vision and values and balance. But also, we don't lose sight of the fact that all men, in my opinion, have three things that they need in order to feel happy and successful. And those three things are deep meaningful connections, the pursuit of meaningful things, so meaningful pursuits or endeavors, and then they all need to feel alive.

    Rob Rohde [00:26:23]:
    They need something that allows them to feel, to get excited in the morning when they wake up. And so we always, everything that we do, we keep that in mind. What are you doing to feel alive? How are your relationships? How are your connections right now with your kids or your family or whatever is important to you? And what are you pursuing that is truly meaningful, that you're proud of? And so that's kind of the underlying theme that oversees everything that we do.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:51]:
    So you've developed this core framework, you're working with dads, you're helping to walk these dads through this journey. What's next for you in this progression of the work that you're doing?

    Rob Rohde [00:27:04]:
    You know, the next piece that I really want to step into is the community piece. And so, I really wanna move beyond the 1 on 1 coaching and move towards more of setting up the community. And so there are 2 ways that I am looking at doing that. And one of them is through group coaching with a, potentially with a digital course as a piece of that that goes along with that. But I really want to move into the community space because I feel like that is what we need as men more than anything. That is where we will see like exponential growth and the sustainability of the changes that are made is when we have a community that is joining us in the journey.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:51]:
    Now, I always like to finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Rob Rohde [00:27:58]:
    I am. Let's do it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:59]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Rob Rohde [00:28:02]:
    Responsibility.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:03]:
    Now, when was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Rob Rohde [00:28:07]:
    So I believe strongly in family culture and I believe strongly in establishing an environment where your values and meaning is all kind of comes together and into your culture as a family. And so one moment for me was shortly after, really not that long ago, a few months ago, I was leaving my 9 to 5 job and moving into this space full time. And after I came home, after my last day of work, I came home and there was basically, like, surprise celebration for me by my kids. And, you know, along with comments such as, dad, what can we do to kinda help you out so that you can have more time to be focusing on this, so that you can have more time for your clients, so you can have more time to do this. And the reason why that was a moment of success for me as a father, my kids were teaching me a lesson. My kids were showing me what it means to have a family culture of support and unconditional love and being there for each other and prioritizing family. And especially at the age that my kids are, for them to take the time to do that meant a lot.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:16]:
    Now, if I was to talk to your daughters, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Rob Rohde [00:29:22]:
    Well, I mean, if you got them in a good moment versus in a tough moment, I think that they would describe me across the board as as being loving and being supportive, but also having high expectations and standards, especially in terms of how we treat other people and the values we possess and pursuing meaningful things in our life.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:48]:
    And who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Rob Rohde [00:29:50]:
    The man in the mirror, to be honest with you. When I look at myself in the mirror and I I ask myself at one point, what kind of man do you wanna be? What kind of father do you wanna be? I wanna be able to look back. My goal is to be able to look back at that man each day and be proud of that person that I am, be proud of that father.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:11]:
    You've given a lot of piece of advice, a lot of pieces of your own story that can help other dads to define a bit more of their own story. As we finish up today, what's one piece of advice you'd want to give to every dad?

    Rob Rohde [00:30:23]:
    So one piece of advice I'd like to give. Most people are going to tell you that the most important thing is to spend quality time with your kids. And I'm here to say that the most important thing we can do as fathers is to set aside a large quantity of time for our kids. That is what our kids need from us. Our kids need us to be present. It's in those moments when we are present and our kids feel safe and secure that quality moments happen. It's in those moments when we're just there, sitting there reading a book, but we are simply present, that they are comfortable coming to us and sharing with us the important things going on in their lives, their relationship issues that they're having, their friendships, their hopes, their dreams, their desires. We can't create a quality moment, but we can create a safe environment and be present as often as possible so that those quality moments can happen naturally.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:26]:
    Well, Rob, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your journey today. If people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

    Rob Rohde [00:31:34]:
    Yeah. The probably the best place to find out more about me is to check out my podcast, which is called The Business of Being Dad. And I release a new episode every Tuesday. You can find it on all the streaming platforms. And within the show description, there are links to my website, to my email, and also to a free resource called Thrive as a Single Dad that I would love to share with anyone who is interested.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:02]:
    Well, Rob, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing your journey and your continuing journey with your 5 daughters. And I truly wish you all the best.

    Rob Rohde [00:32:12]:
    Thank you so much. It's been an honor.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:13]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the dads with daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together dot org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong and powered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    We're all in the same boat And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen Get out and be the world to them.

    Be the best dad you can be. You're the best dad you can be.

  • Joe Bovell's Legacy of Love and Leadership in Parenting Daughters

    Joe Bovell's Legacy of Love and Leadership in Parenting Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    In the realm of parenting, fathers play a pivotal role in shaping their children's lives, especially daughters. The journey of fatherhood is complex, filled with joys, challenges, and continuous learning experiences. In the Dads with Daughters podcast episode featuring Joe Bovell, a father of two, a profound discussion unfolded regarding the evolving dynamics of raising daughters. Let's delve into the insightful dialogue and extract key takeaways on navigating the path of fatherhood.

    Embracing the Journey of Parenthood

    Joe Bovell's narrative sheds light on the profound transformation that occurs when one becomes a father. The initial emotions of surprise and delight upon discovering the gender of his children set the stage for a journey filled with expectations, fears, and aspirations. Embracing fatherhood as a collaborative effort with his wife, Joe highlights the importance of being present and actively engaging in his children's lives from the moment they enter the world.

    Navigating Fears and Challenges

    As daughters transition through different stages of life, fathers like Joe Bovell acknowledge the evolving fears and challenges that come with the territory. From the desire to protect their daughters in their early years to confronting the societal pressures and influences as they grow older, the complexities of fatherhood magnify over time. Joe's exploration of the generational differences and the impact of social media on his daughter's growth provides a poignant reflection on the constant adaptation required in modern-day parenting.

    Balancing Work, Life, and Parenting

    An integral aspect of Joe's journey as a father is balancing his professional commitments with his role as a parent. As the CEO of Eco Growth International, Joe emphasizes the significance of quality over quantity when it comes to spending time with his family. Striving to be an engaged and supportive father amidst a busy schedule, Joe's approach reflects the ongoing quest for balance and prioritization in the realm of work-life integration.

    Drawing Inspiration from Personal Challenges

    Joe Bovell's upbringing in poverty and adversity serves as a foundation for his parenting philosophy. The resilience and work ethic instilled by his life experiences shape his perspectives on fatherhood and drive him to provide a safe and secure environment for his children. Joe's reflection on the absence of a father figure in his life underscores the profound impact of personal adversities in shaping one's values and aspirations as a parent.

    Continuous Growth and Reflection

    One of the most profound insights shared by Joe Bovell is the importance of continuous growth and reflection as a father. Acknowledging the feedback from his children, embracing the changing dynamics as they transition into adulthood, and navigating the fine line between guidance and autonomy, Joe exemplifies the essence of evolving as a parent. The journey of fatherhood is marked by learning on the job, adapting to new challenges, and striving to be the best version of oneself for the sake of one's children.

    In essence, Joe Bovell's journey as a father provides a poignant narrative on the highs, lows, and intricate nuances of raising daughters. His reflections on fears, challenges, and the continuous strive for improvement paint a vivid picture of the multifaceted nature of fatherhood. As fathers navigate the complexities of parenting, Joe's insights serve as a guiding light, emphasizing the importance of presence, resilience, and a constant commitment to being the best dad one can be in shaping the lives of their daughters.

    Joe Bovell was a part of Sarah Maconachie's book of stories about fathers called Working Dads and Balancing Acts.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down, talk to you to be able to be on this journey with you. Because I know it is a journey. You know, I've got 2 daughters myself. I know you've got daughters, and you are going through this journey just like I am. You may have really young daughters, you could have teenage daughters, you could have grown and flown daughters, but we're all on a journey to help our daughters to be able to be those women, those strong, independent women that I already mentioned, but that we want them to be in life. And that's why the show exists.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:01]:
    It exists because I want to help you along this path. I am not an expert, but it is important to be able to walk together in this journey, because we can always learn and grow and be better as fathers. And that's why every week I love being able to bring you different guests, different dads, different people, people with resources, people with different experiences and and on different journeys that can help you to see your own journey of fatherhood in a little bit different way. And by hearing these experiences, my hope is that you're adding some tools to that toolbox that you're carrying with you. And that that will help you in the journey that you're on. This week, we've got another great guest with us today. Joe Bovell is with us today. And Joe is a father of 2.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:56]:
    He's got a son. He's got a daughter. And we're gonna be talking about the journey that he has been on as a father himself. And I'm really excited to be able to talk to him today. Joe, thanks so much for being here today.

    Joe Bovell [00:02:07]:
    Welcome, Chris. Thank you. I'm looking forward to this. Well, I'm

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:10]:
    really excited to have you here today. And I always start the interviews with an opportunity to kinda go back in time. We're gonna turn the clock back a little bit. And I said, you have a son, you have a daughter, and we're gonna focus on your daughter today. But I want you to go back to that first moment that you found out that you were gonna be a dad to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Joe Bovell [00:02:27]:
    Well, I found out as she was born. So it seems to be a bit against the norm now where a lot of people wanna know the sex of their child before well before they're born. We took the decision with both our children to not do that. So so that was a great surprise, and I'm glad we did that. So our son was born first as you touched on. So it was great when I found out I had a daughter because that was the pigeon pear. That was fantastic to have that moment where we said, okay. Let's let's work out.

    Joe Bovell [00:02:53]:
    You know, we're being blessed. We've had, a boy and a girl. We had a lot of difficulties through both pregnancies. My wife did, not me, of course. But and she had morning sickness for every single day of each pregnancy up until the day including the day they were born. So we were only ever gonna have 2 children. So the fact that Stephanie was born was, yeah, it was a great delight.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:13]:
    Now, you know, I talked to a lot of dads, that have daughters, and a lot of the dads talk about that there is fear that goes along with raising daughters. Now, you had a son first, then you had your daughter. Talk to me about what was your biggest fear in raising a daughter?

    Joe Bovell [00:03:29]:
    I think those fears have evolved as she's gotten older. There's certainly the protective mood kicks in in those early years and and her development. But I'd say in the last 5 years, the pressures of social media, expectations of society to act and look in a particular way, that's certainly my greatest fears right now because I can see how it's influencing her how it influences her friend network, and how they communicate with each other is just so different. And I think one of my fears was the generational difference in how I grew up versus how she's growing up, and it is so different. And as a parent, you're trying to manage that sit a situation that you really have little control over. So I think the early stages because we had an established family and have a son first, there weren't as many fears. But I think now that she's interacting with the wider world, the fear has heightened, particularly in the last 5 years.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:25]:
    So as you talk about the fear being heightened, what is that fear now?

    Joe Bovell [00:04:29]:
    It's quite significant, particularly because I think as she's getting older and developing and growing into being a woman, I can see the pressures, societal pressures coming on to her to look a certain way, to act a certain way, to like a certain musician, to be accepted in the group. And how her friends and schoolmates actually interact with each other, and how we can escalate so quickly. So if one person doesn't get invited to a party and that person finds out about it, it sets off this chain of events that really, as I say, escalates into something that gets out of control pretty quickly. And I can see the pressure bearing on her, and then that obviously affects me as a father because you have little to no control over it. And I think it's that I can see that building as she's getting older, and that might change or tap out when she gets to 18 or 19. But at the moment, as a 15 year old, to me, it appears to be at its highest.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:22]:
    Now there are definitely highs and lows to fatherhood and parenting. There are good times. There's challenging times. Talk to me about what's been the hardest part about being a father to a daughter?

    Joe Bovell [00:05:35]:
    It's a really good question because I think there's so many layers. But maybe my first reaction is, in a lot of ways, my daughter has a really close relationship with her mom, and I think that's that's vitally important and not as close to to me. So you have to reconcile that that she is gonna do some more things with her mom because the girl thinks, and they're gonna enjoy that exploration together. And maybe a lot of the interest I have don't sort of resonate with her. So I think it's accepting that you have a particular role to play in your daughter's life, and I might necessarily be the friend or the mate that say mom is. It's more the mentor and that type of role. So relationship shifting from that really close bond to we're still close, but it's not not as close as what it was perhaps 5 years ago. Because she's developing and emerging and and forming her own opinions on life.

    Joe Bovell [00:06:25]:
    Right? So I think that's probably the greatest challenge. There's others, of course, but I think that's probably the greatest for me personally as a dad and how I manage that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:33]:
    I know you're a busy guy. You are the CEO and Managing Director at Eco Growth International. And that alone is a very busy job. And then you have your family, you have your other responsibilities, you're balancing a lot of different things, wearing a lot of hats. So talk to me about balance and what you do to be able to be that engaged dad that you wanna be.

    Joe Bovell [00:06:55]:
    Yeah. I think it's about making the most of the time that you have together and having quality rather than quantity. And, look, they've grown up. Steph's grown up with me in this role, you know, half her life. So she's accustomed to me traveling or doing longer working hours or whatever that might be. So that's the norm. I mean, it's pretty normal now when I can go on a trip and she comments and perhaps did I even go away. So and that's not that she didn't miss me, but she's just so used to me not being there.

    Joe Bovell [00:07:23]:
    And I think and that's like, I spoke on her in your earlier question about the bond with her mom is closer because she spends more time with her. So it's a really difficult balance, and I I do I wouldn't say I have an issue with it, but I would challenge the notion of work life balance. I don't I don't think there is. Trying to get that balance, I think, is incredibly difficult. And if you can do that, then I'll take my hat off to you. But I've always gone with the moments that really matter, I want to be there. So be that a school assembly or an award or a presentation or a sporting event, to me, that's vital that I'm there, and work absolutely comes second in those occasions. Work is not everything.

    Joe Bovell [00:08:04]:
    So that's where I try and make that balanced choice. It's go okay. It I don't know. It sounds like prioritization, but it's actually saying what are the moments that really matter and and being engaged in those moments as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:21]:
    Now you and I were connected through Sarah McConachie, who you wrote a piece of her new book in working dads and balancing acts. And in that book, you you talk about the fact that your childhood wasn't the easiest. You had a single mom, you you grew up in poverty and adversity. And that helped as you write in your in your, piece, that it really shaped a sense of resilience in you and a work ethic that remains with you today. And in that you talk about the absence of a father figure in your life. So talk to me a little bit about that absence, and how you push through that when you became a father, to be able to define fatherhood for yourself and to be the father that you wanted to be?

    Joe Bovell [00:09:19]:
    That was certainly my greatest fear, when we found out my wife was pregnant, was what kind of father would I be? Because I had no I had no benchmark. So I I never met my father at all, so there was no relationship whatsoever. I didn't have any male mentors in my life growing up either. Obviously, I was very close to my mother. But I didn't have that I didn't have anything shaping me in terms of being a father. So when my, son was born, I hadn't even held a baby. And when I had friends who had babies, I'd always avoided it because I always felt I was gonna break them if I held them. But, but now yeah.

    Joe Bovell [00:10:09]:
    So moving through that journey, I think you you come back to your own principles of doing what you feel is right. You know that you're gonna make mistakes. I've made I think I've made a lot of mistakes, in my in being a father. And would that have been different if I'd had a father figure in my life growing up? I'm not sure. I always took the position that I was fortunate in not having a father. And the reason I say that because, you know, how many children have, you know, parents who go through divorce or they have a a household that's not safe? And so just because you have a father doesn't necessarily mean it's great. So that was my one of my coping mechanisms, I guess. So I don't know how I became a father.

    Joe Bovell [00:11:02]:
    I just it just it was a lot by accident, and I learned on the job. And I think what what I touched on in the chapter was that I just felt that what I've gone through in my life, I did not want to have that repeated. So that was my guiding light in being a father. And like I said, I'm not perfect, and I do certainly things I do differently. But I think, overall, that was the the guide for me to be the father that I am.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:38]:
    Now I mentioned the fact that in what you wrote, you also talked about growing up in poverty and adversity. How did that shape your perspectives on life and on fatherhood?

    Joe Bovell [00:11:53]:
    On the on the life front, it it it shaped pretty quickly that if you wanted something, you had to go and, work for it. You had to you had to earn it. There was no nothing was gifted, and that you had the choice. So you came to a fork in the road that you could go the right way or the wrong way, or you could choose to stay in poverty, you could choose to be uneducated or not be a nice person, or you can actually choose to be the other way. So go the other way. So and we spoke earlier. My career path and life path hasn't certainly been linear, but it's always been guided by a drive that you can't implant into many people, and my kids don't have it. And I think that's really interesting because I've tried to help build resilience with them.

    Joe Bovell [00:12:43]:
    So it's difficult if you don't suffer adversity to build resilience. They sort of go hand in hand. So that's only shaped everything, and I started work part time when I was 10 years old, which seems pretty foreign there. Back in the early eighties, that wasn't so uncommon. But we because we had no money or, opportunity and you had friends who were doing things that you couldn't do because you couldn't afford them, you didn't have a choice. Do we go and sell newspapers and be able to be part of that or not? And I haven't been out of work since. So and it probably annoys my kids because in some ways, I have an imposter syndrome. Well, I think I do have an imposter syndrome, not in some ways.

    Joe Bovell [00:13:20]:
    And there's a fear of losing what you have, and I'm not sure that'll ever leave me. So I could be a multimillionaire, and I still might feel that it could all be taken away from me tomorrow. So that's good and bad. That certainly goes a great driver, but what it can affect is your ability to enjoy the moment. And I think that's been probably the feedback from my daughter particularly that I'm not enjoying the moment. I'm always thinking a couple of years ahead or I'm thinking about protecting what we have and not enjoying it as much as what we can. As I get older, starting to, loosen up on that a little bit.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:56]:
    Now you mentioned the fact that as you were growing up, you didn't have a father figure. There were no father figures in your life. You were close to your mother, but you had that lack of a father figure. And as you walked into fatherhood, as you mentioned, hadn't held the baby, you thought you were gonna break the baby. You know, you had a lot to learn and that you kind of figured out what being a father was. Who or what did you turn to to be able to model after without having that father figure in your life to be that father that you wanted to be?

    Joe Bovell [00:14:29]:
    I have to say it's my wife. So we had the same commitment to raising a family in a particular way, so we're on the same page. So even at that point, I still didn't have a male mentor. And as you well know, men aren't particularly good at talking to each other or being open in their communication. So dads don't sit around in father's groups like moms do in mother's groups and share their experiences and share helpful advice. Dads almost said it's a badge of honor to not ask for advice, which is not necessarily a good thing. Back in my generation, at least, I think it's improving, and I think there's more content education available to young fathers. So I've had to say my wife because we had a a firm commitment to raising our children in a certain way, and that was the way we wanted to do it.

    Joe Bovell [00:15:15]:
    So no. I didn't actually still at that point have a male influence on my life other than what I read or digested online.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:23]:
    Now you mentioned that in what you wrote that one of the things that you really wanted to do was provide a safe and secure upbringing for your kids, free from the struggles that you faced. So talk to me about how you balanced protecting them while also allowing them to learn and grow from the challenges that they would face as they grew up.

    Joe Bovell [00:15:45]:
    The provision of the safe family unit again, I've gotta give my wife credit for that as well. I I can't claim all of that. I think a lot of that happened in the background and that they weren't necessarily aware of that, and perhaps they got given too much. That's probably one of the other struggles I have. And that is there an overcorrection in providing far too much when, say, you missed out on it and then you wanna make up for that to some degree. So which again is good and bad. It's great to have to been able to have done that for them, but there's also comes an expectation and entitlement, which I don't think is fabulous for helping them in that sense. So and my wife has always spoken about that.

    Joe Bovell [00:16:22]:
    We probably should've peeled that back a little bit. So we achieved what we wanted to do in providing that safe family home, but did we overcorrect and not build resilience and build in a modicum of entitlement and that things might come a little bit too easy. And that's the really difficult part. I think that's been the hardest part for me in parenting. It's been that balancing between giving enough or too much or not enough. And I think sometimes you don't know that till you get to the end, until they get to 18 or 20. You might get little hints along the way, but you might not actually see, say, a sense of entitlement or lack of resilience until they're 16. And is that too late?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:01]:
    Now all of us are not perfect, and we have to learn and grow and become better as we move through fatherhood. What would you say have been some of the strategies that you employed to continuously improve as a dad? And how do you handle setbacks or moments when you feel like you've fallen short?

    Joe Bovell [00:17:21]:
    I think the feedback from the kids is probably the greatest tool, which is an interesting one because as they're developing and forming their own opinions and and they become more vocal in that, you're realizing what your impact has been as a parent. Doesn't mean they're always right though, I gotta say, because their opinions and learnings are based on what they know at that point in time, and they might not be privy to the background information. So I remember reading somewhere or heard somewhere not that long ago that someone said that, you know, how to become a great parent of an 18 year old. And they said, well, I'm not bad, but I don't know how to be the parent of a 19 year old. Because it was the first time they had evolved. And I think that's the learning on the job that I've mentioned earlier that being a dad to a 6 year old is so different to a 15 year old. As we know, it is just radically different. You go from helping them grow and be a a person.

    Joe Bovell [00:18:12]:
    They can start to look after themselves and and teach them the basics of life and to then someone who's then forming really strong opinions on the world and they're forming their own character. And there's inevitable clashes with that, clashes in our deals and philosophies. That's been a challenge. So I think the thing I've learned is that you go from protector and teacher, you need to then become more of a listener than a doer and be more there if they need you rather than being there a 100% of the time. And that's taking me a fair bit of brain power to wrap my head around that because, again, that's probably the biggest challenges of being dead, Particularly for me was you go from the protected provider to actually, we don't need you to do that anymore, dad. Actually, why don't you back off a bit? Because you're actually you've been a security guard all this time. We don't need that. We're finding our own way in the world.

    Joe Bovell [00:19:02]:
    We need you to be there if we need you. So you can feel a bit redundant, but I'll look at that too and say, yeah. But that's part of our job, isn't it? That we're preparing our children for adulthood. And if they should, in some ways, be disconnecting from us, cutting the umbilical cord to a degree, but hope that they come back when they need to.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:20]:
    Now you've kind of talked about this in trying to raise your kids to be prepared for the future. And I know in what you wrote, you talked about wanting your kids to be successful, happy, well balanced. How do you instill those values and aspirations in them while also allowing them to pursue their own paths?

    Joe Bovell [00:19:39]:
    Actions speak louder than words, and I think you need to demonstrate that consistently that you have those values as a person, that you can work and have all these other interests, but you can still dedicate time to your family and be there for when you need them. But balancing that against, and which I touched on earlier, I think that's been the challenge for me. You go, jeez. I'd love it if you guys turned out this way, but the reality is you can maybe try and influence it a little bit, but they're gonna form their own values and opinions and style. So I think the only really way you do that is the little building blocks you put on since they were born and that this is the way we do things around here. So people talk about workplace culture, and there's a home culture as well, where you say, well, this is how we do things, and this is what we stand for, and and hope that the kids can and that's not always right. So that's this is where the challenge comes now that you might believe it's the right way to do something, but maybe it's not. And they have influences outside the household now that, are quite strong.

    Joe Bovell [00:20:37]:
    The school system is I I think, they dedicate a lot of time now to the values and how they wanna be as people when they get to the end of the school journey. So that's certainly that and then their peer group. So I think you can lay the foundation stones and hope that that is the platform that they need, and then they'll top up and put their own icing on the cake.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:56]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve be, Chris. In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Joe Bovell [00:21:03]:
    Satisfying. When was

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:09]:
    the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Joe Bovell [00:21:13]:
    When I saw her become really independent, form strong opinions on a particular issue, and be eloquent in that, and be cognizant of the audience that she was around. And you think, okay, yeah, she's turning into a remarkable woman.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:29]:
    Now if I was to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Joe Bovell [00:21:33]:
    Probably a pain in the ass, I'd suggest, to be honest. I'm pretty motivated and driven, and I struggle with the concept that they might still be in bed at 11 o'clock in the morning. So but I would hope that they would see that I'm committed and motivated and always try and do the right thing.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:48]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Joe Bovell [00:21:50]:
    My kids do. Because we've touched on a journey. You know that there was no manual when we got the child, and it's an interesting journey because we did the prenatal classes, and there's all this attention on the child on the birth. But you know what? There was no education when you got the baby home. So we got home and said, jeez, what do we do now? So that was a real wake up call. So there's no manual. You're learning on the job, and you know you never nail it. So the inspiration is to keep getting better at what you do along their journey.

    Joe Bovell [00:22:20]:
    And the challenge also is that is evolving as they grow into adults. So they're the 2 people who shaped me the most.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:27]:
    Now you've shared a lot about your own journey. You've shared some of the highs, the lows, you've shared thoughts and perspectives and and some ideas as well. As we're finishing up today, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Joe Bovell [00:22:40]:
    I think make the most of every moment. It is incredibly fast that journey from birth to your child being 18. People talk about it, but when you live it, not a day goes past when I don't remember their birth and what that was at that time and the impact it had on us and me individually. And I cannot believe how fast that journey goes. And my advice would be take the time to go to the school assembly, to have the moments with them alone in a park, and go for those walks and have those conversation, to know that it might be the last time you ever get that chance to spend with them. I'm not trying to sound morbid, but you'll never get that time back. And those cutest things when they're at their, school assemblies and they're doing their plays and they're cast as a tree and you've helped paint their costume and that goes so quickly. And then you you're dealing with a 16 year old daughter who's more interested in the friends and and Ariana Grande and all these other influences that those conversations and moments with dad, they will never be the same.

    Joe Bovell [00:23:40]:
    They won't probably be as much as what you had when they were much younger. So cherish every moment that you can because, a, go so quickly, and, b, as they grow into adults, they generally wanna spend less time with you. So make the most of the time that you have because it is gold. That's my advice.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:57]:
    Well, Joey, just wanna say thank you for sharing your journey today. If people wanna find out more about you, is there a good place for them to go?

    Joe Bovell [00:24:04]:
    I'm I'm not a social media king, but I'm sure you can probably find me online. LinkedIn's probably a a good option for me or Facebook. I'd love to hear from people all around the world. That'd be fantastic. And that was my reasoning for doing this was it was slightly cathartic because I did get down in some deep dark places in my chapters. But it's about can I if I can help one person or give just the smallest piece of advice that helps someone, one dad, then my job is done, and I'm really happy with that?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:32]:
    And we've mentioned the book already, but Sarah McConachie has a book that has a number of dads in it. You've heard from a number of the dads already. And Joe is one of the authors from that book, And I encourage you to go and check it out. You can go to workhardparenthard.com.au to find out more and be able to get some more information on the book and read more about Joe's story, as well as many other dad stories that are working to be the best dads that they can be, but also to provide a gender equitable home that allow for that equal role of parents and the work within the home. And that's an important discussion to have and important things to read and to learn about. So, Joe, thank you so much again for being here, and I wish you all the best. If you've enjoyed today's of the dads with daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:38]:
    We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly dads like you. So check it out atfatheringtogether.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week. All geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    We're all in the same boat, And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your AK. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and beat the world.

    Choose them. Be the best dad you can be. You're the best dad you can be.

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  • Doug Veal's Transition: Redefining Roles from Detective to Devoted Dad

    Doug Veal's Transition: Redefining Roles from Detective to Devoted Dad

    · Dads With Daughters

    This week on the Dads with Daughters Podcast, we welcome Doug Veal, a devoted father and past Police Detective. In this episode we dive deep into learning more about Doug's journey and what he had to do to be the dad that he knew that he wanted to be.

    The Pivot to Parenthood

    When Doug Veal discovered he would become a father, the ensuing excitement was matched by an awareness of his wife's heart condition. The joy of fatherhood came with a responsibility to pivot his focus from being a police officer to providing for his family during their medical journey. Veal's decision to take parental leave, an unusual step in law enforcement culture, underscored the emerging shift in parental roles and the importance of being present during critical family moments. Taking leave amid the challenges of a demanding career, Veal showed that fatherhood demanded flexibility, courage, and an unabashed willingness to break from tradition.

    Shaping a Legacy

    Doug Veal's discernment in prioritizing family well-being over career progression serves as a testament to the evolving nature of fatherhood. Inspired by his belief in being a balanced role model and the potential of his children's future, Veal's journey from the force to becoming a stay-at-home dad exemplifies the sacrifice and adaptability required in modern parenting. He advises fathers to be patient and considerate in their interactions with challenges, knowing that these qualities shape their legacy far beyond tangible achievements.

    The Power of Community and Support

    Acknowledging the pressures and complexities associated with his transition, Veal harnessed the support of employee assistance programs and peer support groups to navigate stressful periods. His experiences highlight the crucial role of community in providing different perspectives and shared experiences. Belonging to a network of fathers allows for a collective wisdom that individual experience alone cannot replicate, providing grounding and solidarity in the adventure of fatherhood.

    Maximizing Family

    Time In today's world where work encroaches on personal life, Veal emphasizes the importance of boundary setting. Whether it's outdoor adventures or being present from morning till school time, he urges fathers to maximize quality interactions with their children. Veal's proactive approach to fatherhood—choosing meaningful experiences over work commitments—serves as a powerful reminder to dads about the essence of being present and cherishing fleeting moments.

    Reflecting on Being a Dad

    In the 'fatherhood 5' segment, Veal refers to fatherhood as an adventure while sharing fond memories like his son's merit for respect. His vision for the future is to be seen as fun, involved, and particularly, available. This segment cements the notion that fatherhood is an evolving journey marked by pivotal moments that shape not only the life of the child but also the personal growth of the father.

    You can learn more about Doug's journey as a father in the new book by Sarah Maconachie, Working Dads and Balancing Acts.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down with you, to walk with you on this journey that you're on. And to be honest, you and I are on this same journey together because I've got 2 daughters, you've got daughters, and it's always important to be able to learn from each other and be willing to learn from each other, but also to learn from others to help us to be the dads that we wanna be. And we do that every week by having some great conversations to delve deeper into what it means to be a dad, but also we get to learn from other dads in the journeys that they've been on to be able to help them to be the dads that they've become. And this week we've got another great guest on the show. You might remember that we had a one of our past guests, Sarah McConachie, was on the show just recently talking about her new book that is out called Work Hard, Parent Hard. And she's got books for dads and moms.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:23]:
    And we talked about her book for dads. And from talking to her, I got an opportunity to be able to get connected with some of the dads that she connected with in her book. And today we've got one of those dads with us. Doug Veal is with us, and he's a father of 2 sons. And he's going to talk a little bit about some of his own journey, not only with his 2 sons, some of the journey that he went on to go from working. And I'm not going to share too much yet because we're going to be talking about what he did, but working in the police force to becoming a stay at home dad and working with his dad, taking advantage of time to be there for his kids and and really delving a little bit deeper on that. So I'm really excited to have him on. Doug, thanks so much for being here today.

    Doug Veal [00:02:06]:
    Yeah. Thank you for having me. I'm really excited.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:08]:
    I'm excited to have you here as well. And first and foremost, I love being able to turn the clock back in time. So I wanna go back a couple of years, and I wanna turn the clock back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father. What was going through your head?

    Doug Veal [00:02:24]:
    I've always wanted to be a dad. I was really, really keen, but I wanted to make sure that we were set up in the best position we could be. And that said, we weren't really planning to have kids as early as we did, and I think it was about 6 months after we got married, to be honest. And it was, yeah, just absolute excitement, and then just that moment of going, oh, okay. Now the things are getting serious. Now we need to plan. So it's a pivotal moment, and it was a case of, alright. How do we well, what do we go from here? So I knew that the impact that it was gonna have on my wife and I was gonna be slightly more complicated than just, that overwhelming joy and excitement because my wife had a heart condition, so we needed to look at how that was gonna impact her health and, what that would mean.

    Doug Veal [00:03:12]:
    I think it's the common thing would be, yeah, we had a lot of excitement and a lot of nervousness to go, okay, what happens next? And how do we bring that into our lives?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:20]:
    Now you just brought up, one of the things that I I know that you dealt with very early on and not only through the pregnancy, but into the birth of your first child, which was that your wife did have some health challenges. She had a heart condition and had to have some significant heart surgery after the birth of your first child. So as a part of that, I know that you had to do some pivoting. You had been working as a police officer for many years, doing work with your government as well. Just very involved in the work that you had done in your career. Talk to me about first and foremost, so at the birth of your child and the health issues of your wife, I know that you had to take a more supportive role during your wife's health challenges. And how did that impact your approach to parenting and work life balance?

    Doug Veal [00:04:10]:
    On the lead up, so when Edison was born, he's my my first son. And when he was born, I knew that I'll be taking the time off. I knew that my work was especially replacing the benefits that I had access to allowed me to take that time off, and I took 3 months off. There were some interesting conversations with some detective senior sergeants. At the time, I was working as a detective investigator doing money laundering investigations at state crime level and then moved into corruption invest in a corruption task force. And the discussions initially to take that time off were quite challenging. I was talking to a quite seasoned and, I'd say, old school detective who hadn't really understood the support mechanisms that we like to try and enjoy at the moment. And I'm I'm really glad that we do have access to things such as parental leave.

    Doug Veal [00:05:02]:
    And I'm really glad that we've got access to things like parental leave, and we've got those supports and that the decision making for those to access that leave isn't to your immediate supervisor or to your district. It goes beyond that. It's on a more of a government level because being under that umbrella of a government employee. I think it was access or the pivot. So when Edison came along, I was going to be playing a a large role. I took took that time. It was time that I knew that I would like, but it was also time knowing that my wife had a caesarean section. There was some further support that was needed.

    Doug Veal [00:05:41]:
    So I really cherish that the month after Edison was born, being able to offer that support to be able to get that really good contact and to get to know my son and actually will rewind a little bit immediately after he was born. Well, the birth itself was quite an interesting birth. I think we had 27 people in the room for a cesarean section, which was quite a dramatic affair. So we had the normal surgery team. We had NICU people because Edison was slightly premature because there was some complications, and then we had a full cardio surgery team on standby to have given a 30% chance that my wife would have a cardiac event immediately following the delivery. So Edison was born, cried, and it was the best thing I'd ever heard, followed by the most scared I've ever been because now came the danger period. So after delivery, Edison went to the NICU and my wife, Nicola, went to the ICU. And I was in an interesting position I hadn't really planned for because do I walk one way or do I go the other way? Do I go to where my wife was or do I go to where my new child was? And I'm not gonna say we're trying no.

    Doug Veal [00:06:55]:
    I went I went, to where my son was and making sure that I could jog between the 2 because they were all housed in the same hospital. So that really cemented to me that I needed to take that time to make sure that us as a family unit, we're gonna be having the healing that we needed to be able to get through the next stages. So after 3 months, I did go back to work. And then knowing that after a few months, Nicola would need to have that heart surgery. So I ended up having open heart surgery. Again, that put me in a position of having an extended period of leave. And then almost it was 6 months to the day after the heart surgery, we fell pregnant with our second son, Terrence. That's quite funny.

    Doug Veal [00:07:38]:
    I can pinpoint the exact moment. One of them we found out and second of when the dirty deed happened because I was in between army training blocks, and I only came home for a weekend, which is quite an interesting little time peg, to be honest. But it's been quite the journey on the health front and the children front. But as far as making the decision or my decision to to leave placing, there was a few things that had occurred throughout the first pregnancy that I was slightly uncomfortable with as far as decision making and my ability to be able to invest what I normally do, which would be about 60 to 80 hour week because there's exactly what we're doing now. Part of the investigations were overseas. It was a case of you can't let off on the tempo when you're fully involved in an investigation. I wasn't in a position that I wanted to continue doing that. It was a choice that I made to take a step back.

    Doug Veal [00:08:36]:
    It's not something that I could've continued down that path in my current career choice. So I'm just saying I'd have to take my foot off the gas on the detective front. My transition to back to uniform. I was promoted after my leave, which was quite good. It was saying that was quite important to me knowing that I could access those entitlements and then that not having a lasting impact on my career after being warned by my detective senior sergeant that it would have an impact. It was quite good that it wasn't the case. However, a 3 panel roster is unforgiving for anyone else out in the law enforcement community and just shift work generally. Knowing that I did have weeks when my boys were quite young not seeing them, because we would have a, you know, starting a shift at 4 PM and then coming home at 2 o'clock to sleep until 10.

    Doug Veal [00:09:28]:
    It's not really a family friendly roster. So there was too much impetus on my career at the time, and that needed to change.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:36]:
    I appreciate you sharing that. Now, one of the things you just talked about was the fact that, you know, as a police officer, there's a culture, there's a expectation in regards to the work that you're required to do and probably some old school mentality versus new school mentality as it comes to thinking about parenting and being present in your kids' lives. You've mentioned the fact that you took some extended parental leave as you were a police officer, and that might not have been the norm at the time in regards to what you were doing. What motivated you to prioritize family time and to set your career on the back seat for yourself as you were focusing and putting the effort on your family versus the career at the time?

    Doug Veal [00:10:28]:
    Yeah. And I think this gets to the heart of the issue of of that balance. I've always had quite strong role models. So I looked at how my father was and the parts that I wanted to emulate and then the parts that I didn't wanna emulate, knowing that he's human like everyone. There's there's part, and he was a different situation. But looking at how I could shape my situation and knowing I had access to those lives, but also knowing that I get to shape the reality for my children. Parents have such a large influence about especially early on in what you can expose your kids to, how you can show value, how you can demonstrate those or model behaviors. That you know that your 2 year old, your 3 year old, your 5 year old's gonna emulate.

    Doug Veal [00:11:14]:
    So really wanting to set that strong role model and give them a balanced perspective. It's not about just being a champion or being an ideal or just a figure. So I look at who I've looked up to and which leaders and things that I've gone, oh, I wanna be like that person, and then started to really look down and go, well, I like them for 1 attribute or 2 attributes or a behavior, not across a set of behaviors. So I really knew that I needed to balance out and not just be one one figure. So and I think a turning point came to me, and it was an interesting one. I think it hit quite hard. So I got my army photos, and I've got my policing photos, and some parts where I've been at training, and some parts where I've done some other tactical training. And boys being boys, fascinated with guns.

    Doug Veal [00:12:08]:
    And then I had my 3 year old come up to me and ask me, basically, oh, so you're a policeman. You shoot people. And I was like, oh, this is a very difficult conversation, knowing that it's a touchy subject. And I'm not gonna go too much into that subject in this podcast. However, it was something that made me reflect and go, I need to really broaden the exposure or or how I present and to set that example for my children.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:35]:
    Now I know that in what you wrote in Sarah's book, you talked about the importance for you to access support through that journey for yourself being away from work, but also being present at home. Can you talk to me about the support services that you did take advantage of? I know you talked in your writing about employment assistant programs. How did seeking professional help contribute to your well-being during those stressful times that you were having, whether it be at work or at home?

    Doug Veal [00:13:09]:
    I've used the employee assistance program a number of times, and when I was able to engage it during the stress that we felt over the, pregnancy and through early childhood, it was a a huge benefit. It's like that I was able to go with Nicola and talk through some of the issues and talk through some of the difficulties that we're facing and trying to really put it in perspective. So looking at larger health concerns, we had a period where we bounced from crisis to crisis and where we actually struggled wasn't in the crisis times. It was in the periods of slightly less crisis because the priorities weren't quite as clear, yet there was still an enormous amount of things to be done. So accessing that support was really helpful in setting those priorities, talking through some things, and then getting beyond the immediate with some of the future planning. Another really good support that we've got, and I'm not sure if it's as prevalent in the US as it is in Australia. We've got dads groups, which are normally a Facebook group and you meet up at a park and it really grounds the fatherhood experience. You look at it and you go, oh, and it takes the edge off of what, yeah, the larger issues because you find out that there's 15, 20 different ways to deal with the same thing.

    Doug Veal [00:14:28]:
    For an example, Edison had clubfoot when he was born, and that was such an interesting experience, especially when I was I was taking that time off from work. I'll be taking Edison around the shops, And I'll get people stuff and go, oh, such a good dad and things of that nature. And he was on in a cast and things at that time, which was an interesting experience. And then I'll go out with my wife, and we'll get it just wasn't the same experience for her. It was always questions about how he broke his leg. And it's like, he hasn't broken his leg. So it was concerns about parenting so much more with my wife. And when I was out there, it was a conversation piece.

    Doug Veal [00:15:09]:
    So there was nothing but praise, which I found quite odd. Not saying take advantage and have some interesting conversations and enjoy it, but there was a big difference in the way that even saying it as small as going to the shops, the impact that that had. So talking through parts of that. And also I ended up joining a mother's group because I was the primary carer when Edison came. And I was sharing some experiences because my family had fostered for a large period of time. So I've always had kids in the house and quite young kids, which set me up a little bit, quite well for dealing with my kids. However, it's a completely different experience. I think we ended up in the mid nineties as far as the children that came for short stay through our house.

    Doug Veal [00:15:56]:
    So we had a range of different children with different backgrounds and experiences that we've worked through. So, yeah, quite interest. So back to the mother's group. So we were talking and we're sharing some experiences, and I could see that there were some people in the group that were getting quite fatigued and their resilience was quite down. And that was one of the huge benefits that we had with both of us being off work at the time or both of us being able to take some time off is that we could really get into some shift work and that wasn't a stranger for me. So I didn't mind doing some night shifts every so often. So going through the mother's grief and just trying to bring a bit of a calming influence of, yes, it will pass. There's a limited amount of things that the baby's going to be crying for and trying to bring something that I understand to be really quite an emotional experience down to, okay, hungry, wind, wet nappy.

    Doug Veal [00:16:49]:
    Like there's normally a finite amount of things that can be checked and monitored so we can, yeah, hopefully stop the crying for a bit and give you that 4 hour window of a little bit of sleep. It all changes after the second one, which I'm sure that your listeners are aware. Sleep when the baby sleeps is really good advice until you got 2, and then it's when it's just a challenge.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:11]:
    Yeah. Especially in those early years, you definitely go through that zombie period where you don't know what ends up and you're going on so little sleep. And and when I talk to people that are like, oh, my kids slept all the time. And I'm like, oh, I wish that I would had been the case. Because that's not always the case.

    Doug Veal [00:17:27]:
    No. No. It's not. And, yeah, some people, they need to know it's normal and it does end. It does end. But, yes, I remember there was a period, I think it was about the 4 month mark with Terrence, my second son. Well, I didn't want to go to bed. I knew that as soon as I go to bed, it's just going to be interrupted.

    Doug Veal [00:17:45]:
    I'd rather push through. And it was really challenging for about a month or 2 months. That period of sleep progression that was unfortunately teed up with, I think, with potty training with Edison. So there was just a lot of things going on, a lot of washing and not much sleep.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:01]:
    Now I know one of the things that you and especially regarding family time. For you, how do you ensure that your work commitments don't encroach upon those boundaries?

    Doug Veal [00:18:20]:
    Well, I'm lucky enough at the moment. So I'm currently an assistant director working for a federal agency. So most of the people who I supervise so the eastern states shut down. They're 3 hours ahead. So I've got a great flexibility in how I set my work schedule up, which is really quite handy. But with my boundaries, I really look to how I can maximize my interaction time with with my kids. So after work is kids' time. So you'll rarely find me on the phone after 5 o'clock my time.

    Doug Veal [00:18:53]:
    If the sun's out, we're going to the park. If it's good weather, we're outside. If it's not great weather, we've got a I don't know how many of your listeners are gonna be Bluey fans, but we've got that big green shed hammer barn, which is called Bunnings. They've actually got a playground in them. So we'll go to Bunnings for a bit. So school time, family time. Weekends, it's gonna be fishing, camping, going on adventures, taking the 4 wheel drive out. And I don't expect sleep ins, to be quite brutally honest.

    Doug Veal [00:19:23]:
    So it's a thing of the past. I was half when I wrote my chapter, I was happy with 1 every week, but like I'm just gonna say, if I'm not watching the sunrise or if I'm in bed after 6, then there's probably something wrong. No. It's good. I've got 2 young boys who are eager to start the day, and I'm eager to start it with them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:42]:
    That's amazing. Now I know that one of the things that you wrote about too, and some of this goes back down to what you said earlier that you were working 60 to 80 hours a week. Your job was taking you to many different places. But I know travel also seemed to be a recurring theme in your life. How would you say that your global experiences influence your parenting approach and your child's upbringing?

    Doug Veal [00:20:08]:
    I've really enjoyed traveling. I've been lucky enough to get out and about. I've done 6 out of the 7 continents for a month or more. COVID kind of put a really quite a big dampener on international travel. So when the restrictions ended, I jumped at the opportunity to take my boys and go to London to visit their uncle or my brother. So we went off to London. So there's a direct flight from Perth to London. It's a 17 hour flight, and I think I'm just gonna rename that the challenge.

    Doug Veal [00:20:43]:
    I think it was the better of 2 evils to be quite fair. I don't think a 8 hour flight and then a stopover and then another 10 hour flight or 12 hour flight would have really been any easier. But I'm set on giving my kids a series of experiences that's gonna round them out quite well. There's 7,000,000,000 people in the world. No one's got it completely right. We can learn by, well, one, getting out into our neighborhood, but then going beyond our neighborhood and looking for those different experiences and meeting different people. Yeah. London was a really interesting experience.

    Doug Veal [00:21:16]:
    They're not set up for Australian sized prams over in the UK. So, yeah, the footpaths aren't pram friendly. So my wife joined me for the first couple of weeks and then took a nice relaxing flight home. I soloed outed over in, yeah, a very, very busy city for a few weeks after that and tried to really give them the experience. I think it was more for me. I'm satisfied that it's more for me going to museums and galleries, but some really good photos. And even when they've had enough, I'll take a photo. I've got a really, really good one of Terrence in front of Van Gogh's Sunflowers where he's decided that he doesn't wanna play anymore at the National Gallery in London.

    Doug Veal [00:22:00]:
    And, yeah, it takes a while to get out of those places. And especially when the the more quiet it is, I don't know, they seem to hide the exits. We did the same in the National Library trying to get our escape route. But then slowly after we got some good experiences, we hit the parks. We hit the parks pretty hard. The boys love slides. So, yeah, from everywhere, from Axbridge to London Bridge, I think we've done every single one of those packs.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:26]:
    Very fun. Now, I guess, as we finish up today, what advice would you give to fathers who are similarly navigating the complexities of career advancement while at the same time trying to strive to be that actively engaged dad that they wanna be.

    Doug Veal [00:22:46]:
    Well, I know that I'm no expert have what you would like to do and the impact that that's gonna have. You get one run at it, so I would choose the things that last. So and that's one of the reasons that I've, in my balance, I'm probably tilted slightly more to the family side. I love my career. I'm quite particular in the steps that I take. However, I know that I'm a dad first, and that's really quite a large change. Having always been a police officer. I've been that for over a decade, having that as a large personality, trait to making that shift, especially when my kids came along.

    Doug Veal [00:23:32]:
    Life's full of choices. Some have much larger impacts and impacts that you're not aware of. And that's forefront in my mind when I'm looking at how I'm raising kids. But it's one of those thing that it's a privilege. It's at times overwhelming, but it's an adventure. So there's gonna be some great bits, some funny bits, some sad bits, scary bits, but some brilliant moments. So lean into it and enjoy the ride.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:02]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready? Yep. In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Doug Veal [00:24:11]:
    Adventure.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:12]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father?

    Doug Veal [00:24:16]:
    That would have been about oh, it was last week. Edison fur oh, so he's going to school, 1st year in school, and he got a merit certificate in the 1st assembly for respect. So I was, yeah, a real proud dad moment.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:33]:
    Now I know your kids are young right now, but if I was to talk to them, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Doug Veal [00:24:40]:
    Depends on what we were doing immediately before. I think Edison would describe me as fun, and he would describe me as always wanting to give it a go. There's not too many projects that we haven't tried. We definitely take on some projects and give it a red hot crack. So, yeah, I'm gonna stick with give it a go.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:01]:
    And as you think 10 years down the road, what do you want them to say then?

    Doug Veal [00:25:05]:
    Available. If it was one word, they'd be available. Looked at different ways and behaviors that I'm gonna try or that I've brought in and values that I have about getting involved in community and service, and that's not military service. It's community service. So one of the ways I'm doing it at the moment is as a volunteer firefighter. Yeah. I find that I want to be able to impart those things. However, the one thing that I would like to resonate with them is availability.

    Doug Veal [00:25:34]:
    If they need me, I'm gonna be there.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:37]:
    Who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Doug Veal [00:25:38]:
    The cliche is my dad. So to a large part, it's that, but they do. So it's the dichotomy. It's they do because they are an absolute ball of potential, and their future future is not written. And it's my job to be able to assist, shape that. I can't control it. I can't do it all, But I'm gonna give it a really red hot crack in making sure that we get the best results we can.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:05]:
    And as we and finally, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Doug Veal [00:26:11]:
    Patient. You shouldn't be able to be wound up by your 3 year old or 5 year old or probably even your 10 year old. You're gonna get wound up by your 16 year old, but but I think that's a slightly different different area. But, yeah, patience. The problem isn't the problem. It's how we interact with the problem.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:29]:
    Well, Doug, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your journey today. If people wanna read more about you in Sarah's book or find more about you, where should they go?

    Doug Veal [00:26:40]:
    Yeah. So I can go to workhardparenthard.com.au. You can find the books there. We've touched on some really cool things in this, but there's a fair few more things that we can you can read about. And there's, yeah, tons more people adding their experience to it. So, yeah, it's it's quite an exciting venture.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:59]:
    Well, Doug, thank you for being here, and I appreciate you sharing your journey, and I wish you all the best.

    Doug Veal [00:27:06]:
    Excellent. Thank you very much.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:07]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:05]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast, the time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and beat the world to them. Dad you can be.

  • Recognizing Dads' Role in Raising Daughters: Building Bonds and Nurturing Independence With Sarah Maconachie

    Recognizing Dads' Role in Raising Daughters: Building Bonds and Nurturing Independence With Sarah Maconachie

    · Dads With Daughters

    Fatherhood and Active Participation

    In this week's Dads with Daughters podcast we got to speak with Sarah Maconachie, a mindset coach and author, the focus was on the importance of active fatherhood in raising empowered daughters. In our conversation, Sarah emphasized the need for dads to be actively involved in their daughters' lives and the significance of being present, supportive, and open in their journey towards raising independent and strong women. Sarah shared her experiences and insights from her own upbringing and her work in advocating for equal parenting roles. Her perspectives shed light on the transformative power of involved fatherhood and the impact it can have on daughters' development.

    Challenging Stereotypes and Biases

    Sarah Maconachie's experiences and the stories she shared in her book, "Working Dads and Balancing Acts," challenge traditional stereotypes and biases related to parenting roles. Her emphasis on breaking norms that confine fathers to being solely providers and not nurturing caregivers is a powerful message for dads and their involvement in their daughters' lives. It serves as a reminder that stereotypes and gender biases should not dictate the roles that fathers play in their children's lives.

    The Impact of an Involved Father

    One of the key takeaways from Sarah's insights is the immense impact of an involved father in a child's life. She highlighted the emotional support, presence, and active participation of her own father, emphasizing how it shaped her and her sisters, propelling them toward successful and fulfilling lives. This perspective underscores the pivotal role fathers play in instilling confidence, self-esteem, and strength in their daughters. It also reflects the idea that fatherhood goes beyond providing financial stability and encompasses emotional, mental, and social support crucial for their daughters' growth.

    Encouraging Open Communication

    Sarah's recollections of her father being a pillar of support during emotional upheavals and difficult phases is a testament to the significance of open communication within the parent-child relationship. Her father's approachability and willingness to engage with his daughters on a personal level created a secure environment for them to express their emotions and seek guidance. This highlights the importance of open dialogues and nurturing an environment where daughters feel comfortable confiding in their fathers. It's an essential aspect of fatherhood that fosters trust and empowers daughters to overcome challenges and become resilient individuals.

    Shifting the Paradigm

    The insightful conversation between Dr. Christopher Lewis and Sarah Maconachie outlined the need to challenge the existing societal norms and inspire a shift in the paradigm of fatherhood. Sarah's determination to make a change in the space of working parents and advocating for equal parenting roles stands as a beacon for shifting the traditional perceptions of parenting. Her work and dedication are geared towards creating a world where fathers are equally recognized as nurturing caregivers, capable of fostering their daughters' dreams, ambitions, and well-being.

    As you absorb Sarah's narrative, it becomes evident that empowering dads to be present, engaged, and supportive in their daughters' lives is a critical factor in building a generation of empowered women. Sarah's encouragement for dads to prioritize spending time with their children reinforces the idea that every moment invested in their daughters' lives profoundly impacts their growth and development.

    In this episode I found that Sarah Maconachie's insights brought to light the necessity of active fatherhood in shaping strong, independent women. Her work not only encourages dads to be present, nurturing, and communicative but also challenges societal norms, promoting gender equality in parenting roles. The takeaways from the podcast serve as a compelling call to action for dads to actively engage in their daughters' lives, fostering an environment where girls can thrive and reach their full potential.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, I love being on this journey that you and I are both on to find ways to be able to be the best dads that we can be, to raise our daughters to be those strong, independent women that we want them to be. And I know, you know, it's not always easy. It there's not Oh, there's going to be bumps in the road. There's going to be times where you are going to hit your head up against the wall, and you're gonna say, oh, my gosh. There has to be a better way. And that's why this podcast is here is to give you resources, allow for you to meet other people, learn from other people, and gain some insights into the journey that they are on as parents, but also learn from them in regards to the journey that they're on in raising daughters or in finding other resources that are out there that can help you to do just that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:20]:
    Every week, I love being able to bring you different guests, different people that have different things that they can share with you. Sometimes it's mom, sometimes it's dads. You know, there's people from across lots of different spectrums. And I am so happy that you come back every week and take a listen in to learn to be a little vulnerable and be willing to open yourself up to learning as well. This week, we've got another great guest with us. Sarah McConachie is with us today. And Sarah is a mindset coach for parents. She is an author.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:55]:
    She has a brand new book that we're gonna be talking about called Working Dads and Balancing Acts. And don't all of us sometimes feel like we're balancing stuff and trying to work day to day and and trying to balance this thing called fatherhood. And when I saw that she had written this book, I definitely wanted to have her on to be able to talk not only about the book, but about her own journey in being a mother to a daughter as well and to kids to be able to bring that perspective in as well. Sarah, thanks so much for joining us today.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:02:27]:
    Hi. And thank you so much for having me. I'm very excited to be on here.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:31]:
    I'm really excited to have you on as well. You know, one of the things that I would love to do before we even jump into the concept of this book that you wrote. So you are a mother of 2 girls and you're a female yourself. I know what it's like to raise daughters myself and what it was like as a father. But for you jumping in to being a mother of daughter, what was going through your head? And I know your oldest is a daughter, so that was your first. Talk to me about that journey for you. And what did you have to do to either prepare yourself to be a mother to a daughter, or what were the surprises that came with it that you didn't expect?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:03:06]:
    That's a really good question. I was very excited to have a daughter. I'm one of 3 girls and I had a great upbringing and I love my sisters. And so I was excited to have a girl because I was excited to potentially have what I had when I was growing up. And I think as a female as well, I'm a very determined lady, as are my sisters. All 3 of us have really done very well in life. We've got really good careers, and I'm a bit of a feminist from that perspective. I love gender equality, and I was quite excited to raise a strong, powerful girl.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:03:44]:
    I have to say that really excited me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:47]:
    So talk to me a little bit about your own father. And you said you had a great upbringing. And you and your sisters definitely were given some things to help you to spread your wings, to be able to become the people that you are today. What did your father do specifically that you feel helped to pave the way for you to become the person that you are today?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:04:09]:
    The biggest thing, he was present. He was very present. He absolutely adores us all. He absolutely adores his 3 girls. He's a very blokey bloke. My dad. He's a sportsman. He played rugby, golf, squash.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:04:24]:
    You name it. He played it. So for him, I think he always wanted boys because the natural, you know, you want the sport, you want this and then the other. And he had 3 girls and it was probably the best thing for him. We all love something that he relates to, so he's got one that loves rugby, and he watches rugby with her. My other sister and I did lots of athletics and did lots of sport ourselves. So he got to do that with us. And the most important thing for him, though, was he was there.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:04:52]:
    He was a teacher, so he was at home at dinner time. And my memories of growing up were of us altogether. My dad was very, very present and he was just as involved as my mum was. And he supported us a lot when we went through breakups, boyfriends, friends, this, that and the other. It was actually our dad that we went to because he's a very soft person in that respect, and he was really lovely and really approachable from those emotional rollercoasters that we went on. He was really good at dealing with it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:25]:
    So talk to me a little bit about you said that when those big emotional times came, you went to your father. And that's not always the case in every in every situation and every family dynamic. So what was it that your dad did to allow for you to feel that he was the person that you could go to when those things came up that opened that door for communication, for dialogue, for you to feel safe to go To him in those moments of need,

    Sarah Maconachie [00:05:57]:
    just always, he would always bring it up with us. I mean, mom would know what was going on because moms know everything and she would obviously talk to my dad and then he would come to us and say, this is happening. He'd give us a big hug and he would just tell us that everything would be okay. And it's just a phase in our life and that we have to go through these things. And he was just really caring and really supportive. And he would come to us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:24]:
    Now from all of this work that your father did in helping you and your sisters to become who you are today, I'm sure that as you grew and flew out of the nest, you and I talked before this, you you've been a world traveler and you have really explored. So talk to me about you leave England, you go to the United States, you end up in Australia. What's the one piece of advice that he gave you that you hold on to today that you look back on and say that was so meaningful?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:06:59]:
    The biggest thing was for me, and it's not actually that long ago, moving to Australia. Obviously my mom very upset because I was actually really close. Well, I still am. I've always been very, very close to my mum. I was always the mommy's girl and I'm the one that flew the nest. So she's always struggled with it, understandably. And they came to Australia when I had first met my husband, I think. And I think they could finally see that I was settled, and I've met a lovely man.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:07:30]:
    And I think that was a big factor for them. And my dad just loved it here. He absolutely loved it. And I just remember having a chat with him over a few drinks where all the good conversations happen, and he said, I'm just so happy that you're happy. And as long as you're happy, it doesn't matter where you are or what you're doing. I just can see the happiness in you. And for me, that's all I need. And that's always stuck with me because it's true and that's what I would want for my children.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:07:58]:
    You just want them to be happy. And although it sacrifices my parents' happiness with me being this far away to a degree, I think that, you know, my dad's able to really remove himself to a degree and be like, I just want you to be happy. And that's all that matters.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:14]:
    Now earlier today, you talked about that you see yourself as a feminist. You're raising daughters now. Talk to me about what did your dad do to support that feminism that you have within yourself? But also, what are you doing to now encourage your own kids? And they're young, and maybe you're not doing that much yet. But what do you hope to do as they get older to inspire that same sense of feminism in them as they get older?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:08:42]:
    Look, as I sort of outlined, both of my parents were always very supportive of whatever we wanted to do. I mean, I'm a big dreamer and my mum and dad will often roll their eyes at me and be like, here we go again. But I always achieve what I've say, what I've said I'm going to go out and do. So now the eye rolling has gone down a little bit. But with all 3 of us, they were just supportive of our hopes and dreams. They, you know, encouraged us to go to university. They encouraged us to do what we wanted to do. That was gonna whatever was gonna make us happy.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:09:13]:
    They encouraged us to do it, And they gave us good boundaries to make sure we stayed on the straight and narrow. And they both just really raised us to follow our dreams and to do what it was that we wanted to do to make us happy. I think that's the same for me. It's about being able to really express those personality traits that are hard in children, but actually are going to be magical when they're adults. And I notice this with my own daughter, My eldest in particular is very defiant. She really likes to think she rules the roost in this house. And to be honest, she probably does, But she also goes through the city and says, mom, when I grow up, I want to work at the on the top floor of the biggest building. And I'm like, you know what, girl, you go for it.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:10:00]:
    And she's very determined. She's going to win her kindy carnival. She is only getting A's. She asked me recently, what happens when you get an f? I don't even know where she's got this from. And I was like, well, you know, it doesn't matter. And she was like, it won't matter anyway, mom, because I'll only get As. She's 4. The determination of this child is just outrageous.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:10:21]:
    But, you know, instead of trying to squash that, I try and manage her expectations. But I also am like, you know what? If you've got the determination to go out and get it, then go and get it. I'm not gonna squash that because it's a really great trait to have.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:36]:
    Now I mentioned the fact that you have a new book that's out called Working Dads and Balancing Acts, and you have another book that called Working Mothers Inspiring Others, but specifically about this book about fathers. And I guess first and foremost, I I love to get the origin stories. As an author myself, I know how much time and effort and passion have to go into the creation of these books. And it takes a lot of time and effort and planning and passion to be able to get to that finish line so that you can get that out into the world. What was it about this topic that really inspired you to want to write this and get this out into the world?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:11:23]:
    I need to try not to ramble on for too long when I answer this because it comes from a big piece. So the way that I was raised, as I said, I was raised in a very equal house. And I think that even for my generation, that's quite rare. I remember having a conversation with my sister. I started blogging and writing a lot around working parents, but I wrote a lot about dads as well as moms because I just think that there's so much out there for mothers, but there's just not enough for dads. And there's there's not really a voice for dads, I felt, that really depicted the change in society and the way that things are changing. So I was having this conversation with my sister and I was like, oh, it's really funny that all 3 of hers are in very equal relationships. Our husbands are very involved with our children.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:12:11]:
    It's very fiftyfifty in the way that we parent. And in studying mindset, it really does go back to that belief system and how you're raised and that programs, how you then raise your own children and the way that you sort of deliver your own life is very much to do with the environment that you are raising yourself. So all 3 of us have really replicated the way that we were raised, which is amazing. And so we were kind of talking about it and I was like, but it just seems so easy that we are so equal in our household, in our relationship. But I also feel like that's because we're such strong females. We communicate what it is that we need our husbands to do as husbands and as fathers. And that communication piece and that learning piece really has enabled us to foster those relationships and that equality for our own children as well. So it kind of evolved from that, and that way of thinking that I was thinking more and more about dad, particularly in the workplace.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:13:18]:
    I'm very passionate about working as a mum and being able to create that balance. And I went through a process that I think a lot of mums do go through where I took a job that was really junior and about a quarter of what I'd previously been earning so that I could have flexibility to be able to look after my children as well as have a career. And as I went through a mindset journey myself and I really regained my own purpose, my own worth, and what it is that I needed for me, I realized how much that actually occurs, especially in women. But to solve the problem with that, there needs to be also work for dad. It needs to be a double edged sword. You can't just say, here you go, women are mothers in the workplace. Here's all the things for you, flexible working, whatever it is that you need. What are you also doing for dads for them to be able to take that load, which many dads actually want to do anyway, and to be able to really create that balance so that women can be doing that working and parenting, but so can dads.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:14:28]:
    So it really stemmed from that view, and I just decided to write these books. It just came out of nowhere to be honest, and I was like, I just want stories from mums and dads of their journeys that will help to support and provide advice and guidance for other moms and dads out there that want to work and have that balance of being a parent as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:53]:
    Now I know in the book you talk to fathers and you talk to a number of different fathers. Talk to me about some of the biggest takeaways as you were talking to them that you incorporated into the book that you hope that people are going to be taking out of reading the book itself?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:15:12]:
    Well, the chapters are directly from the dads themselves. So they have shared completely their own stories, which is amazing because it's different voices and it's completely their journeys, which I love. So there's a few things in there that are real takeaways for me. There's one who came who didn't have a father who came from a really difficult upbringing and his journey of trying to navigate fatherhood when he had no role model himself, is really incredible and really moving, but also he shares so much emotion around what he didn't share in terms of his own journey and how scared he was to become a dad because he just didn't know what that looked like and what that was as a role. So that was one real key aspects that I loved. Another one is a partner of a big law firm, and he shares a story which really, I had this conversation with him and it really sparked me wanting to write the dad's book. So he was telling me how his 2 boys he's a partner in a big law firm, so he would leave before the boys were up and was home after they went to bed in the week because he worked such long hours. And he was home for 2 consecutive days once and he was putting his boys, one of his younger boys, to bed, who was about 7 I believe at the at the time, and the boy was like what are you doing? Like why are you here? And he was like what do you mean? I'm your dad, I live here.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:16:41]:
    And he was like yeah but you don't. Like I know that you come and sleep with mum some in the week, but, like, you don't live here. I thought you just came at weekends. And he was like he cried. He was like, he's dagger to his heart and it made him realize the effects that this was having on his children. And he literally changed that day and made sure he didn't leave until the boys had gone to school in the morning. He made a change that the very next day and he's never stepped back. So there's that and there's, and then there's the stories of those, of dads that wanting to stay at home and have let their wives really thrive in their careers.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:17:23]:
    Like, there's such an eclectic mix of stories in there. It's it's just so inspiring to hear the different journeys and the challenges that different people face, but how they overcome it. And it's really, it's a reminder of how important it is to be present as a dad. There's a lot of older ish generation that didn't have paternity leave, that didn't take any paternity leave, and that look back and really regret that. So I think it's a really nice reminder that it's so important to be present because you do not get those years back. And that's really, for me, the crux of the of the book and the stories that are delivered is it's just so essential to be part of your children's lives and work and everything else comes second. So, you know, if you've got that choice, make it a good one.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:15]:
    So talk to me about, as you walked into the writing of this book, you talked to a lot of these fathers. Did you walk in with any preconceived notions that were shattered by what you heard and what was shared with you?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:18:29]:
    Not really. I think the journeys and the chapters and stories that have been shared were really as I ice age of, oh, well, you know, my wife does everything and, you know, that's fine, each their own. But it's really still apparent today and there's still a lot of work to be done, I think, in order to shift those stereotypes and biases of what dads and what fatherhood looks like. So for me, the book lived up to everything that I wanted from it. It's really created the stories, the journeys, and the challenges that I really wanted to highlight because it also has the flip side of regret or whatever that falls with those aspects of not prioritizing your family. So it delivers the right message, but it really fulfilled exactly what I wanted from it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:28]:
    And as you end the writing of this specific book, are there other questions? Are there other things that came out at the end where you said, I need to delve into this more?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:19:40]:
    Oh, yeah. Well, look, it's really spurred my passion even more. So I was working in the mindset space for the last few years, but it's made me so determined to make a change in the space of working parents. So I'm now focusing I've created a program for working parents across workplaces. So it's for dads and moms, and it's really enabling them to create a mindset that allows them to have more balance, have purpose, to create all those aspects that we do lose a little bit when we become a parent because we naturally prioritize our children. But prioritizing our children is a given, but we have to look after ourselves because we are the role models of our children. So the better versions that we are of ourselves, the better versions that our children are. So the book has really spurred me to make a difference, to be honest.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:20:39]:
    So I am determined to get into every corporate organization that I can find for them to be implementing support for parents that are working, because I just think it's essential for the growth of our children and the next generation. We are raising the future of employees, so we need to be the best version of us so that we're raising what we want as the next generation. So it's made me very determined to make a change.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:09]:
    I know every country is a little bit different when it comes to looking at things like paternity leave and and allowing for equal access to that special time, especially when your children are first born. How are you having those conversations with businesses? And what do you say to fathers that are working in companies right now that are not supportive of that, of how they can advocate or try to start those conversations within their own companies.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:21:39]:
    Well, actually one of the chapters in my book is from the CEO of Clough, which is a big mining organization. And his name is Peter Bennett. And so I worked for Clough after I had my first daughter and I left because it was like a clock watch. They it was like you had to be at your desk till 4:30 and I had this horrendous guilt and I just needed to leave because I wanted to pick her up and blah blah blah. So I ended up leaving. And I've had this conversation with Peter because he's actually since this was, I mean, 3 years ago or whatever, but since then, he's actually been one of the leaders for gender equity and for implementing all these changes for paternity leave in Clough. So within the last 2 years, not one man had taken paternity leave in that organization ever, which I just think is crazy. So now he's up there and now 50% of men have taken paternity leave within the last 2 years and are taking longer extended leave to spend time with their families and things like this.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:22:47]:
    So there's actually an incredible uptake for this in WA in particular, and it's been really well driven. There's a organization, CEOs for Gender Equity, and they are driving all this change. And especially with regards to paternity leave and maternity leave and it just being leave. It doesn't matter whether you're the mum or the dad, all, benefits for employees are equalized and you take it as, as you please. So there's a lot of that going on in WA in particular, which is amazing, but there is still a long way to go with a lot of organisations as well. So my advice, if you were in that situation where you're in an organization that is not supporting it, I would go with evidence. I would go with the research that proves and shows how important it is for dads to be present within their children's lives, for them to bond with their children in those early days for the support that's needed for moms. Like, it's just crazy to me how some organizations don't offer that.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:23:54]:
    I had a c section and twins. If my husband hadn't had 6 weeks off, I do not know what I would have done. I needed him home. It wasn't an option. I had to have him there. So it's really about being able to be realistic about this and just have those open and honest conversations. And you know what? There's lots of organizations that are doing it. So if your company won't do it, look for jobs elsewhere because they don't deserve to have you as an employee, in my opinion, if they are not supporting you from a parenting perspective.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:28]:
    Now you just mentioned the fact that people should look for the research that shows the importance of fathers and the engagement of fathers. If a dad that's listening is saying, I don't know where to start, where should they start? Where should they start to find that information to be able to get that information to use to start having those conversations?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:24:49]:
    A lot of the fathering groups. So Fathering Together, the Fathering Project, which is across Australia, just Google it, and you'd be able to find a lot of research on their podcasts. There's so many resources out there for dads now. It's just about digging a little deep to make sure you get it. But fathering groups, for me, that's where I get a lot of my information from because they're just brilliant from that space and understanding what is happening in the market. It tends to be pretty well summarized, I always find. So fathering groups on LinkedIn or Facebook.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:24]:
    Sarai Patel Well, Sarah, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for the work that you're doing to be able to push fathers to think about things in a little bit different way. And if you've got one piece of advice that you wanna give to all dads, what would that advice be?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:25:37]:
    Spend time with your children. You don't get that time back, and it's precious time for you and for your children. I think that sometimes we believe that our children are more resilient than what they are at times and the love of their parents is literally all they need. So make sure you spend time with your kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:00]:
    Now if people wanna find out more about your books and other things that you're doing, where's the best place for them to go?

    Sarah Maconachie [00:26:06]:
    And you can find me on my website. It's usually a very good spot or on LinkedIn. So Sarah McConachie on LinkedIn or www.workhardparenthard.com.au is my website and all my programs and my books and all my blogs are on there as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:24]:
    Well, Sarah, it's been a pleasure having you here today for having you share your own journey as a mother, but also your journey in writing this book and getting this out into the world. And I wish you all the best.

    Sarah Maconachie [00:26:34]:
    Thank you so much. Thanks so much for having me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:36]:
    The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:28]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast, the time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and beat the world to them. Be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:21]:
    You're the best dad you can be.

  • Crafting Wonder in Childhood: Lessons from Gregg Behr and Mister Rogers

    Crafting Wonder in Childhood: Lessons from Gregg Behr and Mister Rogers

    · Dads With Daughters

    **Seizing Accidental Moments**

    Fatherhood is an expedition without a clear map, each phase of our children's lives an uncharted territory waiting to be explored. On today's Dads with Daughters podcast we welcomed Gregg Behr to discuss wonder and parenting. Behr, the executive director of the Grable Foundation and a father of two, reflects on the journey that began with trepidation upon learning he was going to be a father to a daughter. Amid fears and dreams, he emphasized his role in ensuring his daughters have 'outrageous confidence' in themselves.

    This emotional connection to fatherhood resonates with many dads, who similarly navigate gender biases and aspire to protect their daughters from the doubts the world may cast. But Behr offers a perspective shift: difficulties in parenting are universal. Yet, as a 'girl dad,' he feels a unique joy and asserts there’s no hard part to being a father to daughters when the heart focuses on the small, joyous discoveries they bring into life.

    **The Power of Intentionality**

    Life's unpredictability can thrust accidental moments of connection to the forefront of our fatherly experiences, as Behr discovered during prolonged periods of single parenting. These unexpected times can surprisingly foster deep bonds and familiarize us with the nuanced layers of our children’s personalities. Dr. Lewis reiterated the importance of embracing these accidental, seemingly mundane moments. These slices of daily life hold the potential for lasting significance in both the parent and child's heart.

    **Infusing Wonder into Every Day**

    Shifting gears, the episode delved into Behr's co-authored book 'When You Wonder, You’re Learning,' inspired by none other than Fred Rogers of 'Mister Rogers' Neighborhood.' Embracing Rogers' vision, Behr shared insights into being a deliberate learner and listener, and the ways in which he integrated these values into fatherhood and philanthropy work. He emphasized the importance of wonder and curiosity, traits often lost as we transition into adulthood. Yet, in mirroring behaviors of joy and wonder for our children, we counter the inevitable dimming of creativity that life tends to impose.

    **Beyond the Podcast: Living Lessons**

    The dialogue on 'Dads with Daughters' extended beyond theory, as Behr recounted applying Fred Rogers' wisdom to difficult discussions with his daughters. Whether addressing complex questions about safety and race or fostering daily habits rooted in amazement, Behr embraced the opportunity to wonder and wander through life's maze with his daughters by his side.

    Dr. Lewis and Behr's exchange serves as a potent reminder: fatherhood, while fraught with challenges, is a terrain ripe with accidental marvels and intentional teachings. The episode epitomizes the podcast's mission to aid dads in nurturing strong, independent women and the reciprocal growth that fatherhood engenders.

    As we pull away from the microphone and the echoes of Behr's stories and insights fade, we are left with the enduring notion that to be a dad with daughters is to be an architect of wonder, festooning the foundation of fatherhood with loving, intentional moments crafted from the everyday tapestry of life. 'Dads with Daughters' offers a community where such architectural feats are not only recognized but celebrated, as we all strive to be the best dads we can be, helping our daughters ascend into their own era of wonder.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to dads with daughters where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, we come every week and we have great conversations and I love being able to walk beside you as you are figuring this thing out called fatherhood. Every day is a journey, and every phase of life that your kids are in is a journey. And I'm just glad to be able to have these conversations and be able to be a part of it with you. Fatherhood can feel alone at times, but it doesn't have to be. And it is so important to be able to connect with other dads, to be able to create community, to be able to learn and be open to learn about things that may help you to be a better dad. And that's why every week I love being able to bring you different guests, people that have gone before you that are doing this alongside you as well, that have their own daughters and are learning along the way to be able to help you, to be able to give you some perspective, some insights, some things that might help you as you move forward in your own fatherhood journey.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:28]:
    This week, we've got another great guest with us. Greg Baer is with us. And Greg is the executive director of the Grable Foundation, but he's also a father of 2 daughters. And we're gonna be talking about his own journey as a father, but we're also gonna be talking about the a journey that he had in not only writing a book, but really bringing a new perspective into his own fatherhood journey, which was that looking at the concept of wonder. And we're gonna talk about that. So we'll get to that in just a few moments. But the first and foremost, I am just really excited to have Greg here. Greg, thanks so much for being here today.

    Gregg Behr [00:02:05]:
    Chris, I am absolutely honored to be here, and I love how you described figuring it out because I feel like I'm gonna be figuring out fatherhood right in front of you right now. I

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:15]:
    think you're giving yourself too little credit because I think you're doing some good things, and we're gonna talk about those things. But first and foremost, one of the things that I love doing is turning the clock back in time. And you've got 2 daughters, so I wanna go back. I wanna go back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Gregg Behr [00:02:32]:
    I was scared. I think probably like a lot of dads. It's not that I necessarily wanted a boy. We were hopeful for kids. We were hopeful for a healthy child. And when we learned it's a girl, I remember thinking, I don't know anything about girls. I wasn't raised in a family with sisters. Oh my gosh.

    Gregg Behr [00:02:50]:
    What am I going to do? And so there was joy about we're pregnant, joy about, the pregnancy going well and worry about what do I need to know? What do I need to learn? I knew enough at the time to know my number one job in their lives is to make sure that they just have outrageous confidence about themselves and what they can do in the world. And that so that that compass has always stayed with me from the very beginning before the moment they entered this world.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:20]:
    Now I I've heard that before from other dads, from pretty much every father that I talked to, that fear comes with not only fatherhood, but being a father to a daughter. And I guess first and foremost, as you think about that fear, what was your biggest fear in raising a daughter?

    Gregg Behr [00:03:36]:
    Yeah. Chris, I think it was just it was that I didn't know what I didn't know. I think I fast forwarded all the way from 0 to puberty and I'd like to think that I noticed enough about the world to know that there's gender bias and things might be a little bit harder for a girl than it is for a boy. And so I immediately had that, like, I wanna be a bear dad who is, like, really protective of her daughter because she's gonna be amazing, and I want her to have all sorts of possibilities in this world, and I'm gonna fight off all of the gremlins who are going to poison her with doubt or get in her way because she's gonna be every bit of what she wants to be as a boy could be. Like, they seem like silly things to say out loud, but, like, these were thoughts in my head at the time.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:18]:
    And I think that that goes through a lot of dad's heads. And as you move along, between those different phases in your kids' lives. You learn a little bit more, not only about yourself, but about your daughters. You learn that the differences may not be as different, even though they are. I mean, there there's definite differences there. What would you say has been the hardest part for you in being a father to daughters?

    Gregg Behr [00:04:40]:
    There's no hard part. There's honestly, there's just joy. Like the hard part hearkens back to something you said a moment ago. It's just hard being a parent. It's hard being a dad. I can't imagine living in this world without being a girl dad because I'm now the dad of 2 girls. And I will say Chris, we lost a child in between our 2 girls. And so I remember thinking when we had a healthy pregnancy and we were knew we were gonna have a second child, I was actually begging at that point.

    Gregg Behr [00:05:06]:
    I'm like, I want a girl. Right? Like, I fell in love with my first little girl, and I knew I'd fall in love with my second little girl. And I guess at the time, we had friends who had babies and young kids, and I was like, boys are crazy. What is wrong with that species over there? And I really wanted a girl. Like, I feel so lucky to have 2 healthy girls. I would have been happy with 10 girls. These young women now they're ages 10 12. They are strong and confident and powerful and fun.

    Gregg Behr [00:05:35]:
    They have good hearts, smart brains. Like, I love being around them. I guess I don't know at this point what it would be like to be the dad of a boy, but I feel so blessed to have these 2 girls. And it's just the hard part is just trying to be a good parent every day in the mundane little things in their lives, because it's those mundane things that I know add up to the big things.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:54]:
    Now with 2 kids, you have to find that balance to be able to create those unique relationships with each of them because each child is unique. Many times when you have more than one child, the personalities are very different. So talk to me about how you've been able to cultivate, how you've been able to work to develop those unique relationships with both your daughters.

    Gregg Behr [00:06:17]:
    Chris, I think in some ways, I've I've tried to be deliberate and intentional about this, and in some ways, I've been accidental. So let me explain. So in terms of being deliberate and intentional, even though I'm a workaholic and I probably don't give enough attention to my family, my personal life, my kids, the way that I should, I do try and be deliberate about the time that I spend with them during the time, you know, when I'm able to be home, when they get home from after school, they get home at different hours, their bed routines, and spending some time with them before they go to bed. And also because we have 2, my wife and I are often going in different directions because, So I try and be really deliberate about the time that we have cars together or on the sidelines or in a gym or whatever it might be. And just I try and be really mindful about being alongside them, not as a friend, but as a parent. The accidental part is this. So during these past 2 years, my wife's father, my father-in-law fell he became quite ill and ultimately passed. And I mentioned this to say that he lives a long distance away, half a world away.

    Gregg Behr [00:07:28]:
    And so what was thrust upon us as a family was that my wife was gone for long intervals at a time over a 2 year period. And there were, there were many months. I mean, we're talking more than 6, 7, 8 months that it was just me, single working dad with my 2 girls. And I don't wish this on anyone. It's hard. Honestly, Chris, I have no idea how single parents get by in this world having had a small window into that. And I will say this time when there was just the 3 of us, our relationship is so fundamentally different than it was previous to that. And there's a closeness and I really got to know both girls really well because I, you know, I had to spend time whether I wanted to or not.

    Gregg Behr [00:08:05]:
    Right? Like, I had to spend time with them in all sorts of household activities, in their school and extracurricular activities, just in their lives in general, in the little chat, you know, mini breaks and things we try to take, in the vacations, or even just walking in the neighborhood. And it's this accidental time that I'm unexpectedly grateful for.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:24]:
    Accidental time. I love that concept because I think that many times in the small moments when you come home from work and your child asks you to come in or they want to just they ask you to sit down and do something with them. Those can be accidental moments. Those can be those moments that become very important to the child and to you. And as they get older, it's not always easy to find that time, or that they want to spend the time. But it's important to take advantage of that time when they give it to you.

    Gregg Behr [00:09:00]:
    Chris, I just wanna celebrate what you just said. Right? Because one one of the things I learned during this period is exactly what we described. Now that we're lucky enough to be back together as a family, it's still noticing those moments, those mundane moments where accidental things might happen or when one of my daughters comes to me and says, hey, daddy. Can you take a break? Or can you play this game with me? And and I'm now much better, although I could always be better. I'm much better about noticing those moments and taking advantage of them. Because I I know that quip that people say all the time that the days are long, the years are short, but until you experience that, you don't really understand that. And so when one of my kids comes to me or if there's a moment, I try and be much more intentional than I was previously about spending that time with them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:43]:
    It is so important to find that time and to have that special time because as you said, the the years are short. I've come to find that and they go by really fast, especially as your child gets older, they get involved in more things in the years just fly by. And people tell you that, especially when you have young kids and you're like, that's not the case. You know, it's gonna be a heck of a long time until they're 18, a heck of a long time until they're in college. And I got all the time in the world. And then in a blink of an eye, it is over and things change again. So you have to be present in the moment in that regard, because it is fleeting. Even though it may seem long, if you have young children now, it does go by fast.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:28]:
    And you definitely have to take advantage of that. Now, I know that every father has moments that are memorable, especially moments individually with your children, where you've been able to create those special memories, the special experiences, what have been the most memorable experiences that you've been able to have thus far as a father with your daughters?

    Gregg Behr [00:10:50]:
    There are some moments with my girls that we've repeated because they're Monday moments that we've made special. In the fall, it's often the case. I love college football. College football could be on the TV which we can see from the kitchen and my girls and I love making homemade pizzas from scratch or when the snow comes and maybe every time the snow comes now pouring maple syrup on fresh snow and eating that and celebrating that, or just holidays. Like we make big deals in my family of birthdays and holidays like Christmas and New Year's and Valentine's Day and St. Patrick's Day. It's all of those little daily life things. And it's also true that some of our more special times together are when we're unburdened by work or the errands we have to run because we've gone away.

    Gregg Behr [00:11:36]:
    You know, we've gotten away for a weekend or we've been able lucky enough, privileged enough to schedule a trip. And even though, Chris, I'm I'm the sort of person that makes lists and I'm pretty deliberate and intentional about my work, When I travel, I like to go trucking. Right? Like, where is this road gonna take us? Or, I just read about this farmer's market in this part of Montreal. Let's go see what it's like. Right? A lot of unplanned time and I feel like those moments of unplanned time end up yielding the most special opportunities. Like, oh, remember we had that cheese or, like, remember we stumbled upon that zipline and we went ziplining over these beautiful mountains. Right? Like, it's those, I feel like, Chris, those most special moments are, you know, maybe it's the deliberate trucking or the deliberate exploration without a road map or a a plan for where we're gonna walk to that day, but it's those moments that I think as a family, we treasure the most.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:29]:
    The moments that you just talked about and the things that you're reflecting on make me really think about the fact that you are an author of a book called when you wonder you're learning. And in your book, you really dive deep into the concept of wonder, and really bring some of the lessons that mister Rogers brought out into the world in my formative years and the formative years of some of you as well. And I guess first and foremost, as we delve into this, I'm really interested in the concept of this book and the concept of wonder. But I'm also interested in the origin story of this because, I mean, mister Rogers definitely had a strong impact on people of a certain age, we'll say, of people that grew up with his teachings. Some others are just still are were introduced to him after the fact, through reruns and things like that. But what made you and your colleague, Ryan Radetzky, decide that you wanted to delve deeper into what mister Rogers was teaching and how any of us could capture wonder and put it into practice, whether it be a teacher in a classroom, or a father in his own home?

    Gregg Behr [00:13:47]:
    Thank you for that question, Chris, or us, what you need to know about me and my coauthor Ryan is that we're kids of Western Pennsylvania. I'm podcasting to you right now from Pittsburgh, which is significant because it's from Pittsburgh that Fred Rogers recorded mister Rogers' neighborhood for nearly 40 years at WQED, America's first public television station. And Fred Rogers himself is a native of Western Pennsylvania. So I mentioned that to say there's something in the water around here. Even though mister Rogers is an American icon, also a Canadian icon, he felt like he was ours. Right? And we had the experience of living in his midst, and and I had the privilege of of knowing him and subsequently his wife. And you mentioned earlier that I work at the Grable Foundation. I work in education philanthropy.

    Gregg Behr [00:14:33]:
    And so for a couple of decades now, I've I've been the luckiest kid in Pittsburgh who gets to figure out how to support amazing teachers and librarians and museum exhibit designers in places like schools and libraries and museums trying to make learning experiences better for kids and their parents, families, and caregivers. Great support for the learning landscape all around Western Pennsylvania. And you could imagine in the course of that work, we we, you know, we're trying to make sure we're doing our jobs well. So we're reading a lot about what makes for great learning experiences. And it was about 7 years ago that Ryan and I are reading these articles and peer reviewed pieces that come from the University of Pittsburgh and Carnegie Mellon right in our own yard or the University of Michigan, MIT, Stanford and beyond. And these wickedly smart learning scientists were writing papers that increasingly read to me and Ryan as if they were scripts from mister Rogers' Neighborhood. And as you say, there are generations of Americans, including the 2 of us and you, who grew up watching mister Rogers. And we started to think, you know, is there another story to tell about mister Rogers? He's come back to our popular culture in movies like Morgan Neville's amazing documentary and and the Tom Hanks biopic.

    Gregg Behr [00:15:46]:
    But is there a story to tell about Fred who's not just that loving character that we remember in all of those television visits, but also Fred the learning scientist who was incredibly deliberate and intentional about his work and maybe a learning scientist who left us some blueprints about the things that we need to be doing today in our own homes or our schools and in our communities and neighborhoods. And Chris, it turns out after years of research and a lot of time studying the work of Fred Rogers, meeting with his colleagues, going to the archives, there in fact was a book to be written. And so we wrote, When You Wonder, You're Learning Mr. Rogers Enduring Lessons for Raising Creative, Curious, Caring Kids. And in that book, we talk about the tools for learning and the ways in which Fred Rogers in the neighborhood cultivated curiosity, protected our creativity, found ways to support deep deep listening and loving speech. All I could go on with a a number of tools that we learned about his work that we could translate with practical, accessible, doable examples of things that people are doing today in our schools, museums, libraries, and neighborhoods to really live out what we describe as the Fred method that combines that learning science that we know today about how learning works, coupled with what today we call whole child. It wasn't used during Fred's time, but that sense that every single kid and honestly, every adult goes through the continuous learning that's social, emotional, cognitive, physical, and beyond. Right? And so learning science plus whole chart equals the FRED method.

    Gregg Behr [00:17:15]:
    And there's also a job and personal hazard to co authoring a book like this because then you start to wrestle in your own life. Like, am I doing this? Am I doing it well enough? And that's where we find ourselves today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:26]:
    So talk to me about that wrestling and what you, after all these years of exploring and delving deeper into what Fred was trying to teach that what you personally learned for yourself that you could incorporate into your own fatherhood that you either were doing or weren't doing? And how did you have to make adjustments?

    Gregg Behr [00:17:50]:
    What Fred did so well is he did lots and lots of little things. So we've used the word mundane a number of times in this conversation, and it's the mundane moments in life that matter. And I also speak to a big moment too. But it's the mundane moments maybe as I'm having a conversation about, you know, a new hard topic. Like, maybe my daughter's in middle school reading dystopian novels and, like, how do you begin to explain that concept? And I remember well that Fred, when he was trying to take kids to a place of mystery, he didn't start by taking us, for example, all the way to the crayon factory. Like, here's how crayons are made, kids. Now he started with his easel in his living room, a safe, comfortable place for us, showed us a crayon, something with which we were all familiar, started drawing and creating art, and talked a lot about that crayon, you know, and then use that simple thing that was so familiar to us to then take us off to the place of mystery about, for example, how crayons are made. And so I find myself, for example, in conversations with my kids today, wondering, like, okay, where do I start with a place that they can begin before trying to explain, like, here's how elevators run or whatever, like, whatever the subject matter might be that, you know, because kids ask thousands of questions, which is another thing.

    Gregg Behr [00:19:09]:
    Right? Like, I've learned to be quiet and to listen to their questions and encourage all sorts of questions and not be quick to say, like, hey, Alexa. What's the answer to this? Right? Like, even though sometimes that has to happen. I try and, you know, mister Rogers did, like, convey a sense like, Catherine, I don't I don't know what the answer that to that is, but, you know, later together, let's let's figure out if we can understand why the willow tree is blooming before every other tree in our yard. Right? Like, whatever it is because as you know, kids ask all sorts of questions. It also goes back to that sensibility that I described of of trucking, of exploring. You know, having times on Saturdays or Sundays when we tend to have the freest time in our lives to say like, what are we gonna try right now? Or, like, what if we put these three things together? Or, you know, mommy's making fried rice all the time and she's grabbing things from the refrigerator. What if we grab 3 things from our refrigerator, like the TV show Chopped and like, how could we put them together? So Chris, it's all sorts of little things, but if I may, may I share a big example too? This happened to me a couple years ago. Our book had just been released and it was a Friday night in March.

    Gregg Behr [00:20:17]:
    I was exhausted. I wanted to do nothing more than just lie on my sofa and watch NCAA March Madness basketball games. Right? Like there were 5 games on at the same time. Teams, I some of whom I'd never heard of before, like, oh, this is gonna be great. I'm gonna watch these amazing basketball games. And I'm sitting there watching these games and my daughter is resting with her head on the the side of the sofa. And she turns to me, Chris, and says, daddy, am I gonna be shot? Which for me, it was like, what? What did you just say? And sadly, there are a number of probably a lot of dads in this country who've heard that question before and the lots of others who've never heard it. And I hope they never ever hear that question.

    Gregg Behr [00:20:58]:
    And what I realized at that moment was that the news of the day of the week had gotten into my household and my kids are of mixed race. My wife is Asian American. And that week, a number of Asian Americans had been massacred in Atlanta. And somehow the news of that had gotten into our household even though maybe naively naively so, I try and protect my kids from, you know, all sorts of bad news in the world. I realized in that moment, Chris, it was like Fred Rogers lessons came rushing to me. 1st of all, I have to acknowledge this question. I can't obviously can't ignore it, but even though I wanted to ignore it and watch Cleveland say or whomever playing. Right? Like, I need to acknowledge this question, notice it, convey to my daughter that she's safe.

    Gregg Behr [00:21:41]:
    Like you're physically safe right here in this moment. You're emotionally safe that I, a carrying a dot in your life and right by your side. Honestly, I don't have the answers to this, but later right now and later in the coming days weeks, you know, we'll wonder together. We'll talk about this. We'll listen to each other. We'll talk about why this is on your mind. What's burdening you? Because as Fred said, anything that's mentionable is manageable. And there were so many lessons from our book, which is a book ultimately about creating those joyful, wondrous learning experiences in big and small ways for the kids in our lives, no matter what our role is, whether it's a parent or classroom teacher librarian or otherwise.

    Gregg Behr [00:22:19]:
    But in that moment as a dad watching back college basketball, like all of those lessons came home in a really powerful and profound way that obviously has become a core memory for me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:29]:
    It's definitely a powerful moment, a powerful moment between you and your kids. And one thing that comes to mind when I think about what you just said was that for a lot of people, wonder disappears. And there's a point in their life when something some kind of a switch is flipped. And you go from this childhood wonder of looking at the world, questioning things, and looking at things with different, we'll say different glasses to an acceptance of the world as it is. And maybe not questioning or wondering as much. So as you were going through this for yourself, and learning more about what Fred had put into the world, and you're writing this and putting something new out into the world to try to challenge people to flip that switch back on, What did you find that could help people to rekindle that wonder within their lives, that could rekindle and flip that switch for themselves a little bit easier than it might be for their kids so that they can then channel that wonder back into themselves, but also encourage that wonder to stay flipped on for their kids as well.

    Gregg Behr [00:23:49]:
    That's one of our biggest tasks as grown ups in kids' lives. And as you note, it does seem apparent that we lose that sense of creativity and the wonder and and forget the joys of something that maybe brought us lots of joy and we maybe used to spend lots of time doing. Right? Fred Rogers said, the best teacher in the world is the one who loves what he or she does and loves it right in front of you. Now couple that with learning science research. And one of the many studies that Ryan and I cite is some work by George Land, actually from the previous century. And in his research, he documented Chris exactly what you described because he had used this test for NASA, our space agency, and identified that so many 5 year olds, it was 98% of 5 year olds who took this test developed for NASA scored so well that they qualified as creative geniuses. Right? And and to your point, like, you can think about little kids and they they come up with the genius solutions to all sorts of things in their life. So, like, they wonder and they're creating and they're like, what happens if I do this? And what George Landon and his team did was that they tested that same group of 5 year olds every 5 years through adulthood.

    Gregg Behr [00:24:56]:
    And 98% at 5 years old by adulthood, that percentage had dropped to 2%. Now importantly, what George land and his team concluded was not that our creativity just naturally fades, but actually that we as, you know, teenagers and then as adults learn all sorts of noncreative behaviors. You know, we learn to suppress those things or to take in other people's judgment. We learned that sense of perspective taking and empathy building. And what's Fred Rogers' solution to this? It's to model behavior. And it's why when you go back as an adult and look at what he did on that program, you could see Fred in his living room and he could be, you know, putting together popsicle sticks or cutting with felt. And he made it clear at that moment that it was bringing him great joy. And it wasn't just Fred.

    Gregg Behr [00:25:44]:
    Right? It was Yo Yo Ma and Julia Child and all of those folks we got to meet, the celebrities really that we met in the program. And Fred wasn't celebrating their gold medals or their major accomplishments. He was celebrating the joy of Yo Yo Yo Ma playing the cello or Julie Child cutting up ingredients. And it was also the the guests I mean, it was also the characters on the show. Right? Handyman Negri was not just the hand man. He was the neighborhood guitarist. Officer Clemens was not just policing the neighborhood. He was an opera singer.

    Gregg Behr [00:26:12]:
    Right? Fred was making it clear that people have joy and that they we don't need to give up the things that bring us joy and creativity as we age. And so it's a reminder to us, as Fred said, if we want to be the best teacher in the world, that we have to love what we're doing right in front of our kids. It's why a teacher who loves beekeeping and brings beekeeping into her math class can light up a classroom around math because she's brought beekeeping something she loves into that classroom. It's like me jumping on my skateboard in my neighborhood and not realizing that all the kids are watching and having joy as an adult going down my cul de sac and surviving. And unbeknownst to me, loving what I was doing at that moment and sparking an interest in those kids. We as grown ups need to be really intentional and deliberate as we do things as much as possible demonstrate that the joy that it's bringing us. So there's good reason to pick up that guitar or pull out those knitting instruments or or to do the things that bring us joy or to try new things, but whatever we're doing, to be clear that it's bringing us joy. That's how we counter that sense of losing creativity and wonder.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:21]:
    So how do you define joy? And how do you define wonder? And I can see concentric circles that there's an overlap, but how do you define them?

    Gregg Behr [00:27:31]:
    Yeah. Joy isn't just happiness. Joy is that internal sense of awe about experiencing something, witnessing something, doing something and in that sense of awe, I think is a a deep connection to wondering because in that moment you start to look around and you start to notice. Right? Like, noticing is really important because in that wondering, you start to then ask questions or provoke ideas in yourself or in others. And so to me, that sense of awe is in many ways a through line between joy and wonder.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:05]:
    Now you've put this book out in the world. It's been out for a while now. And you've been traveling, you've been talking about it, you're taking what you've been learning and trying to help others to incorporate this. What's been the response from your own kids to what you wrote, but also the change that they may have seen in you based on what you learned and are putting into place now?

    Gregg Behr [00:28:31]:
    That is such a great question, Chris. And I thought you were gonna ask me about how the audience reacts. Right? Because it's so fun to talk about something, some person like Fred Rogers to whom there's such an emotional connection. And Ryan and I have been able to identify from others in the world all sorts of examples of FRED method like approaches. But to turn that question to myself, I know one of the things that my kids have seen because I've taken them to I've taken them to events. It could be book signings. It could be a talk I was giving either locally or another city. Like we've created little adventures about this.

    Gregg Behr [00:29:04]:
    And they've seen in me and my coauthor, Ryan, the joy that we have talking about this book. So there's no doubt that they've seen the joy of producing something in the world that matters to others in ways little and big. And maybe because of that, I don't know. I've seen my kids doing more writing, doing more reading, doing a bit more presentations and playful things that they did as younger kids, as preteens. Now, I hope they see in me the joy that I've had and the hard work, right? Like it's not like there's hard work and joy too. Right? The hard work and the commitment that I've had to something and then to find ways to share in ways that are helpful to others. I'm so hopeful they've they've noticed that. I think that they have.

    Gregg Behr [00:29:50]:
    I wish they were here right now to tell you, Chris, what they've noticed and what they haven't, but that's what I hope they've noticed.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:56]:
    It's always a great way to be able to, later tonight, say, let's talk about this. Let's explore.

    Gregg Behr [00:30:01]:
    What do you wonder about when you wonder about daddy's book about wonder?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:05]:
    Very that's very meta. That's very meta. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5 where I ask you 5 more questions that to delve deeper into you as a dad. You ready?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:16]:
    I hope so.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:17]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:19]:
    Patience.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:20]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:24]:
    In the quiet of putting them to bed at night and knowing that they were rested, well fed, and that there was some joy and laughter and goodness to their day.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:36]:
    Now, if I was to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:40]:
    Silly, sometimes loud, hardworking, occasionally demanding.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:44]:
    In 10 years from now, what do you want them to say?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:46]:
    I love you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:47]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Gregg Behr [00:30:49]:
    Oh, Chris, as I start to tear up over here, I can't help but think of my own dad. My dad's a big guy. He's an amazing dad, big guy, big papa bear, played football, and he wears his emotions on his sleeve. And I feel like ever since I became a dad, I wear my emotions on my sleeve in the same way. And I I've gotten really comfortable with that. And if I can be half as bit as my dad was a dad to me and my brother, to my own girls, then I will have done a really excellent job for them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:22]:
    Now you've given a lot of piece of advice today. And as you think about all dads that are out there, what's one piece of advice you'd want to leave with all of them?

    Gregg Behr [00:31:32]:
    I tell my girls every day to use their good heart and their smart brain. And I suppose time will tell, but I hope that just the repeated conveyance to them, like that sharing with them, the encouraging of them to use their good heart, to use their smart brain, and to know that they're beautiful will prove to be sticky in the human beings that they become.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:52]:
    Well, Greg, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here for doing what you're doing to inspire wonder in kids, in adults, and challenging parents to encourage wonder within their kids as they grow up and flipping that switch back on to bring wonder back into our lives. If people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

    Gregg Behr [00:32:15]:
    They would find our book at when you wonder.org. And happily, you can ideally find it at your local bookstore, also at Amazon, Barnes and Noble. And I'm also on X and LinkedIn, Greg Bear.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:27]:
    Again, Greg, thank you so much for being here today, and I wish you all the best.

    Gregg Behr [00:32:31]:
    Chris, thank you so much. What a complete joy and honor to be with you, and thanks for letting me figure some of this out right in front of you. Thank you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:38]:
    The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together dot org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:30]:
    We're all in the same boat, And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the Best dad that you can be.

  • Effective Fatherhood: 5 Stones to Guide Your Journey with Nick Adams

    Effective Fatherhood: 5 Stones to Guide Your Journey with Nick Adams

    · Dads With Daughters

    In today's fast-paced world, the role of a father is evolving, and the importance of actively participating in one's daughter's life cannot be overstated. In this podcast episode, we have an insightful conversation with Nick Adams, a dedicated father of four and author of "Being the Dad You Wish You Had: 5 Big Stones for Effective Fatherhood." Through this discussion, Nick shares invaluable wisdom and experiences that shed light on the journey of fatherhood. His insights offer guidance on nurturing strong, independent daughters while navigating the complexities of being a father. Let's delve into the key takeaways from this engaging conversation.

    Fatherhood Defined: Relationship Building

    As the conversation unfolds, Nick truly encapsulates fatherhood in one word: relationship. This fundamental aspect is at the core of his approach to being a father to his daughters. Recognizing the influential power that fathers possess, Nick emphasizes the significance of focusing on building and nurturing a strong relationship with his children. This insight serves as a cornerstone for fathers looking to make a meaningful impact on their daughters' lives.

    Navigating Fear and Parental Insecurities

    Nick's candid reflections on the fears and insecurities he grappled with as he anticipated becoming a father to daughters resonate with many. His honest admission of feeling unprepared and inadequate highlights a common sentiment experienced by numerous fathers. By addressing these fears, Nick offers a relatable perspective that encourages fathers to acknowledge their vulnerabilities while embarking on the journey of fatherhood.

    Redefining Success as a Father

    A pivotal moment in the conversation arises when Nick reflects on the indicators of success as a father. His daughters' choices to actively engage in his work and to consider him not just as a father, but as one of their best friends, signify a profound sense of accomplishment for Nick. This reframing of success steers fathers away from external benchmarks and towards fostering relationships and open communication with their children.

    Individuality and Connection with Each Child

    Nick eloquently underscores the importance of recognizing and embracing the individuality of each child. Highlighting that what works for one child may not necessarily work for another, he imparts the wisdom of fostering unique relationships with each of his daughters. By valuing and understanding their distinct personalities, fathers are encouraged to tailor their approach to parenting, creating meaningful connections with their children.

    Balancing Career and Fatherhood

    With a busy schedule and a career that demands significant attention, Nick reflects on the necessity of finding balance between professional commitments and being an engaged father. His commitment to prioritizing his daughters' key events and establishing a consistent family dinner ritual underscores the significance of being present in their lives. Nick's experiences serve as a reminder for fathers to strive for balance in juggling their various responsibilities.

    Embracing Imperfection and Making Progress

    A striking aspect of Nick's insights is his emphasis on embracing imperfections while continuously striving for progress. By navigating the challenges of fatherhood with the mindset of making incremental strides, fathers are encouraged to alleviate the pressure of perfectionism. Nick's wisdom resonates as a reminder that the journey of fatherhood is about growth and connection, rather than achieving flawlessness.

    Advice for Every Father

    In a parting piece of advice, Nick extends a guiding principle to all fathers. He underscores the importance of understanding and supporting his children in becoming their authentic selves, rather than shaping them into a predetermined image. This profound insight emphasizes the transformative power of valuing individuality and empowering daughters to embrace their unique talents and aspirations.

    Nick Adams' profound insights and candid reflections offer a wealth of wisdom for fathers navigating the intricate path of raising strong, independent daughters. His invaluable experiences underscore the significance of relationship-building, the embrace of imperfection, and the quest for progress as fundamental principles in effective fatherhood. By leveraging Nick's insights, fathers can embark on their journey with renewed inspiration, equipped to nurture vibrant relationships with their daughters while striving to be the best dads they can be.

    Nick Adams' reflections highlight the transformative power of an engaged and empathetic father-daughter relationship, serving as a beacon of wisdom for fathers seeking to nurture meaningful connections with their children while navigating the rich tapestry of fatherhood.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:15]:
    Welcome back to Dads with Daughters where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, every week, I love being able to sit down with you, to work with you, to talk with you, to be able to be on this journey side by side with you, because it is a journey. Every day is a journey with our daughters. And no matter what age they're at, things are going to change and to be able to walk hand in hand side by side with other dads, learning from them is so important. And that's why I love being able to have this opportunity to talk to you every week because none of us have to do this alone. So often society makes it seem like we do have to, but that is not the case. There are so many fathers that have gone before us that have kids that have grown and flown, that have learned things and can share that learning with you, maybe your neighbor, but it could also be someone on the other end of your earphones.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:19]:
    And that's why every week I love being able to bring you different guests, different people with different experiences that can share those experiences with you and help you along the journey that you're on. This week, we've got another great guest with us today. Nick Adams is with us. And Nick is dedicated to helping men understand the power of living into their strengths and dreams and provides actionable tools for the journey to authentic manhood. He is an author. He's a father of 4. So we're gonna be learning more about him and his journey as a father, and I'm really excited to have him here. Nick, thanks so much for being here today.

    Nick Adams [00:01:55]:
    Christopher, it's my pleasure. I'm looking forward. Even as you were introducing the show, I I just feel excited to see some of the phrases you use about connecting, not just when kids are young, but ongoing and having relationship that that's great. I'm excited about the show.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:09]:
    Well, I'm excited to have you on. And as I said, you're a father of 4. So first and foremost, what I love doing is turning the clock back in time. I know you have 2 daughters. So I'm gonna go all the way back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a dad to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Nick Adams [00:02:23]:
    Oh, I mean, honestly, I was terrified because, like, I had no idea what I was doing. I didn't really have a great role model as a father. And so I found myself expecting and not just expecting a child, but expecting a girl, which that's like, okay. I mean, at least I sort of understand guys. You know, I've I've never pretended to understand girls. And so, like, wow. It just really was pretty traumatizing. If not traumatized is wrong, it was scary and exciting.

    Nick Adams [00:02:53]:
    Oh my goodness. So exciting.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:54]:
    You definitely don't wanna forget that because your daughters won't let you live that down if that was the case. If you just say it was terrifying. So

    Nick Adams [00:03:00]:
    Yeah. It was both. Still is.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:02]:
    So I wanna hear about the terrifying piece because I hear from a lot of dads that raising daughters, that you definitely run into that there's fear that there's fear that comes with that. What was your biggest fear in raising daughters?

    Nick Adams [00:03:17]:
    Well, I mean, really my biggest fear wasn't centered specifically around daughters. It was centered around being a father. And and a lot of it just came from the fact that I didn't feel like I had a very good role model. And, you know, you hear people talking about, oh, you know, my dad told me every day or I heard over and over. This is, you know, a a life lesson I learned from my dad. And I was just like, I really don't have any of those, you know. And so I felt very inadequate and unprepared. And so I think that was my biggest fear because like probably most parents, after you realize you're having a daughter or a son or whatever it is you're having, you're just excited.

    Nick Adams [00:03:55]:
    It doesn't matter about the gender as long as I mean, my big thing was as long as they're healthy and we can have a a going forward and things to work out, I'm good. So my biggest fears were really surrounding being a dad.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:06]:
    So coming into fatherhood without that mentor, without that person that you could look to to say they did it right, and I wanna follow that example. How did you surround yourself or find other people as substitutes to be able to guide you in that journey that you were on?

    Nick Adams [00:04:24]:
    Yeah. Unfortunately, when I started down the journey of fatherhood, you weren't doing podcast. And so I couldn't find you. That would have been a great find. But I did just try to find other men who were further along in the journey and watch what they were doing. I was a youth pastor at the time that that I was starting my family and having children. And so I was watching other people raise their kids and I was trying to help them disciple their kids and and just help their kids grow up into healthy people. And so I had the opportunity to watch both what worked and what didn't work and to glean information there.

    Nick Adams [00:05:05]:
    I did a whole lot of reading, took classes. And then really, I think observation, that was probably one of the strongest things I had going for me because I was in so many families' lives dealing with their children and getting to to watch them. So I think that was probably one of the best things for me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:21]:
    Now you have 2 daughters. Every child is completely unique, and they have different personalities. They have different wants. They have different needs. And as you are building those relationships with your kids, you have to keep that in mind. So talk to me about how you had to what you had to do to be able to build those unique relationships with each of your daughters individually?

    Nick Adams [00:05:46]:
    Well, I think you just pointed out what I think is one of the most important pieces, and that is acknowledging it. If you can keep in mind that these are not the same people and what works with 1 will not work with the other, then I think that's a big step forward. And then and and of course, they're not only are they different people, they're at different ages, they're at different stages, they're experiencing life in a different capacity. I mean, my girls are 2 years apart, which is pretty close, but still there's a pretty good difference between being a 4 year old and being a 6 year old, you know. I mean, you've you've not done any kind of school and you are now functioning as a 1st grader and being in the school all day long. And there's just a there's a lot of differences even in a 2 year gap. And if you have a larger gap, it's even more than that. And so I think just acknowledging that and trying to be aware of where your kids are in the process.

    Nick Adams [00:06:38]:
    And as as they step over those various hurdles of again, there's a pretty big difference between a 9 year old and an 11 year old or especially when they move on over to 12. You know, you start to have some pretty distinct differences there. So I think being aware of that and consciously focusing on what's their temperament. I don't I don't know if you're familiar with, the book, the 5 love languages. But, you know, I I read that and tried to not just apply it to my relationship with my wife, but also to think about my kids and say, you know, what is their love language? Because that was one of the things I watched as I was watching families and and being a youth pastor was you'd have 2 kids or 3 kids in the same family. And one of them would tell you my parents hate me and they're terrible and this is an awful family. And and you'd have another one and be like, oh my gosh, my parents are so great and and I feel so loved. And you're just like, what is going on? But I think a part of it is that we all experience love differently.

    Nick Adams [00:07:38]:
    And so just to your point, if you don't acknowledge that your kids are different and how you interact with them has to be different for them to feel that same level of nurture and love, then you end up with that kind of dynamic where you've got really different experiences coming out of the same home.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:55]:
    Now as you look at I mean, you're a busy guy. There's You've had a lot of things happen in your life. You run a camp for kids. And being as busy as you are, there's definitely this balance. There's balance that you have to find in your life to be able to do the things that are important to you professionally, but also being that engaged father, especially with 4 kids and having to raise 4 kids that are probably all going in different directions as they're getting older and getting involved in things. So talk to me about balance and how you were able to balance all of that and still be that dad you wanted to be.

    Nick Adams [00:08:30]:
    Well, you know, Christopher, I'd love to tell you I did a great job at that. I'm not sure that I did, but I did try. And you know, one of the things that I I talked about in the book is really the goal I don't think is to be perfect. It's to make progress and none of us are gonna do it perfectly. And, and I just, I acknowledge that through the years, I really probably didn't do that balance perfectly. But one of some of the things I really tried to focus on was being at all of my kids' events. I mean, my youngest daughter, I was actually doing a international trip and I missed her birthday. Now, never mind that I sent her to do one of her favorite things and, you know, paid for that to happen.

    Nick Adams [00:09:13]:
    And, but I wasn't there. And then when I got back home, I missed it by like 2 days. And when I got back home, we celebrate it. But probably for the next decade, just periodically, she'll remind me that I missed her birthday. You know? And and I just, I just laughed. I'm like, you know, honey, I missed one event out of your whole lifetime. The and that's why that stands out to you. It's because I was at all the other things.

    Nick Adams [00:09:37]:
    So but I think that's just super important. You know, my daughters were in gymnastics and they were in dance and there was competitions and there were shows and I just didn't miss any of those. And I really, I think I can say that honestly, I didn't miss any of those because those are just big events for them. And and so to be supportive, nothing was more important than that. And I think what is genuinely true for me is that my favorite thing in life is being bad. Like, there's not anything I do that I get more pleasure out of than being bad. And so that I think communicates to the kids that, you know, I'm not at their ballgame because I have to be there. You know, I'm I'm there because man, I wanna see what happens.

    Nick Adams [00:10:26]:
    I wanna watch you play. I wanna support you. I wanna be a part of your life. And so I think there are times yeah. I had to leave for work or I wasn't there every moment of their waking hours, but I did a lot of work to make sure that they were always supported in their events. And the other thing that we did as a family, my girls and my boys are kind of different ages. I got about 10 year age span between them. So I've got 2 sets of children almost.

    Nick Adams [00:10:54]:
    But my with the older kids, especially, we had dinner every night as a family. And that just, there wasn't a time that didn't happen when one of my girls was doing gymnastics and she didn't get out of gym until 8:30. None of us ate until she got home 15 to 9. And that's when dinner was because that was important for us to build that kind of connection and relationship. So those are some of the ways that I think I've tried to really balance career and busy and then family.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:26]:
    Now you mentioned the fact that you had you have a book that's called Being the Dad You Wish You Had, 5 Big Stones for Effective Fatherhood. And I guess, 1st and foremost, as a as someone that has written books in the past myself, I know how much time, effort, patience, and more go into the labor of love that becomes the One of the things that I've done is run some some businesses. I've run

    Nick Adams [00:11:57]:
    One of the things that I've done is run some some businesses. I've run businesses and nonprofits. And especially in the business community, I've got 2 construction oriented companies. And I found myself so I work predominantly with men. So I found myself pretty frequently saying to somebody, you know, they're they're a good worker. They've got pretty good skills. They just were raised by wolves. They have and what I always meant by that is they they just have no idea of how to engage with life.

    Nick Adams [00:12:28]:
    And although they're not really a terrible person that creates a lot of dysfunction around them because they just don't know how to live life and they didn't get what they needed as children. And I've said that through the years and I've tried to help my my employees and do different kinds of classes and just anything I can do to help kind of mentor and develop them. And so, and I don't think I've been particularly effective with any of that, but I've tried hard. And then one night we were sitting around the dining room table and we were answering conversation starters. And the conversation starter this particular night was if you could change anything in the world, what would it be? And like a bolt of lightning, I knew if I could change anything in the world, I would create effective fathers. Because if I could create effective fathers, I could change the world. And that became kind of the genesis of the book for me, is realizing that really what I wanted to do and what I believe would have the most impact of anything I could do would be to help create a situation where fathers could be more effective.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:33]:
    In sharing this out into the world, I know that you drew from your own experiences, and you put those experiences into the book. What were some of the biggest takeaways that you really wanted someone to take out of reading this as you walked in? And what are you finding now that it is out in the world and people are are reading it that they are pulling out of it?

    Nick Adams [00:13:56]:
    Yeah. I think really one of the biggest things kind of the 2 big things that I would want people to get out of the book and they're not like written as a part of a chapter, they're kinda just, I hope it's there, is that dads are really influential. They're very powerful. Now actually that is one of the chapters, but you know, that they just have a lot of influence. And if you as a father, just focus a little, you're going to make a difference in your kid's life because you have so much ability and so much influence to bring to their lives. So that's one thing. And then the other thing that I always want dads to realize, and I've said it already today is it's not about being perfect. It's about making progress.

    Nick Adams [00:14:39]:
    And I think because as fathers, I think we can just get so overwhelmed and feel like I don't know what to do next. I can't tell you how many times, you know, especially when the kids were in the 11 to 15 range. I just think, I just don't know what to do next. I've tried everything I know and man, it doesn't seem to be coming out the way I'd like to see it come out. And, and some days you just think, oh, this is way harder than anybody told me it was going to be. I had no idea this is gonna be so tough. And so I think the big part of the message is just to say, it's okay. You don't have to do everything perfect.

    Nick Adams [00:15:12]:
    You've gotta just keep making progress in the journey, and keep making those connection points with your kids, building relationship. And you can make some pretty good size mistakes as long as you'll own your mistakes and keep connected relationally, and you're gonna keep moving forward. And so that's really why the focus on the 5 big stones because I think there's some things if you get them right, then other things will fall into place. And it's not 20 things to do to be a great dad because that's overwhelming. You know, it's kind of, here's 5 ideas, 5 mentalities, 5 things to understand that then you can incorporate into your own life to become the person you wanna be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:51]:
    Now I know that you've incorporated these 5 stones into the what you've done with your own kids, your kids. And, yeah, I know your daughters have grown. They've flown. They've gone out of the nest and are out in the world doing different things at this point. Now that you're at a different phase in your fatherhood and you look back, what could you what could you have done different? Or what would you have done different now looking back? Or even looking at what you've written and what you've learned, what would you have changed?

    Nick Adams [00:16:17]:
    Wow. That is a great question. Looking back, I mean, I really do think what I just said is probably a big part of it. I think I would sweat less. I would worry just a little bit less and acknowledge that I'm making progress because I just feel like there's so much value in that. It it takes so much pressure off, which makes you probably more relational and and be more able to actually connect with your kids instead of being all about, you know, I gotta do this just perfect. So I think, really that's probably one of the big things I would change. Not just about painting, I'd change that about most of my life.

    Nick Adams [00:16:51]:
    I would go back and and just kind of relax a little bit and know that it's okay. I'm going to make mistakes and it's probably not going to be the end of the world. And then when it really is pretty seriously bad, you just own your stuff and go on.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:05]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Nick Adams [00:17:13]:
    I hope so. Sounds a little scary.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:15]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Nick Adams [00:17:16]:
    The first thing that comes to mind is relationship.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:18]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Nick Adams [00:17:23]:
    I have felt that with both of my daughters, one who chose to get out of college and come and work with me on a personal you know just daily level working in the camp and working with my speaking and writing and those kinds of things. Cause to me, a big part of success is having a relationship. And so the fact that she wants to be a part of what I'm doing was very much an, there was some success here. And then my older daughter has told me that I'm one of her best friends. And that to me is success.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:56]:
    It definitely is. Now, if I was to talk to your daughters, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Nick Adams [00:18:03]:
    That would be hilarious. I'd love to let you talk to them, and then I'd like to listen. But I think one of the things I did was ask them, because I knew I was doing this podcast with you and it was about, you know, fathers and daughters. And so I asked them, what are some things that were important to you? What were things that made a difference for you? And one of the things that both of them mentioned was something I shared earlier, just that you were always at our stuff. You made being there a priority. And then one of them said, you know, you made it easy to talk to you. I always knew I could come to you and tell you things and you weren't going to go crazy and overreact and that you would be able to listen to what's happening in my life and and support me emotionally. So they told me that I don't know what they would tell you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:50]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Nick Adams [00:18:52]:
    One of the people who has inspired me to be a better father. I just had the privilege of doing this funeral 3 weeks ago, but he had raised 2 of the kids that were in my youth group when I was a youth pastor long years ago. And they are now, you know, in their forties or whatever. But I just watched how effective he was with his kids. And at one point did a series of, of like small group classes on parenting. And I brought him in as the speaker and I watched his life. And so he was truly probably one of the people who I've learned the most from. His name is Paul Hively.

    Nick Adams [00:19:29]:
    Just you ask a name, there's your name.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:31]:
    Now you've given a lot of pieces of wisdom. Some things that you've learned along the way, some things that have worked, maybe some things that didn't work. And as you think about all dads that are out there and as we finish up today, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every father?

    Nick Adams [00:19:45]:
    I think one of the things that comes to mind today is just to acknowledge that your goal is to help parent your kids to be who they're supposed to be, Not to be who you want them to be or who you wish they would but to try to understand who they are and what their gifts are and their desires are, and then give them tools to become who they want to be instead of trying to create them and kind of the image you want them to end up as. Because really, we're not usually very effective if we're trying to create them in some image we have in our own mind as opposed to looking and seeing who they really are and then developing those gifts and talents that they have so that they can become the best version of themselves.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:31]:
    I really appreciate you sharing that, sharing your wisdom today with us. Now, if people wanna find out more about you and your book, where should they go?

    Nick Adams [00:20:38]:
    Well, they can get the book on Amazon. Just go to Amazon and search Being the Dad You Wish You Had. It's available as a digital book and as a paperback. It'll be coming out soon as a hardback and we're gonna do audio hopefully launching next month. So those are coming as well. And then you can reach me at info at being dash dad dot com. And that's also the website being dash dad dot com.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:04]:
    Well, Nick, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing your own story with your daughters, and I wish you all the best.

    Nick Adams [00:21:11]:
    Perfect. Thank you, Christopher. It's great to be with you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:13]:
    The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together dot org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong and powered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:04]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast, the time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the best that you can be.

  • Bruce Chamoff's Journey as a Podcaster, Entrepreneur, and Engaged Dad

    Bruce Chamoff's Journey as a Podcaster, Entrepreneur, and Engaged Dad

    · Dads With Daughters

    Embracing the Journey and Overcoming Challenges

    In a heartwarming conversation on the Dads with Daughters podcast, Bruce Chamoff, a seasoned podcaster and entrepreneur, shared insightful anecdotes about his journey as a father to his now 20-year-old daughter. As fatherhood is a unique and deeply personal experience, Bruce's revelations bring valuable lessons to the forefront, shedding light on the joys, struggles, and growth that come with raising a daughter.

    Welcoming Fatherhood: The Journey Begins

    It's not uncommon to feel a mix of excitement and bewilderment upon learning about pending fatherhood. Bruce's recollections of the day he learned he was going to be a father to a daughter paint a vivid picture of the emotions that accompany this pivotal moment. He beautifully captures the blend of enthusiasm and uncertainty that fathers often experience, highlighting the eagerness to embark on the journey of parenthood while simultaneously grappling with the vast unknown that lies ahead.

    Navigating Fears and Challenges: Insights from a Father's Perspective

    As Bruce shared his fears and concerns about raising a daughter, he echoed sentiments that many fathers can relate to. The apprehensions surrounding teenage years, the challenge of letting go, and the anxiety about protecting their daughters from potential heartbreak are universal themes. Bruce's candid reflections provide a platform for fathers to recognize and acknowledge their fears while learning to embrace the inevitable challenges that come with guiding their daughters through adolescence.

    Lessons Learned: Embracing Uniqueness and Understanding Balance

    One of the most poignant moments from Bruce's narrative revolves around the realization that children, especially daughters, will never mirror their parents entirely. This acknowledgment opens the door to a beautiful journey of comprehension and acceptance. By understanding their daughters' unique traits and embracing the differences, fathers can forge deeper connections, fostering an environment of mutual respect and understanding.

    The elusive balance between work and family life is a feat that many fathers strive to master. Bruce openly shared his experiences, acknowledging the struggle to balance his entrepreneurial endeavors with his responsibilities as a father. His insights underscore the importance of finding ways to integrate family into career pursuits, emphasizing the value of involving children in a father's professional endeavors as a means of nurturing work-life balance.

    The Impact of Podcasting: A Tool for Connection and Growth

    Podcasting has been a transformative force in Bruce's life, propelling him to connect with a global community and share his passions. Through podcasting, Bruce discovered a means to weave a rich tapestry of stories—a skill that also enhanced his role as a storyteller in his daughter's life. His experiences serve as an inspiration for fathers to explore creative ways to engage with their daughters, fostering deeper connections through shared interests and joint pursuits.

    Legacy and Continuation: Parenting and Professional Endeavors

    In a heartening turn of events, Bruce's professional journey subsequently intertwined with the personal domain, leading to a collaboration with his daughter on the World Podcast Network. This fusion exemplifies a harmonious blend of professional success and familial bonds, underscoring the significance of involving children in parents' passions and enterprises. Through this alliance, Bruce not only imparts invaluable skills and knowledge but also lays the foundation for his daughter's professional growth and development.

    Navigating Fatherhood with Intention and Love

    Bruce's narrative offers an array of insights and reflections on fatherhood that resonate deeply with fathers from all walks of life. His journey encapsulates the essence of fatherhood—embracing the unknown with open arms, embarking on a path of continual growth, and fostering enduring connections with daughters. His story serves as a poignant reminder that fatherhood is not solely about providing but also about nurturing, guiding, and fostering a legacy of love and understanding.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. You know, every week, I love being able to sit down with you, to talk to you, to walk beside you on this path that you're on in working to be the best dad that you want to be and working to make those meaningful connections that you want to make with your daughters. Why is it important? Well, it's important because you signed up for it. You signed up to be a dad. You signed up to walk on this path to be there with your kids. And sometimes the journey can be lonely. Sometimes the journey can be challenging.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:56]:
    And being able to learn from other dads, learn from other people, and understand that you're not alone is just part of the battle. I love also being able to bring you different people, different people that have gone through this journey themselves. They are going through this journey themselves and can share the experiences that they've had as a father because you're going to learn from them. And if you open yourself up to it, you'll probably take a few things away from it to be able to help you to be that dad you wanna be and to help you raise that daughter that you wanna raise. This week, we've got another great guest with us today. Bruce Chamoff is with us today. And Bruce is with the World Podcast Network. I love talking about podcasting, but we're not gonna be talking just about podcasting today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:43]:
    We're gonna be actually talking about Bruce's experience in being a father to a daughter. He's got a 20 year old daughter That also helps him with podcasting too by go down that pipe that path a little bit. But I'm really excited to have him on, to have him tell his story, and for you to learn from him. Bruce, thanks so much for being here today.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:02:02]:
    Hey, thanks, Chris. It was

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:03]:
    my pleasure. Know, one of the things that I love doing, 1st and foremost, is I love turning the clock back in time. I said that you had a 20 year old daughter. So I wanna turn the clock back maybe 21 years. You know, back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:02:19]:
    Well, I was at work, and my wife called me. Actually, we're not married now, but she called me at the time and she said, are you sitting down? And I didn't think of hearing that she was pregnant. So she said, I said, yeah. I'm sitting down. I'm pregnant. I was excited. I mean, I think every parent gets excited when they hear that, but they're also dumbfounded at the same time. And I had that going through in my mind.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:02:40]:
    And then right away, we were talking about names. And that was the whole conversation. And, yes, I was excited. But, you know, that you just wanna be a parent. And you know that the day you hear that you are going to be a parent, you want those whole 9 months to just fly by. And that's what was going through my mind. I'm like, okay. Yes.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:03:02]:
    I'm gonna be a dad. Yes. She's pregnant. Perfect. I wish that that 9 months would just come tomorrow. You know? And that was it. But it was a really good journey, that whole thing. I got that new dad book series.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:03:15]:
    I forgot who the author was. I was reading that, like, from literally the first week when I found out that I was gonna be a dad and I was prepared. And that was it. You know, the whole family was excited. I mean, you know how that whole thing goes.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:25]:
    So I talked to a lot of dads and a lot of dads say to me that in having a daughter, there's some fear that goes along with that. You talked about pulling out those books and reading and trying to immerse yourself and learning what you need to learn and trying to figure it out. But as you think about the moments you've had with your daughter and raising your daughter, what was your biggest fear in raising a daughter?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:03:47]:
    What I've been hearing about from most people, and that is, oh, love her right now because when she becomes a teenager, she's not gonna wanna know you. And then you gotta watch out for all the guys. And, of course, I'm thinking, well, I don't really care about that now. We're gonna go through 10 or 12 years of her not me not worrying about that and that's what happened. But when she hit about 13, she was acting like a teenager and that's when everybody says just watch the guys. They're gonna come. They're gonna blow on. I'm like, okay.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:04:12]:
    And I believe that's the big fear from

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:14]:
    It is scary. And now how did you get through that for yourself?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:04:18]:
    I mean, really, you can't prepare for that. You just have to go through it. My friend Jay has I forgot how old his daughter is now but it's funny because he was telling me I love my daughter. She says I'm the greatest dad in the world. I'm like, yeah, you know, my daughter told me that too. And after a while, it becomes sort of the opposite when it become a teenager. So just appreciate all the compliments she's giving you right now because those compliments will go away for at least 4 to 5 years, and then they'll come back. And then he said to me, well, I'm playing Roblox with her.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:04:49]:
    I said, oh, yeah. I played Roblox with my daughter. He says, they were around back then? I'm like, yeah. They're very big company. They're now public. They have a stock. People are investing in the stocks. Like, I didn't know that.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:04:58]:
    I'm like, yeah. I didn't know that either. But I'm now giving him advice that no one gave me because his daughter, I think, is about 5 years younger than mine. So what I went through and honestly, my daughter and I get along really well now. I'm excited to know what's going on in her life. She calls me almost every day. She's working for me on the podcast network. We get along great, and it's amazing.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:05:19]:
    I just said, Jay, it's gonna be a little bit of a ride when she becomes a teenager. And I tell all the dads, if your daughter is not a teenager right now and what people are telling you about your love her right now and appreciate all the love that she's giving you because when she becomes a teenager, she's not going to know you. And honestly, most people told me that. All I can say is you can't really prepare for that. All you can do is prepare yourself because you can't change your daughter. Your daughter's gonna go that way. She's gonna be influenced by peer pressure. She's gonna be influenced by other teenagers, and there's nothing you can do about that.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:05:51]:
    You can only change yourself as a dad and how you deal with it and just learn to accept it, know it's coming, and also you can take comfort in the fact it's gonna go away a couple years later. And that's what I thought as

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:02]:
    I mentioned, things are not always easy. As you said, you get into those teenage years and sometimes they could be bumpy, but there's heart there's times that'll go simply, and they just flow. There's times that will be challenging, and you get through those, and you push through those. What's been the hardest part for you in being a father to a daughter?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:06:21]:
    That's kind of a loaded question. I mean, I would say, probably, another mistake that parents make, and I made this too, and this is what the hardest part is, is trying to get your child, whether it's a son or a daughter, to be exactly like you. And I tell all the dads that's never going to happen. And you know what? My dad got ups. He got upset with me too because I wasn't into the things that he was into. And you have to realize that your child, especially a daughter, will never be like you. They'll have some of those traits. Right? Because they are your kid, but they'll never be exactly like you.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:06:52]:
    And, also, the mother, you're whether you're married or not, your co parent is not like you either. So your daughter is going to take some of those traits as well and your daughter is going to take some of the of the traits from your entire family that also might not be you. So the hardest part for me was, okay, determining how is she like me, how is she not like me, and how we actually end up in the middle and accept all those things that she's not like me? And I'm doing it. And it's it's really cool thing because now I'm learning from my daughter. My father told me when I was a kid that daddies know everything. And of course when you're a kid, you don't know much. You don't have an education. So you're going to believe that your father knows everything.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:07:27]:
    And then as I started growing up and learning computer programming, I realized my father doesn't know how to program. So now at this point, daddies don't know everything. And now my daughter is teaching me things that I never knew. So it's great. Learn from your kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:42]:
    You definitely can learn from your kids. I find that with my own daughters that I learn things from them, you know, sometimes things that I don't wanna know, but but you definitely are still learning things and growing with them. And and that's important because, you know, the the minute that you turn that off or the minute you're not willing to learn from others and from your daughters specifically, that's gonna close off the relationship. And so it's really important to be able to keep that relationship open in that regard. I know you're a busy guy, and you've got a lot of things going on. You're an entrepreneur. You you have this network that you're doing as well. You're doing a lot of different things, and you've been doing this for quite a few years.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:21]:
    So as you look at the life that you've had and all the different things that you have done, talk to me about balance and what you had to do, balance the things that you were doing outside of the house and what you were trying to be inside the house, to be that dad that you wanted to be.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:08:40]:
    I'll be honest with you. I'm not the best at balancing, and I'm still learning that as I go through my life. Work life balance, I understand is absolutely important in anybody's life. So especially people who work. And I'll be the first to admit that I'm a workaholic. And at times when my daughter was growing up, there were times that I worked so hard that I did neglect her and I was always there for her. I mean, anytime she needed me, I I jumped and stopped what I was doing. But I always worked so hard, and there were times when I said to myself, I just have to stop what I'm doing right now and just be a dad and not be an entrepreneur and not be a workaholic.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:09:20]:
    And it's it's hard because you're a workaholic for a reason, you know, it's just like an alcoholic, you cannot stop drinking alcohol that easily and workaholic is the same thing. So I learned to just cut myself off at a certain time. You know, when 5 o'clock came, I said, that's it. I'm done working. I know I have a lot of things to do. Still, I have a lot of unfinished projects that I wanna keep on working on. And it's not just about the work life balance. It's also for your own health and your own stress level.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:09:49]:
    If you're a workaholic and you find it hard to stop being that way, my solution is to force yourself to just stop working at a certain time of the day. If you have to set an alarm, which is what I had to do, the alarm goes off and that's it. You stop working and you spend time with your family and that's it. So that's what I've been doing. And, you know, I'm in I'm now in my fifties. So the one thing that's actually in my advantage, like, if if you're in your if you're in the older generation, your circadian rhythm, which is your sleep cycle, shifts to an earlier time of the day, which makes it easy to stop working later on that day. So I used to go from to start working at like 8 o'clock in the morning to now I start working at 4:30 in the morning. And that's easy for me to do, to get up that early.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:10:34]:
    But with that said, I also cannot work past 5 o'clock at night. So at that point, if a dad is in that particular age range, I would say probably 40 years in age of up and up, It's easy to get up earlier, to start working and stop working and then spend time with your family. So to me, I think that younger dads will have a hard time with the work life balance than older dads. That's my experience.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:00]:
    Now I know that I mentioned at the beginning that you're a podcaster. You run this network called The World Podcast Network. You've been podcasting for quite some time, and I am a podcaster. I'm a podcasting fan. And I know what drew me in to this genre. But you've been doing this for longer than I have. So talk to me about what drew you into podcasting from an early point and how that impacted you as an ad.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:11:28]:
    When I was in college, I wanted to join the college radio station, and that was Kean University in Union, New Jersey, which at the time was called Kean College. And I graduated in 1988. I love heavy metal. I still do. And my daughter and I have seen a lot of hard rock and heavy metal concerts, which I'm so happy that she was into that music for a long time. And it also made us a little closer having the music connection together. And I wanted to play my favorite heavy metal music, but I couldn't get on to the radio station because it was booked. All the DJs the radio station was just full of DJs and there was no there were no openings.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:12:07]:
    So life went on. I graduated college. I've got a I got a degree in marketing, and I got a couple of jobs. 2005 when everybody was buying the iPad, like, almost everybody had an iPad, and I realized podcasting was out there. I ignored it. And then I was in a bookstore and saw from Todd Cochran of the Blueberry Network, the book for introduction to podcasting. Like, oh, this is a real thing because there's a book here. I didn't think twice.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:12:35]:
    I just didn't even look at it, and I just took it off the shelf. It was a shiny silver cover with green lettering. You can't miss that among other books. The artwork on the front cover was just there to grab your attention and it did. And I read that book literally within a week. And I'm like, I'm starting my podcast. And I did. And that's when I started my first podcast called the Fresh Music Series which is I finally got to be the DJ to play my music.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:13:01]:
    Now I was on Long Island at the time and I went on to Craigslist and put in that I had a podcast. And And because I'm also a musician, I'm a songwriter, and I'm still putting music out. If anybody wants to check my music out on Spotify, it's just look up Bruce Chamble. So I wanted to promote my own music, but I'm like, I'm not gonna be selfish about this. Maybe I could get other podcasters to come on to my podcast. And I put that Craigslist ad out, and literally, I had about 10 bands saying, hey. Play my music. Play my music.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:13:30]:
    Play my music. Okay. But you have to first email me that I have your permission that you're not gonna sue me in copyright infringement. And they said, yeah, you have my permission. I have it in writing. I went ahead and put people's music on my podcast and not once did I get sued for that. So I'm happy about that. And then I realized that there is something called the pod safe music directory started by Adam Curry of MTV and I started downloading all that music.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:13:53]:
    But my main goal is to promote my own music and other local bands. And that's what I did. Being a web developer and a marketing visionary, I envisioned more than one podcast. And I figured maybe I should build a website. It wasn't called The Podcast Network yet, where I have multiple podcasts. I know there are other podcasters out there. So I built a website called the Long Island Podcast Network. And I called it a podcast network because I wanted to be like a radio network, a TV network, a network of podcasts.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:14:27]:
    There was no podcast network out there yet, So I coined the term. And from there, 100 of podcast networks have sprung up all over the world now. But I went back on Craigslist and put an ad out there to the community and said, if you have a podcast, sign up. Here's the link. And I got 20 podcasts literally within 2 2 months. And then I had to expand the network. I got health, sports, technology, business. I mean, everybody was doing all types of podcasts.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:14:55]:
    And then I got called by Newsday which is the biggest newspaper out there on Long Island. I'm like, do you wanna do an article on my network? I'm like, this is like huge. And they came to my house. They did a whole a whole photo shoot on me. I started the podcast network February of 2006, so exactly 18 years now. And then 11 months later in November, it came out. And I was, like, blown away. It was a it was a page and a half, and it's a huge network.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:15:18]:
    There was a band called The Mondays that was founded by a friend of mine or fronted by a friend of mine named Ken Carmen. He joined the network and they're a pretty big alternative band. They're really talented rock band. And I played saxophone with them a few times and that's it. Like, he he told other people, people joined. So it's great. Now to answer your other question, how did this affect me as a dad and my relationship with my daughter? I just decided to get my daughter involved. So my daughter was how old was she? She was 4 or actually yeah.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:15:48]:
    No. She was 3 at the time. And I'm like, you know what? Work life balance. If I'm gonna do this, I wanna get my daughter involved and I think that's another thing that my advice to dads are whatever you're doing, if you're a workaholic like me, find a way to incorporate your daughter into your work and make it fun because that's work life balance. Right? You don't it doesn't have to be just you. And here's a good example. When I was 8 years old, my father, he was a CPA. And when I was 8 years old, he was working very hard during tax season.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:16:19]:
    IRS needs everybody's taxes filed by April 15th. So he would get bombarded. He would be working overnight and overnight and overnight and he decided to incorporate me into his business. So he had me doing filing at 8 years old. And that's a good example. It doesn't matter what you're in. I mean, if you're if you're a busy lawyer, then somehow you must have law firm, law forms, right, people fill out. Have your daughter come.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:16:44]:
    Let her do some filing. Teach her early how to be an entrepreneur and find a way. And I got my daughter involved and it was just amazing. My daughter also and I, we we did have a podcast called the daddy and daughter podcast. It was only, like, 4 episodes, and it just it it didn't work after a while, but it's still out there on YouTube. So, no, that's what you gotta do.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:02]:
    It is what you have to do. And you have to find that not only for yourself, that niche for yourself. I mean, I run about 5 different podcast myself. I'm either hosting or producing, and each is just a little bit different. And it goes to that multi passionate aspect. I hear people talk about people being multi passionate and having those different things that are you're you're so passionate about. And and I guess for me, you you know, bringing your daughter in and having her involved right now, how is she involved with your podcasting network? And how is that framing what she wants to do with her life?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:17:36]:
    My daughter is the maintenance manager of the World Podcast Network. We have grown so fast. We have over a 1000 podcasts that now we need to do maintenance every single day. And my daughter does the maintenance. She looks at the analytics because we give podcasters analytics. You can see your downloads and everything else. I mean, just like Buzzsprout and Anchor and Podbean, they have their analytics. We have analytics as well, and so does Spotify.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:18:05]:
    So we keep data, like, we collect the data. And my daughter will look at the analytics, make sure that they're up to date, they're working well. Sometimes the podcasters, they don't like their analytics. So they say, well, why is this graphic high? Why is it low? And my daughter looks at that and she analyzes it, but she does other things too. Like, she'll she'll do some data entry for the podcast network. She'll run reports. She'll generate reports. And she has a whole admin screen and a collection of reports that she actually maintains.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:18:35]:
    And she does a really good job with it. So I'm really very proud and to have her working for me. And the other thing too is when I work for my dad, and he passed away in 2005, so maybe he rest in peace. I feel like I'm giving back to my father by having my daughter work for me. So it's coming around full circle, and I love that aspect of it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:54]:
    Now have a go going from where you were to where you are today, where do you go from here?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:19:00]:
    That's an interesting loaded question. I would have to say that we just keep on defining our mission and making our mission better and trying to help people. I mean, my mission is to help podcasters succeed in a lot of ways, growth, monetization, and just getting their message out, like, whatever the theme of their podcast is. And every podcast has a theme. The question is, are you reaching the right people? Are you reaching your target market? I mean, I'm a marketing guy, like I said, so I think in terms of target market and demographics and things like that. So, yeah, I think about how do I make The World Podcast Network better for the community? And how do I make The World Podcast Network help podcasters succeed? And I just sit down and plan out that goal and I build it. And then my team test it and we go back and forth with feedback and it's a cool thing, you know. That's why I keep going.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:51]:
    No. I love what you're doing and bringing podcasts together and being able to bring people together. Now podcasters are storytellers. And podcasts, to be honest, I mean, for anyone, are stories. And individuals that run podcasts love to tell stories or bring those stories out. As a father, you're a storyteller as well. And many times, fathers speak over the years, are oral tell storytellers in trying to help their daughters, help their kids in many different ways. How have you found that being a podcaster has influenced you as a storyteller, but also as a father in being able to better lead your own daughter in the ways of the world?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:20:37]:
    Interesting question. I mean, I'm a public speaker. I have absolutely no problems telling anybody anything in public. And to me, the more people I speak in front of, the better. And most people are the opposite. Right? Nobody likes most people don't like public speaking, but I love it. And my daughter has actually traveled with me in a few to a few places when I've spoken at WordPress conferences or WordCamps. She's traveled with me to Cincinnati and I don't don't I think she's I forgot where else she traveled me to, but she saw me and she said that she's not really a public speaker.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:21:12]:
    I don't think that she would get in front of people and speak at this moment in time. Maybe she'll change on that. But I really just love showing my daughter that I have no problem getting in front of a group of people and speaking. It's given me confidence. And she did tell me in Cincinnati that she was impressed with how I can just control an audience. I thought that was awesome.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:30]:
    Well, I really appreciate you sharing that. I think it's important and it's important to be able to see where you've been and where you are today and where you're going in the future. And that helps your own kids to be able to set a path for themselves. Now we all always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready? Very cool. Let's do it. In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:21:52]:
    I'll just call it joy.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:53]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:21:58]:
    Around 2006 when I started coaching her soccer team.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:02]:
    And what did you find in that that made you really feel that way?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:22:05]:
    Just the fact that my daughter and I connected in a particular activity that we could do together. I coached and she played. It was nice connection between the 2 of us. And also just the fact that, like I said before, we went to a lot of rock concerts together. I think my daughter and I have been to if I had to count, we've been to 6 concerts together, I think. And and that includes some pretty classic rock bands, like, we've been to the kids concert together too.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:26]:
    Now the question is is did you dress up like the band when you were there with the paint face paint and everything?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:22:32]:
    No. Not at all. But I did before like, I think in 1995, I did open up for Furley's Comet. So that was exciting. That was in New Jersey.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:40]:
    That's awesome. Now if I was to talk to your daughter, how would she describe you as a dad?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:22:45]:
    Hopefully, my daughter would describe me as a very caring dad and a very hardworking dad to make us successful and giving.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:53]:
    Now, who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:22:55]:
    My dad. That was an easy question.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:57]:
    Now you've given a number of piece of advice, a number of number of things that you've learned along the way that you've shared today. As we finish up, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:23:07]:
    As I mentioned, for the younger dads with younger kids, don't worry if they become teenagers and they stop talking to you. Just learn to accept it. Don't stress over it and know that that will go away when you become a little older and never stop loving them. No matter what they tell you, no matter how disobedient they are, just give them your heart and be patient with them and everything else will just fall into place.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:29]:
    Well, Bruce, I wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here. Now if people if people wanna find out more about you, your podcast network, etcetera, where should they go?

    Bruce Chamoff [00:23:38]:
    You can look up Bruce Chamoff on all the social media. LinkedIn, mostly. I'm on Facebook just like everybody else or a lot of people. And I'm just starting to get on the TikTok, but you can always go on to the world podcast network at well, podcast dot network and send me a contact form message.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:55]:
    Well, again, Bruce, thank you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing your own journey as a father, and I wish you all the best.

    Bruce Chamoff [00:24:00]:
    Thanks for having me, Chris. It was a lot of fun being on your podcast, so thank you so much. It's my pleasure too.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:06]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong and powered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:04]:
    We're all in the same boat, And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world. Choose them. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Cultivating Hope: A Dad's Role According to Jesse Bradley

    Cultivating Hope: A Dad's Role According to Jesse Bradley

    · Dads With Daughters

    When Jesse Bradley discovered he was going to be a father to a daughter after having three sons, he knew this would bring a unique set of delights and challenges. Jesse emphasizes each child as a unique gift, advocating a tailored approach in fostering connections that affirm a daughter's persona, building confidence amidst the ever-present peer pressures.

    **The Power of Presence and Words**

    One-on-one interactions form the core of Jesse's parenting strategy, offering a safe space for his daughter to share her thoughts and feelings. He recognizes the formative power of a parent's words and presence, which serve as a bedrock for a child’s development, especially before bed—a time both sacred and profound in the Bradley household.

    **Positive Reinforcement**

    In our podcast episode, Jesse shares personal experiences of affirming his daughter's worth and building her confidence, with a reminder to parents about the potency of positive reinforcement. His intentional interactions include daily prayer and reading sessions, maintaining an equitable balance between tenderness and honesty.

    **Grappling with Challenges**

    Jesse opens up about his insecurities in not understanding his daughter's world, from hair care to jewelry. He advises parents to lean into these differences and learn from their children, rather than maintaining a distance. Adjusting parenting methods to match the child's pace is also key, as Jesse demonstrates by embracing his daughter's composed approach to life.

    **Cultivating Hope**

    On the critical notion of hope, Jesse advocates for relational, habitual, and thoughtful practices to instill a strong sense of optimism in children. These practices are deeply relational, requiring attentiveness and intentional affirmations from parents.

    **Wisdom for Fathers**

    Jesse's advice encompasses being 'tough and tender,' encouraging dads to support their children's pursuits without trying to control them. He suggests a reflective approach to one's natural tendencies and emphasizes the significance of an honest and humble approach in parent-child relationships.

    In our introspective conversation, Jesse Bradley's insights serve as a reminder that fatherhood is a continuous journey marked by growth, learning, and unconditional love. His experiences and guiding principles stand as a beacon for dads navigating the waters of raising daughters in a world filled with emotional and spiritual complexities.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:15]:
    Welcome back to Dads with Daughters where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, every week, you and I are on a journey together. I've told you this before, and I'll tell you it again. You know, I'm a father of 2. My kids are in their teenage years and in college. Your kids are gonna be at different places, but we all are on that journey together as we raise our daughters to be those strong, independent women that we want for them to be successful and to find that path for themselves. It's not always going to be easy.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:53]:
    The journey is not always going to be a straight line, But it is something that we all go through. And it is so important that we are able to have these conversations and that you can learn and grow from the conversations and the people that we have here every week. I love being able to bring you different people, be people with different perspectives, different fathers, mothers, other people with resources that can help you on this journey, that can help you to make that journey just a little bit easier because you do not have to do this alone. I've said that before and I'll say it again. Fatherhood does not have to be a solo experience. Sometimes it may feel that way. Sometimes you may feel like it should be that way, but it doesn't have to be that way, and it shouldn't be that way. There are so many dads that are out there right next to you, your next door neighbors, the people around you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:45]:
    And by reaching out, by talking, by sharing, by being a little vulnerable Yes, I said the v word, vulnerable. You can definitely do so much to be able to help yourself to be that dad that you wanna be. Today, we've got another great guest with us. Jesse Bradley is with us today, and Jesse is a speaker. He's an author. He is the lead pastor of of Grace Community Church, and we're gonna be talking to him about being a father of 4, as well as the, some of the things that he does on a daily basis and working with dads, but also working with just people in general. And I'm really excited to be able to have him here and talk about his own experience. Jesse, thanks so much for being here today.

    Jesse Bradley [00:02:26]:
    Christopher, it's an honor to join you. I've been looking forward to this. Thanks for all you do to encourage and to equip dads and really parents because we need help. We really do. I'm not joining you as a guest as someone who has all the answers or has it together. We're lifelong learners and parenting is truly an adventure. But we can encourage each other, I think through stories, through things that are working in one home are probably gonna work well in another home. And thank you for connecting dads too.

    Jesse Bradley [00:02:55]:
    Because like you said, the temptation I think is to drift, to be isolated. And with isolation, that's never the isolated. And with isolation, that's never the best spot to be. And we wanna come together and you've created community. So thanks for all you do. You've been very dedicated and devoted, and we appreciate it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:10]:
    Well, I really appreciate you saying that. Now first and foremost, one of the things I love doing is I wanna turn the clock back in time. And I know you've got 4 kids, you've got one daughter, 3 sons, and your daughter's 13 now. So I wanna go back, let's say 14 years. I wanna go back to the very beginning when you found out that you were going to be a dad to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Jesse Bradley [00:03:29]:
    Well, you know, that's an interesting story because we had had 2 boys. We'd also had 3 miscarriages. So we had really been on a roller coaster ride, and that helped us realize that every child is a gift. I believe that with all my heart. Every child is unique, wonderfully made, and truly a gift. Now with our 3rd child, when we showed up to find out, is it going to be a boy or a girl? The assistant who had the view of the picture, the first words out of her mouth were, oh, boy. And that's not probably what you wanna say when it's gonna be a girl because literally she looked at the picture and said, oh, boy. And my mind went to, well, here comes boy number 3.

    Jesse Bradley [00:04:11]:
    And then a few seconds later, she said, you're gonna have a girl. And I was like, wait, what? So it was a gender reveal that went one direction, faked us out, head fake, and then we came back and a girl. I knew this was gonna be a really different experience than the boys. Of course, there's a lot of commonalities, but I also knew this would balance our home a little more. With 3 boys right now and a girl, we were intentional to get a girl dog. Just, you know, trying to balance out the home a little bit. But I was excited. My wife had a name in mind, and it just seemed to come together well.

    Jesse Bradley [00:04:48]:
    And such a blessing. I'm so grateful for Lily.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:51]:
    Now each child is unique. You've got 4 kids, and you have to take that time, spend that time to connect on an individual level. When you have 4 kids and you have a daughter, you have 3 sons, what are you doing to make those unique bonds with your kids and especially the bond that you want to have with your daughter?

    Jesse Bradley [00:05:11]:
    That's a great question. It's easy to always be in a group, and you really need that one on one time. I like the phrase be intentional because a lot of times your child might not come to you and share everything they need, and they're hoping that you're going to pursue them. And that time for me that's been consistent is before bed. I feel like there's something about that last hour where people are a little more open, honest, share feelings, let their guard down, and that's been consistent for us and we do a couple different things during that time, but sometimes it's playful. We started playing catch with one of her stuffed animals that's round. And then we started keeping score. And eventually, what's our record? And we made it up to a couple hundred, but that was just kind of a fun thing we started doing.

    Jesse Bradley [00:06:00]:
    And I thought, okay, my daughter isn't into sports like I was, and that's okay. In fact, she's the exact opposite. I wanted to do sports with teams, scores, balls. She doesn't want anything to do with stress, competition. Like, she would prefer to just go for a run, enjoy a run, or a hike, or something, swimming. She would just swim for hours. She doesn't wanna race, but she would just be in the water for hours. She likes to swim, learn how to swim.

    Jesse Bradley [00:06:28]:
    So we're very opposite when it comes to sports. And this is just one of those playful things we did and started to she has a lot of stuffed animals, and I don't even know how we started. But, she learned to catch through that. And that was one thing we did. But more than that, during those times together, I listened to her how she's doing. I try to speak a lot of words of affirmation because especially middle school and even slightly before that, there's a lot of pressure. There's a lot of peer pressure. Sometimes kids tear each other down.

    Jesse Bradley [00:07:00]:
    Are you cool enough? How do you look? Do you fit in? And they're bombarded. And sometimes by the end of the day, they can just feel like I don't measure up and you know who I am is just not gonna work. And I try to come in with that voice of affirmation. And let me tell you, children need the affirmation. If you have a critical spirit and you're just always finding the areas that, you know, you don't think they're doing well and you lead with that and you overemphasize that, it tears them down on the inside. Yes. We do need to hold them accountable on some areas and bring out the best in some areas, but a lot of it is the affirmation. And I can just see there's a security with dad's voice.

    Jesse Bradley [00:07:42]:
    When I see things, and I'm not saying things just to flatter. I'm not saying things that are half true. Like, sincerely, what I see in her, it's so wonderful. And I put words on it. I don't just have that thought, but I put words on it. It builds up a security for her. And I think what it does is give her confidence that she doesn't have to chase after everything that her peers are chasing after. And she really is one of our children who has seen through the games and seen through some of the, you know, emptiness of just trying to be cool.

    Jesse Bradley [00:08:18]:
    And there's been a security and a confidence that she's had. And I I think that the affirmation of parents on her character, on her effort, on her creativity, on her kindness, on her intelligence, like, just all the wide range, you know, her face. One of the things we do before bedtime is is just a short time of prayer, or we like to read. Now we've read read a lot of different stories, but we also read, like, the Bible, and we wanna build her up. And when I think about parenting in that time, and I know I'm focusing on that time before bed, but that's been daily for as long as I can remember. Since she was just an infant, it's every night we're there in that time. And sometimes it's my wife and I. Sometimes it's just me.

    Jesse Bradley [00:09:06]:
    Sometimes it's just my wife and the longer one. Both parents are there, but it's just one will stay longer. But that is intentional with every kid. And 1 on 1, that's where they really they don't have to look around and say, okay. Are my siblings listening? What are they gonna think of me? They just pour out their heart. And when they feel safe, create that safe environment where they can talk to you about anything. And if you start that early on, then when the teenage years come, that's already part of the culture and the conversation. They're just gonna keep coming with that.

    Jesse Bradley [00:09:37]:
    And when they do, that's a gift. When they share their heart with you, that's a gift. And by being there to listen, sometimes it's not so much what I say, although the affirmation's important. It's just creating that safe place and listening. And as she starts to share about what she's thinking and feeling, just listening to understand, asking questions, drawing her out, She's a little more introverted than we have 2 extroverts, 2 introverts. And the extroverts just start to talk. And with those extroverts, you know exactly where they are. But the introverts, you have to kinda stop, ask them a question, give them time to think, ask them another question.

    Jesse Bradley [00:10:13]:
    I'm an extrovert, so that's not as natural as it should be. I think it's important to be quick to listen, slow to speak. I'm often the opposite. I'm quick to speak, slow to listen. So I've got to turn it down, ask questions, be silent, and then ask more questions. I've heard it said, you ask how someone feels. Say, how do you feel? And then you say, well, how do you feel about that? And then you say, well, what are your thoughts on that? You might have to ask a couple times to go deep. But once you create that trust, and all relationships come down to trust.

    Jesse Bradley [00:10:43]:
    And with your kids, do they really trust you? And when the trust is there, they open up and they share. And when they do that, that's a gift. And how you respond is important. And I love it that, you know, my daughter has said, I feel like I can, you know, talk about anything. That doesn't mean that she doesn't sometimes try to keep things secret or, like, we have a perfect relationship, but there's a trust that's deep and she shares deeply. One of the most precious gifts she gave me is a little coupon and she said, dad, this coupon is for infinite number of times coming into my room. And I mean, even this week, I got that years ago. It's at my desk.

    Jesse Bradley [00:11:25]:
    You know, this coupon's good for infinite visits to my room. Anytime, any and I come into her room and I'll say, well, Lilz, I just came in today because, well, you gave me that coupon for infinite visits. So I'm coming in for a visit and it's kind of playful at this point, but it's so sweet. It's so dear. And but we like to joke around and she has the way the heat is distributed in our house, it's not equal. And she has the warmest room in the house. And in the winter months, you know, in Seattle where there's a lot of rain and so forth, and I just come in there. I'm like, Lils.

    Jesse Bradley [00:12:01]:
    And she'll kind of say, do you just come in because I'm a warm room or do you wanna talk to me? You know, we we just play around with that kind of stuff, but we keep it light, we keep it fun, but then we also go deep. It's a both and. And I think a both and is really good. When you can laugh, you can cry, you can share your hurts, you can share what you're excited about, you can pray. Like, the wide range, that is rich. And I know for me, and I'll let you talk a little bit because I just got into these sweet times with my daughter. But when I think about being a dad, yes, there's protection. Yes, there's provision.

    Jesse Bradley [00:12:39]:
    Yes, there's the physical activity we do. And there's a lot of different components. But for me, what's close to my heart is the emotional connection and also the spiritual connection. And I think when I consider the fullness of fatherhood, like, how am I involved in all the different parts of her life to build her up, to encourage her? And I think a lot of times, it's when that emotional or spiritual connection happens that we feel the closest. And I like to go there. And that probably ties in, because parenting, I think, really starts when you're a kid, and it's your experiences with your parents, and that shapes you. And you either see things you wanna imitate or you see things that weren't there and you really wanna bring. And I think, for me, it's all connected.

    Jesse Bradley [00:13:28]:
    And I love the opportunity to have those times with my daughter. We almost always leave grateful. We leave appreciating each other. We leave those times just feeling joyful. Like, there's a smile, there's a laugh, and it's sweet.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:44]:
    I appreciate you sharing that. Now I know that in talking to a lot of different dads, there are sometimes some fear that comes with having a daughter, raising a daughter, and every person's fear is a little bit different. What would you say has been your biggest fear in raising a daughter?

    Jesse Bradley [00:14:01]:
    That's a great question. I would say a couple of aspects. 1 you're right is that I know what it's like to be a boy. I don't know what it's like to be a girl. And when you have a child that's the opposite gender, for example, her hair. I don't know how I don't even have any hair right now. But, like, how do I help her with her hair as a kid? You know? And it's like, oh, dad. That's too hard on my hair, the the snarls and trying to get that worked out.

    Jesse Bradley [00:14:28]:
    And how do I talk about jewelry? How do I talk about painting your nails? How do I talk about things that I just wasn't into and I didn't do? And so she's already different in terms of gender, and then she's different in terms of she loves to read. She will go through book after book after book after book. When I was a kid, I felt like reading was very slow. I knew it was good, but that was challenging. She loves to read. She loves to draw. I joked with her that you passed me up at about age 5. You know, she could draw a better picture than I could as an adult.

    Jesse Bradley [00:15:06]:
    She's so talented as an artist and her creativity. And I was terrible at drawing. I still am terrible. So when you start adding all these different things up, it can touch on the insecurities that I have as a dad. Or can I really be a great dad if her talents are different, her interest is different, her gender is different, like, all these things are different? How am I going to support her well? These are not my areas of expertise, right? Like, if she wants to talk about a, b and c, I can do that. But she's into a lot of things that I don't know much about. So here's I think a key is don't stay distant in those areas. It's okay that I'm much lower than her, or I don't know much.

    Jesse Bradley [00:15:52]:
    Like, when she liked Pokemon as a kid, or she you know, it's like, I don't know anything about Pokemon. Like, Warrior Cats, I don't know anything about that series. But so just, I own it that I don't know anything. Okay. Lils, teach me a little bit about this. And then we turned it into a fun game because with warrior cats, it's like, oh, they all have 2 word names. And so I would say, Lilz, like, would this be a good word? Like thunderpaw, you know, or something like that. And it it just got to be playful.

    Jesse Bradley [00:16:24]:
    So that's that's one is realizing that we have a lot of differences, but don't let those differences become a distance where I'm not entering in. And it's okay to come in with a lot of questions and learning and just be playful with it. I think the other thing for me that I found internally is that I naturally wanna protect her a little more. Now sometimes that's good, probably sometimes it's not as good. But with, like, let's say boys start to have an interest in her, I wanna protect her. Like, that's my daughter. Like, something's awakened in me that even more than the boy is, not that it should be, but, you know, she can stand on her own. She's strong, but I feel an extra, that's my daughter.

    Jesse Bradley [00:17:08]:
    I'm gonna protect her. And, you know, any boys that come around or any threats or someone's picking on her, like, I feel like I'm gonna enter right in on that. So, those are, you know, some differences I probably noticed. But with the first two boys, they are up lots of energy. Like they want to do things. They want to go, go, go. And I had to get them to a park early in the morning and it felt like a park a day, you know, at elementary school. Like we we've got to get the energy out quickly.

    Jesse Bradley [00:17:36]:
    And her pace was a little different. She moves slower. She likes to sleep in. She wants to talk. She wants to start maybe more relationally, whereas the boys are looking for something physical and just picking up on these differences. I they weren't, like, planned ahead of time, but it was like, okay, this is gonna be a different rhythm with her. And it almost felt easier in some ways, because I don't know how to describe it exactly, but I just felt like we were being together. We were just being, and that was really, really good.

    Jesse Bradley [00:18:08]:
    Whereas maybe the boys, it was a little more on like, so what are we gonna do? What are we doing? And she could just sit in that being for longer. And that was another thing I picked up on early on. So those are some initial thoughts, but you're right. It was different. And, of course, it's not just gender, but, you know, different kids have different interests and passions and pace and all of that. But, yes, it was different.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:31]:
    Now, I know that you have a new book called The Power of 2nd Sight, How to Live with Indestructible Hope. And I know that hope is something that you talked to a lot of people about, not only within your church but just in speaking and and working with people. And sometimes with kids, under helping them understand hope, helping them understand what that means and how that impacts their lives may not be always tangible.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:01]:
    So talk to me about hope. And how are you working with your own kids? How are you working with other people to help them to better work with their kids, to understand the power of having hope and how to help their kids to kind of hone that hope within their life.

    Jesse Bradley [00:19:21]:
    Yes. Thank you for bringing up the topic of hope. It's really vital. Hope is essential. Hope is that confident and joyful trust in someone or something. When people have hope they feel alive, they're motivated. And what we see now, I looked at a recent study at UCLA that there's a 5th of high school students that are thinking about suicide. I I mean, we live in a time, especially the last few years since the pandemic, where there are so many people that are feeling hopeless.

    Jesse Bradley [00:19:49]:
    I remember the Census Bureau said 48% of Americans feel hopeless, less, and our kids are struggling with that. It's a generation with a lot of technology, but not always a lot of connection. And how do we come alongside kids and build up hope? Hope, it's linked to a lot of different things. I like to say hope is available to everyone. This is not just vague hope or hope that randomly comes and goes, but hope is relational. It's tied to your quality of your relationships. I think that's what parents, friends, God, I think that relational aspect's important. Also, hope is habitual.

    Jesse Bradley [00:20:29]:
    There's habits you can cultivate. So when we get together before bedtime, that's a hope time together. Right? When we have certain things we do together that are positive and their habits ingrained, they're worked into our schedules intentionally. Those bring hope. So hope can increase, hope can decrease. And you can tell when someone has hope. You can see it in their eyes. Some people are alive, and there's almost a fire in their eyes, and some people are glazed over in despair.

    Jesse Bradley [00:20:57]:
    And we need to come alongside kids and help them discover hope. And I think that can happen, in it starts with a parent and I think it relates to our our thoughts. I say the power of the second thought is that you can replace the negative first thought. Because we have thousands of first thoughts every day. And how do you replace it with an intentional second thought? Let's say you're parenting and the kids are pushing your buttons, and you're getting really frustrated. You might feel like, oh, I don't wanna be around these kids. And you have these thoughts about your kids that are not good. Right? And what can you do? Intention replace it with a second thought.

    Jesse Bradley [00:21:37]:
    Where we started today, my child is a gift. My child is so important to me. Or when you start to distance from your kid, you need to have that second thought. Like, the most important thing is my child needs to feel connected. And you go back to that connection and you reconnect. My child's more important than my phone. My child's more important than my job. My child's more important than my own hobby right now.

    Jesse Bradley [00:22:01]:
    And those intentional thoughts, they redirect us and we remember our priorities. We get the right perspective and we have hope and then hope starts to flow out of those thoughts. Well, a child has a lot of thoughts and during the day. And there's gonna be a lot of thoughts running through their mind. And those negative thoughts when they recognize those and start to replace those. And as a parent, you provide thoughts that are true and you build up your child. I think parenting is very conversational. There are intentional times.

    Jesse Bradley [00:22:35]:
    Like, I love the time my daughter and I went to the daddy daughter dance. You know, we celebrate that with a picture. And, you know, she's drawn a picture from the actual picture. We've gone to New York City together and including her in those longer extended times where it's just my daughter and I. Those are amazing. During those times, I want to be saying things that bring hope to her. And when she starts to hear those, then she'll start to believe those more. She'll start to own those and realize those.

    Jesse Bradley [00:23:04]:
    And when I talk about how special she is, every child's different. For my daughter, words of affirmation are very important. And when I start to bring those, now she has those and she's hearing that. And that's gonna help her what she believes and what she believes about herself, what she believes about her talents, and all those things are connected to hope. Affirmation, I think, is one of the ways that I can bring hope to my daughter. And when that foundation is strong, when she knows that God loves her, mom loves her, dad loves her, she knows these are her talents. She knows, that she is special in these ways. When all those things start to come together, there is a foundation of hope that is solid.

    Jesse Bradley [00:23:56]:
    And it's like that house on the rock and not the sand. And that's what kids need today. Can they do it all themselves? That's a tall order. But who has more influence than parents? I like to look at it this way. There's a lot of things I do that a 100 other people can do. If I'm not pastor Grace Community Church, there'll be a 100 resumes in tomorrow. During the day, there are all kinds of things. There's only one person that can be Lily's dad.

    Jesse Bradley [00:24:26]:
    Only one. And if you're the only one that can play any given role in life, right, I'm the only one that can be Laurie's husband. I'm the only one that can be Joel's dad. Like, if you're the only one that can, that tells you, like, this role is incredibly significant. And I don't think anyone shapes hope more in a child's mind and heart than the parent. And yes, the parent has an incredible privilege, an incredible opportunity to build up hope. And we do that, you know, in a number of ways. But notice your child because this is relational.

    Jesse Bradley [00:25:05]:
    It's not a formula. Yes. I think there's some best practices. I think the words you say, their soul, the affirmations you give, the connection you have, the way you listen, recognizing their strengths, all those things build hope. And that voice of a parent, I remember our very first child, and his name's Joel. When he was born, he was fussing and came out screaming and fussing, and the doctors could not get him to settle down. And then I walked over to where he was, and I just said, Joel, it's okay. And just like that, everything calmed down.

    Jesse Bradley [00:25:43]:
    He was fine going forward. And I realized in that moment the power of a parent's voice. So my encouragement to dads is just check your tone, check your words, check your affirmations, and realize that you're a hope leader. You're the one that's gonna lead your child to more hope and that you bring that in that role right there. It's a spot where no one else can fill. No one else has the same influence and be intentional. And it's worth really maybe reading for some. The Power of Second Thought is a book I wrote, but there's so many good resources.

    Jesse Bradley [00:26:19]:
    And I've got some other ones on jessebradley.org that talk about how to interact with children and build that hope. But my encouragement to you is start with your listening and start with your words. Start with your time. And when you invest the time, it's quality time, you choose your words that bring hope and you listen. And that combination right there, when a child feels heard and loved, and they have truth statements that they can hold on to that are solid, that's a hope foundation. It's so much more than a feeling, and you can help your child have a solid foundation of hope.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:54]:
    Now going beyond helping your child to find to have that solid foundation of hope, many times in a father's life, a man's life, there will be things that will rock that foundation, that will challenge them in many ways and may shatter the hope that they have, the hope that they have as a father, the hope that they have as a as a man. And what do you say to those people, The people that are listening and that are losing hope for themselves about what they're seeing in their own family, that what they're seeing in the relationships that they have, let's say, with their daughter. What are you saying to them to be able to either regain that hope or move back toward a pathway to be able to have hope in their life?

    Jesse Bradley [00:27:41]:
    So great insight, Christopher, because how we're doing is directly related to how we parent, and all of us, every day, every year, hopefully, we're growing, We're learning. We're healing. There's restoration. Personally, I think of 2 times during my life that were significant. 1 is going off to Dartmouth College and having success on the outside, but emptiness on the inside. And I'll tell you, you know, I was in an Ivy League school getting good grades, had a lot of friends. We won the Ivy League title for soccer, and I couldn't figure out what's happening on the inside. Why do I feel so empty? And I like to say there's the outside story.

    Jesse Bradley [00:28:17]:
    There's the inside story. People see the outside story like on social media. You post some pictures, they see you at work, they have a a sense of who you are. But the inside story, people might not know what's really going on. Now your child might have a sense of it. But for me, at that time with that emptiness, I took a class. It was introduction to world religions. I read the Bible for the first time.

    Jesse Bradley [00:28:38]:
    I started to learn about this is relationship, not religion. I was an atheist. In my family, Baskin Robbins, 31 flavors. We love each other. We're very close. A lot of different views and beliefs, and we have great conversations. But for me, I reached a point where I went from thinking there's no God out there to there's a personal God who loves me. And that is like an anchor for the soul.

    Jesse Bradley [00:29:00]:
    And all of a sudden I, on the inside, felt this joy I'd never felt. I felt like I'm not alone. Anxiety went down. Like, there were just so many shifts that happened through that. So faith is one thing for everyone to really consider. And, of course, as a parent, you might be thinking, what do you want to pass along to your children? They're gonna make their own decisions. But how do you want to introduce them to the spiritual life or to faith or talking about God? That's an important consideration as a parent, and you might think back to your own childhood. Again, maybe some things you saw and didn't like in church and you wanted them to stay away from those or some things were really valuable and foundational for you that you wanna pass along.

    Jesse Bradley [00:29:43]:
    And that can be a great gift for a child. Also for me, I played professional soccer and then there was tragedy. In Africa, I took a prescribed medication to prevent malaria, built up toxic levels in my system. I was fighting for my life for a year, and it took 10 years to fully recover. And during those dark moments, sometimes the greatest experiences can come out of those painful times. And for me, one of the shifts that I needed to make is that I had a performance based identity. And I was always thinking, what can I do better? How do I do it better? And my sense of worth and value was linked to my performance. And that wasn't challenged until I physically couldn't do anything.

    Jesse Bradley [00:30:24]:
    And at that point, I had to make a shift because if you're performance based identity, you're going to be on a roller coaster ride of pride and shame, inflated, deflated, And ultimately, you're gonna pass it on to your kids. And yes, it was positive in terms of my athletics and my academics. But when my parents got divorced at age 7, that was something that was so deep and painful and I couldn't control that I looked at life and thought, well, what can I do? And how can I do it better? And I didn't really enter in emotionally or grieve, but instead I tried to achieve. And you can't achieve everything in life. You can't if your identity is linked to achievement, it's a cruel trap. And I never realized that until my twenties. And that shift right there freed me to a grace based identity, and I'm already loved. And that was one that was so profound and hit on so many levels.

    Jesse Bradley [00:31:16]:
    And I highlight these things to say we're growing. And as an adult, I continue to grow. There's shifts I make with gratitude, where I'm intentional. I call it a gritty gratitude, giving thanks when you don't feel like it. You know, that's a habit. But it's an important one. I was someone who fought emotions, didn't wanna enter in. I thought grieving.

    Jesse Bradley [00:31:38]:
    Who wants to do that? That's not fun. And and I tried to avoid that. And maybe it's grown up in Midwest. Maybe it's my family. Maybe it's me personally. But I had to learn how to go there. And I'll tell you, maybe that's if you're listening to it and you're a dad, maybe that's something that is still new to you. But how important is that as a dad to identify how I'm feeling, to be able to talk about it, share it, work through it, receive healing and that process right there.

    Jesse Bradley [00:32:08]:
    See, if my focus or my approach to emotions is that you just keep them all away and you stuff them and you put them in the trunk. Well, then what am I gonna bring to my daughter when she has emotions? Like, am I gonna coach her to say, no, you can't feel those. And and I'm gonna try to solve all the time right away. And I'm gonna try to compartmentalize. And I'm gonna try to stuff it. It's like, no, that's gonna backfire. So I had to figure out how to work through my own emotions and not be in denial. And that might sound simple as a concept, but I'm telling you practically, I didn't know in prayer how to give my burdens to God.

    Jesse Bradley [00:32:49]:
    I didn't know how to let people in. I had a view of God that He's only interested in things that are going well. He doesn't want to come into my, you know, doubts or my despair. And when I started to let people in and and receive that love, and when I started to work through my emotions, it brought a level of health personally for me, but then also changed my parenting because now I can help my kids with the emotional side of life. And we call it big feelings. We all have big feelings. So what are you gonna do when you feel angry? How are you gonna handle it? I can't take my kids to where I don't go personally. So if I don't know how to work through anger, then how am I gonna guide my kids? If I don't know how to work through grief and sadness, how am I gonna guide my kids? And I think that combination of that transparency, when I'm transparent, vulnerable, like you said, with my kids, and they can see that, you know, in an age appropriate way, And then I can share how that affects me, but then how I respond and what's true about that, but then also how I walk through that.

    Jesse Bradley [00:33:56]:
    When I can do that with my kids, now that's gonna set them up for success, and they're gonna have that coaching in a way through their own emotions. And so as a parent, don't stop growing and then help your kids to walk through the intense challenges emotionally, spiritually and relationally. That to me, that section right there in life where it's emotional, it's relational, it's spiritual, that intersection, a lot of parents don't go there. And I can't tell you how valuable it is to go there. And I didn't have that a lot of times as a kid, but that's maybe create a passion for me as a parent. That's what I wanna help my kids navigate. That space right there. And so that's a longer answer, but I'm so glad you really touched on it because if we think parenting is just answers for a program, we've missed it.

    Jesse Bradley [00:34:53]:
    We are human beings and we are intellectual, emotional, relational, spiritual. And the more of that fullness that comes in personally as you grow and then you connect with your kids and you share that together, that's the richness of life right there and the richness of parenting.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:11]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where we ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Jesse Bradley [00:35:18]:
    Right on. Let's go. Christopher, I like the way you do this.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:21]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Jesse Bradley [00:35:23]:
    It's love because I don't think there's anything greater in this world. I don't think there's a close second. It's love. And what they need more than anything is your love. Yes. Love does include truth. Love has setting good limits and boundaries and accountability and all that. But deep down, does your child know that they are loved and how loved they are? There's something about kids that pick up on that.

    Jesse Bradley [00:35:46]:
    And if they feel second rate, they just know where love's coming from. And that's the most important thing you can bring, authentic love.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:54]:
    Now when was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Jesse Bradley [00:35:59]:
    Wow. I guess in some ways I feel like this is a marathon. And so it's too early to celebrate because I'm going to be her dad all my days. And I don't think being a parent stops at age 18. I mean, for some kids, they certainly want more and need more beyond that. But what does success look like? How do I measure that? That's a great question. And that's a deep question. I've said before in this conversation that she enjoys spending time with me.

    Jesse Bradley [00:36:29]:
    She feels a deep connection with me. She also can talk about anything with me. Those are maybe milestones. Those are things to celebrate. And I've heard it said this way. Here's the road trip test. Would you like to get in the car and take a road trip across the country and then come back with someone? And I would say this, I think both my daughter and myself, if we said, should we do a road trip across the country together? We both said, like, yeah, let's do it. And that enjoyment of each other, I can just see that look in her eyes.

    Jesse Bradley [00:37:05]:
    It's just like that endearing tone. She's like, Oh, dad. We I do dad jokes and it's a fine line between dad jokes and dud jokes. But just that in her voice, that tenderness, that look in her eye, that fun we have together, and we both just really enjoy each other.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:37:21]:
    Now, if I was to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Jesse Bradley [00:37:26]:
    Well, that's a great question too. We should almost include them and bring them in for that one. It might embarrass me. There's a phrase, yum, you're embarrassing me, and that's playful. But it's like, if I ever embarrassed them, they can just say yum and we don't have to give you a long discussion. You know, it's just yum. So they might have some funny ones with me. My daughter likes to poke fun.

    Jesse Bradley [00:37:47]:
    Like, I like Greek yogurt, and she thinks it's the worst smell in the world. So, you know, so you might say dad likes Greek yogurt. So point to some of the idiosyncrasies. I'm bald, so I probably wear, you know, a hat more often and to stay warm. But I think my daughter would say that I'm passionate about Jesus. That the ultimate compliment, I'm thinking back of the ultimate compliment is is she would say, dad, I wanna marry someone just like you. You know? Dad, I wanna find someone just like you. And so I think she feels like I'm a good conversationalist.

    Jesse Bradley [00:38:20]:
    There's the overall how I treat people and my faith and that I'm the same person, whether I'm at home and no one's around or, you know, I'm out in public. I think those are the things she might highlight. But goofball. I'm probably a goofball more at home than I am professionally. So she enjoys that side of it. And, yeah. When she's thinking I wanna date or marry someone that's like you, dad. It's like, what better, you know? Could could you celebrate than that? So, sports, playful, goofy, fun to talk to, loves people, that kind of stuff.

    Jesse Bradley [00:38:56]:
    That's probably what she'd say.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:57]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Jesse Bradley [00:39:00]:
    Overall, I think it starts with me. I say God, my heavenly father, and then, like, how does he treat me? And that really becomes the basis of how I treat other people. Like, God's forgiving. God's patient. God's kind. And I I know there's mentors, and I've had a lot of them. Seen it. My one guy, Doug, it was like I remember thinking, okay, watch him interact with his kids.

    Jesse Bradley [00:39:25]:
    Like, he loves them so incredibly much. It was Saturdays were pancake Saturdays with dad. And, you know, he was just one of those guys that without even trying it, it wasn't like, oh, I'm gonna mentor you here. But I saw how demanding his work was. And then I saw what he's like at home. And the people that inspire me most are the ones that are doing it behind the scenes when no one's looking, they're doing it. No, one's covering their story. They're doing it and they're heroes.

    Jesse Bradley [00:39:53]:
    And they're doing it consistent. They're doing it on a daily basis. They're doing it in a sacrificial way. They're doing it in a genuine way, and they know how important parenting is. They know how important their kids are. And I'm constantly challenged by that because my work is demanding, and I gotta be careful not to bring leftovers home. And it's like I've given all my best at work, and now I'm just, well, dad doesn't have much left. That's easy for me to fall into that trap.

    Jesse Bradley [00:40:18]:
    But it's the dads that I've gotten a glimpse of behind the scenes. And no one else really sees it. And it's not the spectacular. It's more, again, of the consistent. And they show up the same way, non anxious presence. They're having fun with their kids. They've created some ways to make memories together. Those are the ones, and I don't have that down.

    Jesse Bradley [00:40:42]:
    I miss out on opportunities. I'll just say that, and then I'm aware of those. So I have to really be intentional. Now Now

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:40:59]:
    you've given a lot of piece of advice today, a lot of things for all of us to think about as fathers and how we find hope in our worlds around us, how we instill that hope to our kids. But just in general, the experiences that you've had and things that have worked and things that you've been challenged with. As you think about dads out there, all dads that that are out there, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every father?

    Jesse Bradley [00:41:22]:
    On the one hand, I would say don't try to be too controlling. And all my kids have been very different than me. And I realized early on, if I try to make them just like me or my dreams for them, my goals for them, it's just not I was up at about 2 o'clock with 1 of them talking about online business because they're so motivated to try to figure all that out. Like, I personally don't have any interest in online business. But rather than try to put a ton of limits and try to redirect or try to say this isn't as good, like, you've got to get excited about what they're excited about in the way that they're bent, their personality, their passion, their talents, like don't try to over control that. So here's, I guess, a summary. Tender and tough. Know when to be tender.

    Jesse Bradley [00:42:12]:
    Know when to be tough. And I find that the dads that are trying to be over controlling, it's like on the sidelines. It's embarrassing how they're talking to the referee, like, after the games, like, what they say to their kids. Like, I almost feel like they're living vicariously. Does the kid even enjoy that sport? It's like, no, no, no. The tough, being tough as a dad is not controlling your kids. You've gotta loosen up that grip and let them be who they're designed to be. I like to say, ultimately, my kids are not mine, they're gods, and that helps actually bring freedom that I don't have to try to call all the shots in their lives.

    Jesse Bradley [00:42:47]:
    But instead, how do I set them up for success? And then the tenderness. There's gonna be some really incredibly important times to be tender, and the kids are gonna need it. And if you're always strong and harsh with them, they're not gonna grow and develop. They're gonna resent you. So when to be tough, when to be tender, that figuring that out right there is incredibly important. And I would say just notice during the week, like there might be some times when you're way too soft and lenient. You kinda know your own bent. Right? And if you just let them have endless devices, I mean, that's easy for me sometimes hey, let's talk about physical activity.

    Jesse Bradley [00:43:30]:
    Let's talk about exercise. Let's drop hey, let's talk about physical activity. Let's talk about exercise. Let's drop that phone and let's go do it. So tender and tough, my encouragement is just to notice your patterns, which you naturally do. And there's probably some areas where you're either being tender or tough when you should be the opposite. And don't just do what comes natural. Don't just do what your parents did.

    Jesse Bradley [00:43:56]:
    You've got to make some shifts so that tender and tough are played out really well. And that, I think, is is really key. Another combination is honest and humble. Be honest and be humble with the kids. Bring love and bring truth. That combination. These are fruitful as parents. When you're honest and humble, when you bring the truth in love, when you know when to be tender, when to be tough, those are the things that I kinda come back to and just keep checking all the time.

    Jesse Bradley [00:44:26]:
    How am I doing in these areas? And that's what helps me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:44:30]:
    Well, Jesse, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here, for sharing your story. If people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

    Jesse Bradley [00:44:36]:
    The website, jessebradley.org, a lot of parenting resources there. So you can check that out. They're all free. And then on social media, Jesse j Bradley, love to connect with anybody, hear how you're doing, and let's keep learning together.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:44:48]:
    Again, Jesse, thank you. Thank you so much for sharing your journey today, for sharing the highs, the lows, and everything in between, and I wish you all the best.

    Jesse Bradley [00:44:57]:
    Christopher, you love dads and you love daughters, and it shows. We appreciate it. You are giving so much to us. So keep up the good work. Don't slow down. And thank you for the community that you continue to build.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:45:10]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong and power daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:46:08]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast, the time goes by just like a the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. You're the best dad you can be.

  • Nurturing Bonds: Joe Lee's Strategies for Raising Strong Daughters

    Nurturing Bonds: Joe Lee's Strategies for Raising Strong Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    The Fatherhood Insider: A Gateway to Enhanced Paternal Engagement

    Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes fathers to explore the Fatherhood Insider, a hub designed for paternal growth. Emphasizing the importance of active fatherhood, he encourages dads to utilize resources such as course libraries, forums, and expert advice with the singular goal of honing their fathering skills.

    Joe Lee's Remarkable Transition: From Monotony to Spontaneity

    Guest Joe Lee, a dedicated father, discusses his structured life and the unique activities he enjoys with his daughter. Be it practicing Taekwondo, computer learning sessions, or ice skating adventures, Joe underscores the essence of breaking routine and imbuing life with spontaneous moments.

    An Inspirational Journey from an Entrepreneur to Author

    Joe Lee shares his motivations for penning 'Ripping Off the Mask From Hustler Entertainer to CEO' and his entrepreneurial evolution. Reflecting on the empowering experiences that guided him to authorship, Joe underlines the process of building a support network and navigating the responsibilities of single fatherhood.

    Fatherhood's Complex Layers in Modern Society

    As a vigilant single father, Joe addresses the pressing fears and challenges in raising a daughter in today's society. He advocates for attentiveness, support, and open communication as the pillars of a father-daughter relationship. With a fine balance between professional life and parenting duties, Joe strives to provide structure, support, and valuable life insights for his daughter.

    A Vision of Fatherhood: Protecting and Teaching the Next Generation

    Envisioning his role as a protector and teacher, Joe Lee hopes to instill resilience and strength in his daughter. He emphasizes the value of fathers being present and actively involved—not just in the big moments, but also in the everyday tasks, like doing their daughters' hair. As a 'girl dad,' his commitment to nurturing and mentoring his daughter shines as a beacon for other fathers who listen to 'Dads with Daughters

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week I love being able to sit down, talk to you, help you, and work with you as you go through this journey that you're on in raising your daughters. I know I've been on the same journey. I'm still on that journey. I'll always be on that journey. Once you're a father, you're always a father. And what's so important is that you never give up.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:46]:
    You keep moving and you keep working at it because there's gonna be times where it's gonna be hard. There's gonna be times where it's gonna go smoothly, but there is always opportunities to learn, to grow and to be even better. So that's what this show is all about. This show is all about helping you to be the best dad that you can be to help you to connect and engage with your daughters. And that's why I love being able to have these conversations with you every week. I also love being able to bring you different dads, different dads that are doing fatherhood in different ways and bringing you people that have, are from every walk of life, fathers, mothers, other individuals with resources that are gonna help you to be that engaged father that you wanna be. This week, we've got another great guest with us. Joe Lee is with us today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:35]:
    And Joe is a father of a daughter. He's got a 6 year old daughter at home. We're gonna talk about his journey that he has had thus far with his own daughter, and I'm really excited to have him here. Joe, thanks so much for being here today.

    Joe Lee [00:01:48]:
    Thank you, Chris. I appreciate being a part of the show and being on here. The way that you guys, have come along, I think I was set at the beginning stages of that when you started the organization and group on Facebook. So it's a pleasure being here and being a dad myself for the last 6 years. I've always helped other folks with their trials and tribulations prior to me becoming a dad. So it was one of the reasons why I joined your group back then.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:11]:
    So first and foremost, what I love to do is I love turning the clock back in time. So let's go all the way back to that first moment that you found out that you were gonna be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Joe Lee [00:02:20]:
    Oh, man. I I said, you know, of all people, why, you know, why do I hit the girl? Right? And but I smiled all the time. I smiled all the time. Like any other father, you wanna have that boy, But, you know, it's been a pleasure, and I see that I've inspired a lot of men when I first started this journey and how I used to talk about her coming into this world.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:41]:
    So as you think back to the time that you've had with your daughter thus far, I know that when I talk to dads about being a father to a daughter, many people tell me that there's some fear that goes along with it. What's been your biggest fear in raising a daughter in today's society?

    Joe Lee [00:02:56]:
    So there's a couple things, to be honest with you, Chris. 1, if I think about my life coming out of New Orleans and the fact of even just raising a kid today, I don't think it's scary. I think it's a matter of being afraid. What could possibly happen? And I say that because I've often been asked and had conversations with dads or women, all of the same. And I talk about the days when we used to walk around the neighborhood at 6, 7, 8 years old. We 2, 3, 10, 15 miles away from home. Today, that's the fear factor. You can't do that anymore.

    Joe Lee [00:03:26]:
    Predators will take your daughter or son out of your backyard and draw daylight. It doesn't even matter. That's one of the biggest things, and I think she's taught me a lot more too just in general about life as I've gotten back, as I've always been into the health and fitness side of the house, playing semi pro football, bodybuilding, etcetera, this late stage in the game for me and and by the way, I'll be 53 next week, Chris, just to share a little bit with you. So I still keep myself healthy. But working with her in Taekwondo has, gotten me back into stretching. It has gotten me close to God because she's in private school, and every week she has homework to read a, a verse from the Bible.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:03]:
    Now raising kids is never easy. Raising daughters is not always easy as well. What's been the hardest part for you being a father to a daughter?

    Joe Lee [00:04:12]:
    It's making sure that I'm being attentive. Right? It's making sure that I am supportive, of a female, for 1. I am actively listening, and I'm not just being a dictator because I'm her father, but I'm also fostering open communication. I think it involves setting a positive example that I am empathetic to what she's going through, and I'm finding ways to be resilient to teach her to be resilient. My daughter jumped onto a computer right at the age of 4 months, and she literally crawled over into my lap and was just curious about it. And, you know, she didn't peck on the keyboard. She tried to mimic everything that I was doing, and I'm like, yes. She has that look in her eyes.

    Joe Lee [00:04:48]:
    So from there, that helped me with being a father to a female and what I have seen in the prior 15 years of women now becoming more evolved in the corporate America side of things. So it only meant sense for me to think about, hey, how do I best guide my daughter? Because she's gonna need more than just being a female. She's gonna need more than just going to school and to be able to survive out here in this world of, corporate America and in life.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:19]:
    Now you are busy. You have a lot of things going on. You're doing a lot of different things. And you're trying to also be that engaged dad that you wanna be. Talk to me about balance and how you've found balance in the things that you're trying to do professionally, but also in who you want to be personally for your daughter.

    Joe Lee [00:05:38]:
    Yes. So one thing, I have 2 calendars. I manage calendars. Where most people, years before me, may have missed Christmas or some specific holiday or birthday around a making a business deal, I do my best to manage my schedule around her schedule and not the other way around. So just like I have her in Tae kwon which is generally Mondays Tuesdays and every other weekend, in my business calendar that's lined side by side, I plan my business days around her schedule. And that's been a major, major benefactor to me to make sure that we can get what she needs to get and she can get the time with me. As far as balance wise, yes. And where she is today with her academics in a private school that she's in right now, it's great because she's now being challenged.

    Joe Lee [00:06:26]:
    The preschool, kindergarten, I was often told, and even her mom was told, your daughter's gonna be something. She's very smart. She's very diligent. And I know with myself, I've been the one that put a lot of that sergeant slaughter, get it done, be detailed because that's how I am in my life. And that has helped me provide that balance with her. So from TaeKwonDo, we come in, we get our structure to study, we get bedtime. I keep her schedule the same as much as possible, but there are times when I do random with her. And then on the weekends, when I have her for longer periods because it's not a school night, yes, that's all broken up.

    Joe Lee [00:07:03]:
    She gets that play time in. We get regular television time in. She gets 30 to 45 minutes on her tablet of free time when we have to. When we ride in the car, I make games out of her homework. So for instance, her spelling words, I randomly joke around with her and I said, you can't beat me. I can spell better than you can. Right? So we start playing these games in the car when we're riding. So I balance it all out.

    Joe Lee [00:07:29]:
    And, again, the biggest part is is just being spontaneous sometimes. Yes. I'm very structured. Yes. I'm very attention to detailed 90% of the time, but you have to break up the monotony.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:40]:
    You definitely have to break up the monotony because at times it it does definitely it definitely can overtake you and you have to be able to be engaged with your daughter. How do you find that you are able to connect best with your daughter and what's been the favorite thing that you and your daughter like to share together?

    Joe Lee [00:08:03]:
    So I'll answer the second question first. Sharing something together, we do share the taekwondo thing together. We share going to the gym together. She likes go to the playground. But more importantly, when I'm in here doing, exercise in the house, she's right there too, you know, for the average man who can't do push ups on his knuckles. She can do 15 to 20 push ups on her knuckles right now. So that's that's one thing. The second thing is chores.

    Joe Lee [00:08:24]:
    When I say it's time to clean up, you know, she's happy to do chores. Ever since she was 2, she has been about doing her chores. Even the preschool days at at preschool, she would fix her little cot and she would stand next to it. And the teachers had often told me that. So those are some of the things. But going to the gym and then sometimes we go to the park. Right? She likes to skate too as well. So we'll in the wintertime, we'll go ice skating.

    Joe Lee [00:08:48]:
    So at least twice, during the year. And if we can make it a 3rd time, we'll go a 3rd time. But more, you know, outside of that, she's a barrel of I wanna learn. She has a bunch of that inside of her, and it's her computer. We sit here on our computer side by side. Some nights, I'm working to try to get contracts done. I've set her up to where she can complete her homework, and we're sitting side by side.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:08]:
    Now I know that just recently you wrote a new book called ripping off the mask from hustler entertainer to CEO. And I guess first and foremost, talk to me about what made you choose to take the time, the effort to write this book, And what are you hoping that people are taking out of the book itself?

    Joe Lee [00:09:30]:
    So the main subtitle probably says it all, which is dedicated to succeed against all odds. Born and raised in New Orleans in the early seventies and survived, and I will say survived New Orleans from the 19 eighties to the 19 nineties when I decided to leave in 1991. And all through my life, I have been a hustler. I have had that hustler mentality, which is an enterprising and entrepreneurial mindset and spirit, which is the true definition of what a hustler is. Most people see that term or see that word, and they think from the streets. And while I came from the streets and were born and raised from the streets in New Orleans, which was one of the worst places to live in the 19 nineties. And I left there in 1991. And in 1994, it became the murder capital of the world.

    Joe Lee [00:10:17]:
    So with that, the inspiration just came from my lifestyle of helping people, seeing roadblocks that I say that there's a problem to this. We've gotta get up. We've gotta be active. You can change your story. You don't have to travel someone else's journey. Right? It's not the destination that inspires people. It's the journey that inspires everyone. So with that, I've always said, as far back as I could see my dark past is how clear I wanna see my future.

    Joe Lee [00:10:49]:
    So I got up and I did that. I became a chameleon in life to see different things in corporate, see different things in the way that I came up, and I said no more. And I'm gonna take control of my life, and that's what you have to do. And so that inspiration was there a long time ago. And so many people along the way say, you need to write a book that got that were able to know me on a personal level and professional level that just said, hey, man. There's something you need to get out. You need to let this out. And in 2016, one of my employees had recommended me to be nominated to do an interview on this, show called Hatch in the city of Aegean Beach.

    Joe Lee [00:11:30]:
    And so it was a bunch of business owners, and they were all evolving. And at the time, I said, okay. Alright. I got nominated. And when I start hearing people's stories and I didn't have anything prepared, Chris. I just spoke. And that was the first time that parts of me unlocked that box and got deep into that that several of the people in the room were in tears. And so from there, Chris, I had been thinking about it, and people said, hey.

    Joe Lee [00:12:02]:
    You need to do it. And I just I held it off for so long. It just just bit my tongue on that because I'd never wanted to I guess I was just feeling that I didn't have to use my past to succeed in life. And many times along the way, people said, Joe, it's not what you're doing. You need to think about that differently. You accomplished a whole lot, and you don't even know it yet. And so another business owner, a female, by the way, she's been in the same industry, IT, cybersecurity field. Just 2 years ago or two and a half years ago, she said, Joe, you need to write your book.

    Joe Lee [00:12:33]:
    I'm gonna hold you accountable. You're gonna write this book. I've known you for a while now. There's some stuff you need to get out. You need to talk because you can pull people together. You can bridge relationships, but something has driven you because you're constantly working. And so that's where it came from. That was the last straw.

    Joe Lee [00:12:50]:
    And finally, one day, I just sat down and start writing some stuff. And in here, you know, she'd be like, Joe, I'm gonna pair you with this publisher. And I went back and forth back and forth for about a month or 2, and then finally, I pulled the trigger. And so it took me a year to pull it all together, to be honest with you. Generally, they say you can write a book in about 8, 9, 12 weeks. But it has taken me a year to pull it together, and I finally got it done. And it just went to formatting as of last week.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:12]:
    Well, congratulations. I know as an author myself, how long it takes. And I would say 8 weeks is pretty quick depending on how long the book is.

    Joe Lee [00:13:20]:
    Well, depending on how busy you are too. Right? And that's what I said to my publisher. I said, hey, you're missing something here. I own a company. I can't just sit down and write a book.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:28]:
    Now, one of the chapters in the book is all about being a girl dad and talking about being a father itself. So I've got a couple of questions after looking through what you've been writing there. So as you think back on your pre fatherhood self, what aspects of your life and identity surprised you the most as you embrace the role of father, particularly to a daughter?

    Joe Lee [00:13:50]:
    So that goes that's gonna roll right into the chapter probably before that. If we step back, I took on many roles in life. Right? I took on many roles. And as this economy and world of life has expanded with women growing in culture and in business, I was in the entertainment business. And so for me to be a girl that, again, friends of mine, old past friends of mine was like, I heard you're a girl dad. I heard you're a hands on girl dad. I heard you're doing hair and doing pedicures of all people. Not you, Joe.

    Joe Lee [00:14:24]:
    Jolie, girl dad. So, you know, with that, I cannot say that I've ever been disrespectful or physically abused or mentally abused any female that I've ever encountered. Has there been a reaction to something? Yes, possibly. Who knows? But I have never purposely done that. So for me, owning up to the responsibilities and my role as a father, again, it goes back to making sure that I'm giving her what she needs emotionally, being a mentor to her, being a protector, teaching her the ways and means of being a girl as well with the other side of it that comes from her mother, though we're, you know, we're shared households, not in shared households. And so being a dad is really playing that role of an active role model in her life, contributing to her growth, contributing to her development, and her well-being. So just like I can see things on the street when I step out my door every day or have a gauge of a potential accident that might happen if I go right or left. I'm teaching her those things.

    Joe Lee [00:15:31]:
    I've been teaching her those things. I'm teaching her the things that she is going to need to succeed in any career that she desires her heart to take in in corporate America and in life. So it also involves just fathering and fostering a strong and positive connection with her. So I nurture her, and I have nurtured her to this day.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:51]:
    Now you just talked about that you are going through fatherhood as a single dad. Could you elaborate a little bit more on the challenges that you faced while navigating single fatherhood, especially during custody battles and how these challenges shaped your overall journey.

    Joe Lee [00:16:07]:
    With that, that came to me. It's like being a new person to a job you've never done before. And you if somebody's giving you the opportunity and you're just gonna take it head on and you're gonna learn, you're going to gather all the information, you're gonna do some research and things of that nature. I think with my situation, one thing that helped me out, Chris, was I spent 10 years in law. I worked my way up from the mailroom to being a case clerk and research assistant. So it kinda gave me the mentality and mindset to understand And so in the very beginning stages of that, again, I tried to take the proactive role. And me being a father and what I have seen in the past from other fathers and how the system negatively impact them, I took the approach of filing for custody immediately. So I filed for 5050 custody because in my mind and in my heart, I believe in shared custody.

    Joe Lee [00:17:07]:
    And though many relationships do not work out, you still should be able to garner a relationship between parents that does not affect the child and do what's in the best interest of the child, quote, unquote, how that term is overly unused. So I think we need to do that. Every parent has a shared obligation. Every parent has a monetary obligation, and that's the thing I had to focus on. And so while in the beginning, there were some trials and tribulations where where things were kinda bad. Right? And I just had to know, hey, Jodice, what you need to do to manage yourself. Right? You had to set your boundaries. You had to document what you needed to document.

    Joe Lee [00:17:50]:
    You need to keep yourself in line. You need to be clear on what you're stating in messages. And so that's how I I navigated my battle or high conflict at times or, you know, this custody battle in general. The second thing is is that the system to me is flawed for two reasons that I'm finding. 1, it's still written on the old principles of 50, 60 years ago, where a lot of it did favor more of the woman. And now we also have the evolution well, I'm not gonna say the evolution of attorneys, but we have a good and fine line of good attorneys and bad attorneys. There are attorneys that will take your money and say that they're gonna do something and don't do what they're gonna say. There are attorneys that will be your advocate.

    Joe Lee [00:18:36]:
    They are going to speak out in court for you. They are going to work with you, you know? The third thing about the attorneys that I can say is that you're you're gonna go through 1 or 2 or maybe 3, unless you've done enough research that you think you found the right one to support you. Unfortunately, for me, I had to go through 2 or 3 to find the one that I currently have today. And the other part about that is going back to some of my first points was I knew how to represent and present myself to my attorney. There were things that I did in my process to set my attorney up to understand who I am, who I was, and where I'm at today. The information that I gave him had to be clear, concise in order. So I created a template that also mapped back to what is called the 10 factors of child custody. That's in every state.

    Joe Lee [00:19:28]:
    So my journals and the writing that I gave him and prepared for him mapped to those, factors as well. And that journal was a part of another tool that I utilized is a communication app. There are different versions out there. I have one that I use today, you know, and I sometimes recommend that to dads if they contact me. But I think it's, you know, it's for everyone at the end of the day. And so that those are some of the things that I did to kinda navigate my custody battle. Today, we've been to court maybe several times, but more importantly, the judges have seen the evidence. The judges have said, I'm not changing this order.

    Joe Lee [00:20:03]:
    The judges have said, we're gonna keep this 5050 in place.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:06]:
    So how important has it been to build a support network for yourself, especially during those moments of uncertainty and emotional hurdles? And what advice would you say that you have for other single parents facing similar situations?

    Joe Lee [00:20:19]:
    Yes. So one, to build a network, I involved my daughter with me on things that I could, whether it was social events, whether it was events that was kid friendly, and she was always there from my business world and from my personal world. My friends and colleagues have been there through it all, and some of them are people that I provided advice to or recommendations to or suggestions on a custody matter at times when I before I became a father. So that network was developed pretty quickly, And at the same time, I even still took from all of them because these were people who had been in custody matters or had kids that, you know, are still married, and that provided me advice. So that was one thing. And the other part of it was just making sure that I can provide valuable lessons. I think that's what fathers have to do as well and follow the order. Follow what the order says at the end of the day, and that can go out to everyone.

    Joe Lee [00:21:26]:
    In my book, I don't just specifically speak about fathers. I speak from a father's perspective because the world knows how things have been, slighted to the other parent. But if I could provide some advice to anyone, it would be to have patience, not be selfishness, and have the ability to prioritize needs over our own at the end of the day. This will instill the deep sense of responsibility. This will encourage the growth. Parenthood, I think, often teaches us resiliency. It's adaptability. It's the importance of fostering and nurturing an environment that's great for growth.

    Joe Lee [00:22:06]:
    And I keep saying growth because they are at a level when they're so young right now. They will suck up anything that you teach them, anything that you give them. But if you don't give it to them, they will never get there. Then if you don't have a repeatable process, it will not be retained. Repeatable, retain. Repeatable, retain. And we have to continue doing that, and that's one thing I do with my daughter as well. 1 of the fathers in our group reached out and say, hey, Joe.

    Joe Lee [00:22:35]:
    You know, about the taekwondo. I don't know if you saw that lately, but, a father reached back out to me. I have my daughter in taekwondo, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. What do you do differently? Or or what are you doing with your daughter? And I just laid it right out in very concise format and just say, I'm doing a, b, c, and d. Most importantly, they go to Taekwondo for 30 to 45 minutes. You need to do that again and again and again during the days that you have your child. And it doesn't have to be a long time. On the weekends, me and my daughter probably get in about 2 hours of taekwondo, if not 4, 2 day 2 hours each day on the weekend, and that's broken up.

    Joe Lee [00:23:11]:
    It's broken up. And, again, I make it fun. The last thing as a piece of advice, I would just say I'm constantly and constantly practicing insights and giving her insights about the complexities of human relationships, the profound impact that one person's action can have on another person's well-being. Overall, being a dad, it's a continuous journey of learning and self discovery. And in most cases, men, you know, they walk away with their backs broken at in the end, but we're still here. We're still surviving because, you know, we have to be that protector.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:49]:
    So as you look ahead, what aspirations do you have for your daughter? And how do you envision your role as a father being a guiding force for her life as she grows and pursues her dreams?

    Joe Lee [00:24:03]:
    And so one thing I do is I constantly encourage her. 2, since the age of 3a half, 4, she has said, I wanna be a doctor. And to this day, she's 6. I've tried to skew that. I've said, hey. You should get into computers. But at most, the fact that she still loves computers, but she still says she wants to be a doctor. I've tried to skew her by saying, why don't you be a dentist? Here, let's take these dentist toys.

    Joe Lee [00:24:27]:
    Let's play around and just to try to see where her head really is right at this young age. So far, she has been committed to saying she wants to be a doctor. So with that, I foster doctor games, doctor little commercials or YouTube videos from time to time, and we sit and talk about some things on that side of it. I also embrace saying that, hey. You are a winner. No matter what you do or whatever loss you have in life or whatever failure that you endured because you did something and you were not the victor, I say, you have to think that you are a winner. A winner never quits on themselves. And that's what I tell her.

    Joe Lee [00:25:06]:
    She has been in 3 tournaments thus far. She has won 4 medals in 2 tournaments. And in her last tournament, she didn't win any. And I say, hey. You're standing up there, and I gave her what it looked like. We lost at the end of the day. So she understand, and now she's embraced that at the age of 6 that, hey. I can't win everything.

    Joe Lee [00:25:23]:
    And when we got home and even in the car, in the journey, I talked to her about, hey, we've gotta work hard at everything we do. Okay? We've gotta be stronger. We just gotta get better. I say, you knew it. You just lost focus a little bit. So those are some of the things that I see for her in her future. And if she wants to be a doctor, I'm gonna support that. If she wants to be a technologist or some cyber engineer, I'm gonna support that.

    Joe Lee [00:25:44]:
    Doesn't matter what she decides she wants to do. And, you know, more importantly, whatever she decides she wants to identify, I know there's a lot of identifiers out here today. He, she, her, him, that type of thing. So I'm gonna support her, and I'm gonna give her as much guidance as I can about life and what I've learned in coming up and building my road, my journey.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:03]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Joe Lee [00:26:11]:
    Sure. It sounds like you got a little curve ball here, Chris.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:15]:
    Now in one word, what is fatherhood?

    Joe Lee [00:26:17]:
    Resilience.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:18]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Joe Lee [00:26:22]:
    When she was in kindergarten.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:23]:
    Now if I was to talk to your daughter, how would she describe you as a dad?

    Joe Lee [00:26:27]:
    Oh, wow. That's a good question. That has changed. I've asked her that question a couple of times. She'd probably tell you things about what I do for her or probably tell you things of what I teach her. So, ultimately, she would probably describe me as a teacher if you had to put all those things together because I asked the question and sometimes she says, well, you teach me this, you teach me that, you buy me this, you buy me that. So I think that's what it would be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:55]:
    And as you think, let's say, 10, 15 years down the road, how do you want her to describe you then?

    Joe Lee [00:27:00]:
    The man in her life that taught her how to attack the world just to be strong and live in this world.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:08]:
    Who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Joe Lee [00:27:09]:
    You know, one of my uncles that passed, one of my mother's brother had passed in about 2019. I didn't grow up with a father. My father was killed before I was born. And so I had a mother that raised 2 kids that were they're a year apart coming up in New Orleans. My uncle has always been supportive of everything I have done from the time he was summoned by my mother to pull me out of New Orleans. And he stepped into a situation to step kids, never looked back, cherished those kids today who are my cousins. And he's always treated me like a son. And he's tried to guide me.

    Joe Lee [00:27:45]:
    He didn't shun me for my bad mistakes along the way, and that's inspiring enough to me. So I would say my uncle Roosevelt Lee.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:53]:
    Now you've given a lot of pieces of advice today, things that you have learned along the way so far in your own parenting journey. As we finish up today, anything about all dads that are out there, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Joe Lee [00:28:05]:
    I would just say, if you fall, Serena, high conflict custody battle. And even if you're not, be present, be a part of it. Learn how to do the hair, fellas. Go to my YouTube channel. Learn how to do the hair.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:19]:
    Now if people wanna find out more about the book, more about you, where should they go?

    Joe Lee [00:28:24]:
    Right now, there's a posting on my Facebook page. You can find me on there, a couple of different ways. You can find me on there by jlgov. That's jl, g as in George, o as in Oscar, v as in Victor. Right now, my personal Facebook page, which is Jolie, Virginia Beach. You could could find me in Virginia Beach. Or thirdly, we are going to be putting out the information in the next couple days of where that would be. Chris, I will definitely send you a link to that as my publisher is you know, we're behind the curve on that right now, and we're trying to release by the end of the month, since we're not gonna make the deadline for my birthday, which is next week.

    Joe Lee [00:28:58]:
    So those are the two places that you could find information about the book, but the website and everything is being worked on right now.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:03]:
    Well, Joe, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing your own story, and I wish you all the best.

    Joe Lee [00:29:09]:
    No, Chris. I appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you again. It's been great connecting with you guys. And I'll close with saying, fathers, when you compete out here in the courtroom, outside in the business. And what that I mean by that is just be smart about what you do, be articulate, carry yourself in the best light.

    Joe Lee [00:29:37]:
    Thank you, Chris.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:38]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the dads with daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together dot org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:30]:
    All geared to helping you raise strong and empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:36]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Them. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Joe Cody Discusses IVF, Advocacy, and Raising a Daughter

    Joe Cody Discusses IVF, Advocacy, and Raising a Daughter

    · Dads With Daughters

    Join us as we delve into the gripping narrative of Joe Cody on the Dads with Daughters podcast, where he shares his multifaceted life as an entrepreneur, advocate, and a devoted father.

    Infertility Journey

    Joe retraces the trying ordeal that marked the beginning of his fatherhood journey—the quest for parenthood through IVF. He lays bare his family's emotional rollercoaster, marked by failed IVF attempts, a heartbreaking miscarriage, and financial strain amounting to $60,000.

    Grain Fertility: A Beacon of Hope

    Amidst the turmoil, Joe's expertise in health policy, coupled with his volunteer work for Resolve, sparked the inception of Grain Fertility. The app, enriched by Joe's personal saga, stands as a testament to turning adversity into a beacon of hope, aiding countless individuals in their fertility quests.

    Empowerment Through Technology

    Grain Fertility not only simplifies the daunting medical landscape but also fosters understanding and empowerment. It epitomizes Joe's crusade for accessible reproductive healthcare—the service, available in both free and premium versions, embodies the convergence of education, support, and expertise.

    Fatherhood Through the Lens of Fertility Struggles

    Joe eloquently articulates how overcoming fertility hurdles has sculpted him into a more present and grateful father. Whether relishing the anticipation of his daughter's future or savoring shared moments at a Frozen musical, he exemplifies the profound appreciation and unshakable love that stem from his experiences.

    Defining Moments and Lasting Advice

    In an intimately revealing 'Fatherhood 5' segment, Joe distills fatherhood to its essence: love. He humbly acknowledges his aspirations for his daughter, imparting wisdom to fellow fathers on kindness and the pivotal role of love in parenting.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to dads with daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughter's lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down with you, talk to you, to engage with you, to find that commonality that we have in raising daughters in today's society. And I know that each of us are on our own journey. But you know what? We are all on a collective journey because we are all raising daughters. And that's important because all of us come to this with our own backgrounds, but we don't have to do this alone. There are so many other dads around us. And while society may sometimes push us to be that lone wolf per se, that alpha male, that person that is that is being challenged to go alone and do things by yourself.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:10]:
    You don't have to. And that's what this podcast is all about. This podcast is here as a resource. It's here to help you to go on a journey with all of the dads that are guests, all of the people that are guests to find those resources and find those commonalities, learn something along the way, and help you as you are going through your own journey. Because you don't have to be alone. And you have a community right here. That's here to help you in that journey that you're on every week. I also love being able to have different guests with us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:43]:
    And why? Because I 1, I like learning from them. But also, 2, I love being able to introduce them to you. So we have dads that come on moms that come on. We have other people with many different resources and it is always a fun time to be able to learn about the journey that they've been on and the things that they have struggled with as well, because I'm sure many of the things that they're struggling with, you're struggling with too. Today, we've got another great guest with us. Joe Cody was with us today, and Joe is a father of a daughter. We're gonna talk about his own journey, and I'm really excited to have him here. Joe, thanks so much for being here today.

    Joe Cody [00:02:18]:
    Oh, thanks for having me on, Chris. I appreciate it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:20]:
    It is my pleasure. Love that you're here, and I'm really excited to be able to learn a little bit more about you. 1st and foremost, we got to turn the clock back a couple of years now. Your daughter is in that age 3 range. So we're going to talk about what it's been like in these these years that you've had with her. So let's turn that clock back in time. What was that first reaction that you had when you first found out that you were going to be a dad to a daughter?

    Joe Cody [00:02:46]:
    My journey is like a lot of people's where we were trying for years to try to have a child get pregnant. We had to go through almost 4 years of infertility treatment, IVF specifically, to try to have our daughter. So when we got that phone call from our reproductive endocrinologist saying that my wife was pregnant, it was an unbelievable feeling. And then the way that IVF process works, you find out much quicker than other people do about the gender of the child and other stuff. So I found out this we were gonna have a baby girl, and I was ecstatic. I was at that point where I didn't really care whether or not I had a boy or girl. I was just so blessed to have a child concerning the journey we had gone through. And then I really started to think through.

    Joe Cody [00:03:24]:
    I found myself fast forwarding through decades already where I was thinking about our graduation, about walking right down the aisle, and these other things that dads think about as you go through that process. But then I had to kind of rewind to come back into the moment. So it was really exciting moment for me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:38]:
    Now, a lot of dads tell me that, especially in raising daughters and you only have a daughter, I only have daughters. So I can't say that I have the same experience and understanding what a father with a son goes through. But a lot of the dads that I talked to that are dads with daughters have said that there's some fear that goes along with being a father to a daughter. What's been your biggest fear in raising your daughter so far?

    Joe Cody [00:04:04]:
    I think for me, it is you don't know necessarily what you're doing because you don't have that experience of being a little girl or a woman growing up in today's world. So you think as a a male who has gone through your experiences, you know, that sheds light onto the way that we're going to approach different situations. But understanding that her perspective is gonna be completely different. She's growing up in a completely different time than I did. So is that fear of am I doing things the right way, and am I actually adequately preparing her for what she needs in life later on, knowing that her journey is gonna be complete different than mine?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:39]:
    There's definitely ups and downs in that journey. It's not always roses. It's not always going to be easy. What's been the hardest part of being a dad to a daughter?

    Joe Cody [00:04:50]:
    I think for me, the process going through and having her and then immediately she was born April 2020, so at the very start of the pandemic. So you have a pandemic baby who's born, and you we didn't have a lot of support for that first 6 to 9 months because no one had vaccines yet. Everyone was still trying to figure out what was going on. So we felt really isolated, during that process. We did get to see our parents a few times during it, but for the most part so and a lot of that was trying to figure out what are we doing going through this process. And There are so many small things with little girls that you don't think of as a a male growing up and trying to figure out those things. So I think that was, you know, one of the things that we've just tried to figure out, but constantly trying to remind myself that a lot of us, we don't really know what we're doing. We're kinda figuring this out as we go, and we're doing the best we can, and that's the most we can do.

    Joe Cody [00:05:45]:
    And I think if we continue to love and support and provide, everything that she needs, I think we're gonna be just fine.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:52]:
    Now you've had your daughter in your life now for about three and a half years, and you've had definite experiences. You just talked about the experience that you had right away. There are definite memories, things that you'll remember, things that she'll start to remember as she gets a little bit older. What's been the most memorable experience that you've had thus far as a father to a daughter?

    Joe Cody [00:06:17]:
    He is really into pretend and to dressing up and all of those things. And it's very funny because we didn't necessarily push any of those things until, you know, quote, unquote, constructs of what a a girl should be doing. She just naturally gravitated towards those and loves Disney princesses. So for Christmas this year, we actually went to go see the Frozen musical at the Kennedy Center in Washington DC where we live. So for Christmas Eve, that's what we did. It's my wife, Kate, my daughter, and I went out, had the 3 of us then went to dinner afterwards. And it was an amazing time, and she just loved the entire thing. She got to wear her Elsa dress to the musical and knew the songs, and it was a very it was an amazing experience to be able to to see that.

    Joe Cody [00:07:01]:
    So that's one of those things that I know I will remember. Hopefully, she does as well, but there are lots of small things too that we've been able to do together. I really am into college football and sports, and she's really started to love watching sports with me, which I haven't tried to push it, but I am kind of to a degree because it's a a really great way for us to be able to bond together. So she'll start chanting. I'm from Missouri originally, so I'm a large Mizzou fan. And so she'll start saying m I z z o u, and she had chanting along and stuff. So it's very funny to be able to see her do that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:33]:
    I love it. And I'm sure, you know, down the road, you'll have to see, you know, who she's gonna be rooting for for the Super Bowl and beyond and, you know, have some fun along the way.

    Joe Cody [00:07:41]:
    Exactly.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:42]:
    Now, you're a busy guy. You've got a lot of things going on. You're an entrepreneur, but you also are involved in a lot of other things. Talk to me about balance and how you have found balance in your life to be able to be the engaged father that you want to be while still being able to do the things that you need to do to support your family and want to do to be able to move your career forward and the other things that you're doing forward.

    Joe Cody [00:08:09]:
    I I think one of the things that I've tried to do is to make it a priority to build it into your schedule. You have to make an effort in order to be there for my wife to be able to help out with stuff. You know, as you're trying to do I'm trying to build a company right now. I've had other jobs. I've been doing nonprofit work. I've been doing advocacy work for the National Fertility Association, all these things. But I always will try to have a few hour window in the evening where after daycare is over or before bedtime, we're doing stuff together. I try not to schedule as many calls as I can.

    Joe Cody [00:08:41]:
    Try to be there to be able to play, pick up or drop off 1 of the 2, be there to cook dinner, be there for bath, bedtime. And if there are additional things that have to get done, they get done afterwards. But trying to prioritize that time knowing that we only have a little bit of time while, you know, we're together, and it seems like it's gonna be forever. But in reality, you know, it's speeding along very quickly. So me making it a priority and as I go through the entrepreneurial process or everything else, I constantly tell myself that no matter what we do, it's never gonna be as hard as the process we had trying to have her and trying to remember why we went through everything we did, the the money we spent, the emotional turmoil, and the stuff that I'm doing now and trying to help other people who are trying who are struggling with having kids. I'm doing it so that they can have those memories as well. So trying to prioritize all that's incredibly important to me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:34]:
    So let's talk about this IVF journey that you and your wife were on. I know that it can be a long arduous journey and definitely challenging, frustrating. And and I know that that journey that you went on has led you to building a new company called Grain Fertility, with an app that that is helping other families that are going through a similar process. So I guess let's talk first about this journey that you were on. And how did that lead you to starting this new company?

    Joe Cody [00:10:09]:
    Yeah. So like a lot of couples, when after you get married, you think about wanting to have kids. And we put it off for a few years. My wife is a teacher. She was getting her master's degree at that time considering if she wanted to be a principal. We were gonna buy a house. You know, we're going through the traditional step by step process that everyone says you're supposed to go through. So we didn't really make having a child a priority early on in our marriage.

    Joe Cody [00:10:29]:
    But as we started to have problems of experiencing that, it really became apparent that it was gonna be a much more arduous journey. And so that ended up being about three and a half years of infertility treatment that we had. And over that course of that, we had 5 failed rounds of IVF. We had one miscarriage. We had to go to 2 different clinics and spent close to $60,000 out of pocket to go through the entire process. And as I went through that, I kept thinking there has to be a way for us to be able to be able to make more informed decisions and to try to regain a sense of control that you lose as you go through the infertility process. You really feel like you are a passenger in your own journey, and there are so many things you have zero control over as you go through that process. And my background is in health policy.

    Joe Cody [00:11:15]:
    I worked on the hill. I worked for consulting firms. Done for 16 plus years in DC trying to work on health policy issues. So I started to volunteer for a a patient organization called Resolve, the National Amp and amphetamine Association, as a way to try to take back some of that control, try to help others use my skill set to try to impact policy at the national level. So that way people who weren't as fortunate as myself who couldn't afford these numerous cycles of the process could try to be able to go through that process in a little easier, more cost effective way. And as we went through that journey together, I realized how common it was that people really struggled in trying to understand everything that's thrown at them as they go through that process. Grain Fertility is the application that I wish that we had as we went through that process. The whole idea was, based off of what my wife did to manage her own information.

    Joe Cody [00:12:04]:
    She carried a binder to all of her doctor's appointments, and that was the way that her doctors knew what was going on because those doctors aren't communicating to one another. The patients were the ones who had to take control of that situation. So the application essentially is a way to be able to patients to be able to take some of that control back and to be more empowered and educated as they go through this process.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:22]:
    So the name, Grain Fertility, talk to me about that. What was it and why why did you call it that? And what is the the symbolic nature of that name for the organization itself?

    Joe Cody [00:12:35]:
    Yeah. So for a couple of things. 1, so my my background is in health policy and for the last 7 years I've worked in health IT policy specifically. But a lot of the data that we have in our doctor's office, it's all granular. It's all been siloed away from one of another. So it's not really able to be transformed into something greater. But then I took Latin in high school. And when you look back at the history of agriculture and fertility being tied together, you look at the Greek and Roman goddesses, most of the time, you know, you have Demeter.

    Joe Cody [00:13:05]:
    As the goddess of fertility and of grain. So there's this association between both grain and fertility being tied together. And so I really wanted to be able to have a way to be able to symbolize how we're trying to transform that data into something greater to be able to help promote greater fertility for individuals who are struggling with their own journey.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:24]:
    So let's talk about what this what your organization now is creating. I said you have this app that is out there to help people that are going through this process like you were talking about specifically. And so talk to me about the app, what you've created, how it works, and how it is simplifying the process for individuals as they are going from patient from doctor to doctor as they're going through this process?

    Joe Cody [00:13:51]:
    Yeah. So one of the things that we are really trying to achieve is to be able to promote a better sense of education and empowerment for the individual. So this application, Grain Fertility, that is available for download, patients will sign up for it and then we walk them through the process of collecting their health information. We'll help them create a timeline that allows them to visualize their fertility journey in one place and we give them organizational tools that allow them to access the different information they need when they need it. So right now, a lot of patients who are going through fertility treatment or managing any disease really have to go to their doctor's, portal in order to sign up. You log in your information. You'll be able to see some of your information, but it's not really accessible and it's really hard to be able to understand. A lot of times, it's in medical language, acronyms, and other stuff their doctors have written in these clinical notes.

    Joe Cody [00:14:42]:
    So not only do we allow that patient to be able to import that information, put it on the application, have it files on their phone, computer, wherever they want, we also provide them with educational resources and tools and connect them with other organizations that help them understand what that means. We we really believe that an educated patient is an empowered patient, and information by itself doesn't necessarily help unless you understand the context of what that means for your own individual case. So we try to provide those resources directly to the patient so that they understand what that information means in context of their own journey, and then they can start to ask their health care provider, what are the things I need to be doing in order to increase my chances of success? What are the things I should be doing? And what are the things that are coming next so I feel more prepared for the journey? Everything doesn't feel like a surprise. All of that starts to snowball into a patient that feels more in control. They know what's coming on. They can make better decisions because they are more informed. Just like in business, I firmly believe that if an individual has more information at their fingertips and they understand what it means, they can make better decisions. Same thing with our health care.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:45]:
    So if people are interested in this application, is there a cost to it? How do they access it? What are they going to be seeing when they get into it? And how do they start using it to the best of their ability?

    Joe Cody [00:15:58]:
    Yeah. So you can go to the website, www.grainfertility.com, and we have 2 versions of the application. There's a free version and there's a premium version of the application. I firmly believe that every individual should their health data, and you shouldn't have to pay for it. That's why there's a free version of this application out there. The free version will allow you to be able to download the information. You can create that timeline. You can organize it.

    Joe Cody [00:16:17]:
    You can access your information. You can do all that. But just like TurboTax, QuickBooks, and these other services that are out there, sometimes you want some additional coaching. You want some additional expertise to help you understand what this information means, to be able to get connected with additional organizations that we've partnered with, to be able to help you with other aspects of the journey, whether it's nutrition, the mental aspect of it, whether it's trying to get second opinions, connecting with other health care providers in the fertility, endocrinology, other spaces that people are trying to access care. So the premium version provides a little extra support for those patients who want that support for them, but I firmly believe that people should be able to access this stuff free. I wish I could offer this application free to everyone all the time. It would be amazing if that's the case. And maybe one day I'll be successful enough, we'll be able to turn it into a free product because I I firmly believe that this information is yours.

    Joe Cody [00:17:05]:
    You should be able to learn from it and do it to what you want. So that's kind of the basic model what we have right now.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:10]:
    So as you look at the future, what's next? What are you doing from here? You've got the app going, but what's on the horizon?

    Joe Cody [00:17:17]:
    What we really wanna do is to use this information to help power the next generation of fertility treatment insights and to improve the experience. I'm a big proponent on information informing advocacy. So the organization Grain Fertility is going to be also working alongside other companies, individuals, organizations that are helping promote, improve access to reproductive health care throughout the United States to ensure that individuals can afford treatment. You shouldn't have to be an upper middle class individual or higher in order to afford essential health care, which I believe reproductive health care is. So we want to be able to use this information to provide insights and data that drive better technologies, to help drive down the cost, to help improve access to care, and really trying to promote a more democratic, process for fertility care. Because right now, 1 in 6 individuals will experience infertility over the course of their lifetime. So there are a number of your listeners right now who may be struggling, a lot of them silently. They're not talking about this process, but they really are struggling, and there's a lot of stuff they don't know as they go through that process.

    Joe Cody [00:18:22]:
    This doesn't mean, though, that 1 in 6 are getting care. There are only a few 1000000 people in the United States who are actually able to get fertility treatment because of the cost, because of access issues. I wanna work firmly alongside other companies, our organizations, doctors, to be able to expand access to that so everyone can have access to it. So that's what we want this company to be able to do. I firmly believe that companies can both drive profits and be good businesses, but also make the world a better place. And that's kind of where we hope to be able to have that intersection.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:50]:
    So you just talked about the fact that many dads that are out there, though you said the 1 in 6, that are having these these struggles, these challenges, and they're doing it alone. They're not reaching out. They're not talking to other dads or other people about this challenging time within their life. You went through it yourself. So I guess one of the things that I question because we talk a lot about the importance of community, the importance of using that community to help you in that journey. As you reflect back on your own journey, and I don't know how much you divulged when you were going through those years of infertility, what would have helped you outside of your app? And what would have helped you to be willing to open up to others if you weren't opening up to others?

    Joe Cody [00:19:38]:
    Or the 1st year or so, we didn't tell anyone. Our closest family members knew, and that was it. We were not open and vocal about our own fertility struggles, our own journey. There was a stigma and a shame attached to that. You feel like there is some type of failure for not being able to have a child. You you're raised your entire life. We talk about this as a society that's you know, this is the goal of all these individuals who are married to be able to procreate and have families. Do you feel like there's something wrong with you as you go through that process? And the pain that goes along with it is so intense at times, especially once you've had failure when you spend so much time, effort, money into it.

    Joe Cody [00:20:17]:
    And then for it not to work, you feel this collapse. So you wanna stay guarded because you're telling other people you're trying to have a child, everyone there's natural follow-up conversations and questions about that. So we weren't open for the 1st year or so. And then it was actually a therapist that my wife saw quite regularly and I would occasionally go to. I will admit I was not the best at going to it early on in the process. But she's the one who tried to promote us talking about a little bit more and then actually referred me to resolve the National Infertility Association to get involved with them to serve advocacy 2, there should be no stigma attached to it. And it is a disease. It is not something that you should be ashamed about.

    Joe Cody [00:21:02]:
    Just like mental health, just like obesity, just like diabetes, cancer treatment, etcetera, Individual going through this type of trauma should have resources available to them. So I wish that I had known about that and been more forthcoming about it early on because once I started talking to others and was public about our own journey, posting on social media, which is way before I even started my company, the number of people who I had reaching out to me saying, oh, I'm going through this too. And we started just talking. Some one of my best friends reached out to me and said, hey. We've been going through this for about 9 months now. I had no idea. I saw him all the time. No one ever talked about it.

    Joe Cody [00:21:41]:
    He's one of my best friends. And so I started to have these conversations with people and realized that we're all struggling looking for this. So hopefully, by me being more open, I was able to tell other people. There are a lot of communities that are out there, and I think trying to find whatever that approach is for you is best. Therapy isn't always the best for everyone. Some men just don't want to do it. Some do, and they love it. There are online communities that are available out there for people to be able to talk.

    Joe Cody [00:22:06]:
    Could be anonymous. It could be any way, but finding out ways to deal with it as opposed to burying it is incredibly important because it will consume you. And it is the hardest thing I ever went through, for sure. But it made us stronger. We talked about it a lot. We were really open. And I think that we're both better parents because of it, and I think we're better spouses because of the journey as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:27]:
    So unpack that a little bit. You say you're you feel like you're a better parent and better spouses because of this. Talk to me about that. What did this journey do for both of those aspects that really made you stronger in those ways?

    Joe Cody [00:22:38]:
    I think there's a sense of appreciation that you understand that nothing should be taken for granted and you have to work for it. There were a lot of things. It's very easy to imagine scenarios that if this didn't work out, what happens to us as a couple? Or what happened my daughter would not be here if this did fail. Unfortunately, there are a lot of individuals and couples who face that question right now. You know, they're childless not by choice, but because they could not overcome the obstacles. And so they're trying to figure out other ways to try to have a family, whether it's through surrogacy, adoption, other things. And they may just say, you know what? It's not in the cards. We're not gonna have children.

    Joe Cody [00:23:17]:
    And they have to find a way to be okay with that. So I think for us, it was a matter of trying to realize that this ideal scenario of what we thought our wives were going to be, where we were gonna get married, we're gonna buy a house, we we wanna both have multiple kids. We're both from big families, Irish Catholic families who really grew on all around a lot of noise. So we had this ideal of what was going to be our future and then to realize that that isn't always the case. Life is going to throw you curveballs, and it's up to you to figure out ways together and to know that you have to trust on your partner to be able to provide those resources, to be able to provide that help and that love. And once we've been able to go through that, nothing is gonna be harder than that journey. So as we could look towards parenting, I think we're appreciative and understand that we are blessed to be able to have our daughter and everything is everything that we go from now on is just an experience that we really wanna take in. We don't take it for granted at all.

    Joe Cody [00:24:15]:
    There are times, obviously, we get frustrated like every other parent does. And, you know, we have to kind of remind ourselves that in the end, it's really about that love that we're able to have established in our family and just think about that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:27]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, or I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. You ready?

    Joe Cody [00:24:34]:
    Ready.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:35]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Joe Cody [00:24:37]:
    Love.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:38]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Joe Cody [00:24:42]:
    I don't think I have yet.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:43]:
    Completely fair. Now your daughter's young, so I'm gonna ask you this in 2 different ways. But if I was to talk to your daughter, how would she describe you as a dad? And then think, let's say 10 years from now, how do you want your daughter to describe you then?

    Joe Cody [00:24:55]:
    Now I hope she would say or think she would say that I'm funny and compassionate. But in the future, I hope that she understands that everything we're doing is to help prepare her and give her the tools she needs to be able to succeed in life.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:09]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Joe Cody [00:25:11]:
    My wife and I are lucky enough to have large families, so we have a lot of role models to be able to look after. And there's a lot of different family journeys. My my parents are divorced, but my dad and my mom are both happily remarried. And I look to that for inspiration anyways. My father-in-law, he just got remarried. My wife's mother passed away in 2016 from breast cancer, but there was an incredibly loving relationship, and I had the honor of getting to know her. Her her grandparents. My grandparents were married for 50 plus years before a lot of them passed away.

    Joe Cody [00:25:45]:
    So we're we're lucky enough to have a lot of role models and people to be able to look after to say this is what we wanna aspire to be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:52]:
    Now you've given a lot of pieces of advice today, things that have led you to who you are today and where you're going from here. As we finish up today, and you think about every dad, what's one piece of advice you wanna give to every father?

    Joe Cody [00:26:06]:
    Be kind to yourself because we can often overthink things and think what we're doing is in a right or wrong or it is we're doing things the proper way as fathers. I don't believe there's really a proper way to be a father, and we all have different experiences that guide the way the decisions we make. So be kind to yourself and leave yourself grace to know that you're doing the best you can. And as long as you are there and supportive and you're able to show that love, you're gonna do just fine.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:37]:
    Now, Joe, I know you've mentioned it before, but I'm gonna ask you again, if people wanna find out more about grain fertility or if they wanna find out more about you, where's the best place for them to go?

    Joe Cody [00:26:47]:
    Yeah. So you can go to our website, www.grainfertility.com. We're also on social media. You'll find us on Facebook. You'll find us on Instagram. You'll find us on LinkedIn. Love to be able to connect with anyone and everyone. I'm a big proponent of talking to anyone no matter what their experience is.

    Joe Cody [00:27:03]:
    I feel like I can always learn from people. So love that you can find me on social media as well as Joe Cote on I'm on x. I'm on Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, etcetera. So please do not be a stranger. Reach out to me. I would love to be able to talk to people in people in the community.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:17]:
    Joe, just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your story today. Thank you for being here and being a part of this about of the voices that are a part of this podcast. And I truly wish you all the best.

    Joe Cody [00:27:28]:
    Thank you so much, Chris. I really appreciate your time.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:30]:
    The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual and most dads are figuring it out as they go along, and the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the dads with daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:22]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time, We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast, the time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and muscle men. Get out and be in the world. Choose them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Navigating Dad-Daughter Dynamics: Stories from the Ash-Shakoor Family

    Navigating Dad-Daughter Dynamics: Stories from the Ash-Shakoor Family

    · Dads With Daughters

    Today's Dads with Daughters' podcast featured some amazing guests. actor, pastor and father, Aqeel Ash-Shakoor and his daughter Jaylah Ash-Shakoor. The discussions revolved around their experiences, highlighting the integral role of fathers in daughter's lives, and providing valuable lessons for dads everywhere.

    **A Father's Protective Instinct and Balancing Parenthood with a Career**

    When Aqeel learned he was about to become a father to a daughter, he felt a profound sense of responsibility and protectiveness. He reflected on his initial desire to have a daughter and shared the powerful moment of witnessing her birth. Aqeel also discussed the concerns fathers often face, particularly when it comes to protecting their daughters in a world that can sometimes be unkind. Balancing a busy career with involved fatherhood, Aqeel emphasizes the importance of prioritization, with a three-rule mantra: 'God, family, handle your business.'

    **The Importance of Father-Daughter Relationships**

    Jaylah spoke candidly about the evolution of her appreciation for her father's protective nature. As she transitioned into adulthood, she understood the value of having a supportive dad and recognized the unique challenges that come with the territory. Aqeel and Jaylah mutually stressed the significance of a father's presence and guidance in shaping a daughter's sense of self and decision-making abilities.

    **Communication and Trust - Key Pillars of Parenthood**

    A crucial topic discussed in the podcast revolves around the essence of communication in building strong father-daughter relationships. Aqeel and Jaylah highlighted the need for clear dialogue, understanding, and a foundation of trust. They emphasized that parents must believe in their children's capabilities and support them in carving their own paths, even when they diverge from expectations.

    **Building Confidence and Resilience**

    Aqeel shared an affectionate account of fostering confidence in Jaylah. He recounted his efforts to instill resilience by encouraging her to embrace challenges, including navigating self-doubt at her new school. This mirrors in Jaylah's own aspirations for impact and influence in her endeavors as an influencer and entrepreneur.

    **The Ash-Shakoor Legacy of Individualism and Success**

    Aqeel's humble beginnings and his vow at nine years old to achieve success laid a foundation for his parenting approach, focused on teaching his children to believe in themselves without excuses. Jaylah spoke of her father's imprint on her ambition, the value of taking charge, and owning the room, attributing her confidence to the freedom her parents granted her.

    In conclusion, this episode serves as a powerful testament to the deep bonds, challenges, and triumphs within father-daughter relationships. It's an encouragement for dads to embrace their unique journey with their daughters, supporting them to reach their full potential, and leaving a legacy of love, respect, and understanding.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down and talk to you about the journey that you are on with your daughters. Doug. It is a exciting time. It is a important time, and it is so important for you to be actively engaged in your daughter's lives And being willing to learn along with her and going on this journey along with her as well. Every week, I also love being able to have different people, different people to share their experiences.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:56]:
    We've had dads on the show. We've had moms on the show. We've had Other people with tons of resources that are sharing those resources with you. And there are special moments when I have an opportunity to be able to have a Father and a daughter on the show, and that's today what we're going to be doing. Today, I've got 2 great guests with us. Reverend Dr. Aqeel Ash-Shakoor is with us today, and his daughter, Jaylah, is with us as well. And I'm really excited to have them here today to talk about Their journey as father and daughter and to learn more from them. Aqeel, Jaylah, thanks so much for being here today.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:01:35]:
    Thank you much. Thank you.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:01:36]:
    No problem. Thank you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:38]:
    Well, I really appreciate you both being here. And I guess first and foremost, I wanna turn the clock back in time, Aqeel. I want to have you go back. I wanna go all the way back. I wanna go back to that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father. To a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:01:55]:
    Wow. Amazing. That is a trip down memory lane. I will say that. So the journey goes like this. My first son, which is the oldest, his name is Jabriel. And so when I was in the marine corps serving active duty, the One of my gunnery sergeants had a little daughter, and, I was just so marveled that she was, like, 2 years old.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:02:15]:
    But she was so affluent, and her Noah. Was just incredible. She can carry on the conversation. I just was, like, from there, so I kept asking him, like, what are you guys doing? He just said he just told me that lesson. Just don't talk baby talk to them when they get older. So I had that in mind, but at the same time, our 1st child was a son. And let me tell you something.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:02:34]:
    I think I forgot all about no That I wanted a girl first. So here we are. We're living in Hollywood, Florida. And I tell you, we came home, and I realized that, wow, No. It's finally happening. We've had we're here to have a girl. It was like, wow. Based off of my mother, my mother had boy, girl,.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:02:53]:
    Which I have been the oldest, and my sister was the youngest. And so I definitely wanted to complete that, at least have a girl and a boy in this lifetime. And now here it was. We're about to bring this little thing right here that we call Jaylah into the world, and it was just Nuts. So amazing. I can still see standing in the delivery room now, and even our oldest son was standing at the foot of the bed too. No He was witnessing her coming into the world as well, and that is just I'm doing a poor job being able to put it into words because I can never find the words for that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:27]:
    Now I hear from a lot of fathers that especially with daughters that there are times where the There is fear. There's fear in raising daughters, and I hear that a lot from a lot of dads. And I guess for you, what was or is your biggest fear In raising a daughter.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:03:44]:
    Okay. We already get to the beat of this thing already. Yes. So my daughter and my wife contend that It is the same raising girls as it is boys, and I contend that it's not. There's a lot of protectiveness And no fault of her own, but I just I have always just felt like, you know, that hedge of protection. If I can't be there, no I'm always worried even when she was away in college. From walking through the house at 2 o'clock in the morning, and I think about it, she gets a call at 2 AM in the morning.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:04:20]:
    And still sometimes now. And she may say, daddy, what in the world is going on? I said, oh, nothing. I'm good now. I just needed to hear your voice. But you just always wonder about something happening. And I and maybe we shouldn't think that way, but, You're just always wondering. With the boys, I feel like the boys, can handle themselves, but, you know, the daughter, the the daughter is everything. She you know, you think of her being left unprotected with no covering.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:04:49]:
    And, You know, and I gotta tell the truth here. And, you know, Chris, when we think about who we were as little boys, we understand why we were about our little girls. So Definitely.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:02]:
    And, Jaylah, how does that make you feel?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:05:04]:
    Well, you know what? Honestly, if you had been asking me this question probably about about 4 years ago. I'd probably laugh and just think it was a joke. But, in all seriousness, I think now, having grown into, Domino's. A woman. I do think that it's it's very interesting because it's true to it. You know? And I think the older you get, the As a young lady, you start to see the world more. You see men like that. You know? You see me and dad's age. You actually you work with some of the men on dad's age and just in that male group, and you start to pick up on how men think, How they speak, how they view themselves, and how they view others, and women as well. It it does as a woman, I feel like When you get older, it does make you, be a little bit more grateful for that. And I've had the Different, friends and associates and different groups who grew up without fathers, and dads or or what have you. And it's very interesting the To hear the difference in the response to that question. So when you're younger, you always think, oh, oh, sure. You know, if I didn't have my dad, my dad's just controlling me. But now looking back, it's like, wow. You know? If you know, fathers need their daughters, and daughters honestly need their fathers. Yeah.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:06:26]:
    They really, really, really do.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:27]:
    Now, Aqeel, 1 question that I have to throw out your way is that you're a busy guy.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:06:33]:
    Yes, sir.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:34]:
    And you and I were joking about this before we started today, but you dip your toe in a lot of different water, And you've done a lot of different things in your career. And I guess first and foremost, I wanna what I wanna get into here is the Being as busy as you are, there's a balance that has to happen that you have to have in your life the To be able to be that dad that you wanna be. Talk to me about that road that you had to walk for you to be able to Balance the things that you had going outside of the house, outside of the family unit, and how you balance that with What you wanted to be as a person inside the family unit.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:07:17]:
    It's easy now that I'm already doing it, and I know the pattern that I set with the children. And I have what we call a three rule priority, and that three rule priority keeps me well balanced. And it goes, god, the Family handle your business. God family handle your business. God, family, handle your business. I am a no nonsense guy when it comes to my family is everything with me, And I teach them all the same. You can do everything in the world. And I hope I'm not jumping a gun here, but they were all raised.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:07:54]:
    Can't is not in the vocabulary. The I'm trying is not in the vocabulary. You're either doing it or you're not, and you can do. I'm a father that Not just saying cliche is that you can do whatever you wanna do. I'm a realist by saying, no. You can do it if you want to do it. That's just it.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:08:14]:
    But god, family handle your business. We don't compromise that at any point in life. No And so whether if I get a call and I'm on the road, it's god, family, handle your business. That's how it goes. And it's really as simple as that. And I I even, when I Council people. I talked to him about the same thing, and amazingly, it works.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:33]:
    And, Jaylah, I guess, as you hear that and, the You know, you think back to being raised in a family that is instilling that in you. Talk to me about what that was like for you as a the Young girl moving into womanhood, becoming a woman, now reflecting back on what you have been taught and how that's helped you or hindered you either way the In helping you to become who you are today.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:08:56]:
    So, actually, I do love that question because it is twofold. So based the what my dad was explaining is we have always in our household, even with the boys, made it about god. God is the center of everything. He's the head of everything. So the 1st father of the family is always gonna be god, and that relationship is very important because as I'm sure you know, because, you know, you explained you have the Children or child as well. You know that parenting has also been said to be very difficult as well. And having god at the the of everything. Sometimes when you don't understand your children or specifically your daughter, you look for answers too.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:09:34]:
    So it's not just us as daughters wanting all the answers like, the Why does my dad understand? Like, he doesn't get it. Mom, but she gets it, but dad just won't get it. I really feel like, you know, god holds the answers to relationship building. And a big part of relationship building is the communication piece. I feel like that's where a lot of times, daughters, when they're the Being raised, it's that communication piece. It's why won't dad understand me, or does dad understand me? And then vice versa, does my daughter understand what I'm the because this one thing to say, it it sounds good and and it does come off well, but a lot of time, there's a age gap as well where it's a disconnect. We're still trying to be kids. We're wanting to do what what's going on out in the world, especially when you attend, like, public schooling.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:10:21]:
    You're faced with different things every day, and the It's tempting, but god being the head and the center of everything is always what kinda draws you back to your roots, the Which in the end, goes based off of how you're raised, you're teaching. And so fast forward to now, it's very eye opening because everything I do in my daily life, it always the back to this one lesson that my dad taught me, and it's to take charge. And now when he first started saying this to me, I think I was probably midway through college. And every time I call them, I'm pumped. I'm in the mood. I'm in the the and I'm like, I'm gonna go ahead here. I'm gonna kill this interview, dad. I got the job or what have you.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:11:01]:
    And he's always like, listen. The I have nothing else to say. Say your prayers, you know, talk to god about it, and take charge. So recently, you know, it really has been on my mind, and I'm like, the What does it really mean to take charge? You know? And I just feel like as a as a as a female and, you know, as a woman and as a daughter, the To me, it's like owning the room that you're staying in. Whatever room you enter into, own the room. Like, the Like, you don't even have to know my name, but you should get the vibe of what I'm about, who I am, and the value that I hold. But so I think that a lot of times, dads, the They really bring that that foundational piece where it's like, take charge. Like, I am who I am, and I'm owning the room, well spoken.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:11:44]:
    The Like, you wouldn't even have to know my dad to know that I come from good raising just by speaking to me. So that's just, you know, a little bit of of of basically just his teachings and how They started to affect me over the years into now as, you know, a woman.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:11:59]:
    You know, Chris, can I just add to that? I'm fighting back the Tears right now. So you're about to get some real tears. I tell you, just hearing that is what every parent wants to hear, all the lessons that you've given in life. And what I have attempted to do, not build a machine, but and by god, this is not excluding my wife. But what I'm saying is is that Doug. What I have attempted to do is to lead by exam. And what I mean what I mean by that is if they see. And they've seen me not use excuses for where I am and the conditions that I'm in that can't work.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:12:36]:
    Then if I show them that it's possible, that and that's all it is. So I started to say, you know, how we had that phrase, think outside the box. The Well, every time I find those cliches, I add to it. So instead of thinking and and instead of me raising them to think outside the box, I tell them to think beyond the outside of the box. You see, because thinking outside the box has a limitation because once you're outside the box, you stop thinking. So I want you to think beyond the outside of the box, and then You create such a situation that you go from believing to knowing in God that it will work. Now we're not.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:13:13]:
    Not even talking about manifesting it, but I I stick to if you create it in your mind and you see it in your mind, You can do it, and it happens. And I'll I'll probably end up touching up on that a little bit more. So even to hear her talk, under and I'll I'll back off here, but I didn't have that Great confidence I had like that in school even though I was popular playing sports and everything. It wasn't until I got into the marine corps and got all around the world that I Had to build this up. And so what I realized was that you can be very confident and very assured in yourself without being conceded, and that's what I wanted to instill in them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:49]:
    So, Jaylah, let's reflect back then. How did your dad help you to find that confidence in your life? You talked about that the In college, it really kind of clicked. But think back to as you were younger and you were growing up with your brothers, what did Aqeel do to be able to help you to find that confident? And I know it's not just Aqeel because I know your mother as well, and I know that she is a part of the team. But talk to me about what your dad did specifically to help you to find that confidence to be the person that you are today.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:14:21]:
    I Can't honestly say I think it has a lot to do with the freedom of individualism. Parents, you guys talk a lot about the How it's different raising all of your children, whether they're boys or girls, is gonna be different for each one given being their personalities. So I think the the Freedom to have whatever personality we chose was the biggest thing for me. Like, I was more so of you know, I was the only girl. I'm the middle child, the And I was just full of personality. I'm singing this day bouncing all across the house. The next day, I wanted to run outside and be with the boys, and the I really think that it had a lot to do with giving us the freedom to experiment within our personalities. Dies.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:15:05]:
    And I didn't always get it right. Even, like I said, growing up, I started to have issues with my identity, like, just knowing who I was, being confident in who I was. The And I can say for females, we experience a lot of that due to going to puberty, a lot of things that. Take effect going into our teenage years and then our young adult years. A lot of it has to do with the Just the phases of becoming an adult. And so my biggest thing was growing up, went through this gap in this period of time where I was like, okay. The How do I become the young woman that I wanna be while also adhering to what god will want me to be, what the My parents will be proud of. Let's just be honest there as well.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:15:51]:
    For me, identity was a big thing, and it was just there were days when I was waking up, and I was just like, I'm just not seeing it. The Like, this can't be life. This can't be what it's like to kinda go through the phases of growing up and understanding who you are, and It took effect in my schooling. It took effect, at home, and there were issues there. But, you know, one thing about it is I think that the As parents and specifically having my dad around always since day 1 is that to feel like you're not left alone. The I think that's the biggest thing for me. Just having that male figure to know, like, your love, your light, that I'm not gonna give up on you because it's very easy.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:16:29]:
    I know. Plenty of females who have dads, but their dads aren't there. I feel like not a lot of people talk about this. When we talk about, you may have a parent physically, But are they there? Are they hearing you? Is there a connect? So definitely freedom of individualism and that room to grow, the room to make mistakes, Learn from your mistakes. Once you hit that age bracket where it's kinda like, yeah, dad can't tell you what to do. Yeah. But, you know, with the help of god, god is is gonna shape you up and the Lead you to where you need to be and definitely give you some lessons when you're drifting off a little bit.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:17:04]:
    So she said something very important. It's always been a practice of mine that Not that I didn't care about them making mistakes. The rule was I'm not concerned about if you make mistakes as long as you can give me the The evidence of why you chose what you chose. So that that gives them the freedom. So if they if they did something and even It wasn't right. I wanted to hear the plan to how they got there, what made them what made them and have a reason behind what they did. And that allowed them the freedom to discover the world and life, but it also helped them start decision making.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:17:42]:
    And then I was the crazy, father knows best kid, parent. You know? My thing was And then sometimes I would literally put it in their hands and let them choose the punishment, and that worked. And god blessed us with 3 beautiful children that Sometimes they even know if they said a punishment, they go, oh, not. That's not justified by what I did. And so it worked that way, And then I had to play a few marine corps games on them. Sometimes I'd storm through the house like I'm about to tear everything to pieces, and then that did it enough.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:18:13]:
    And I just turn around and walk away, and it leaves them thinking, oh my god. And the next time, I'm just quiet. So, you know, it's to keep it all balanced because, Again, we have to raise our children in such a way that it also presents the world. I didn't wanna be overboard. I'm sure they can probably name sometimes. They probably thought I was overboard, but If anything, I'll say this in a back off again. So much comes to mind. But I always told our children and I even told my wife.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:18:37]:
    I said, listen. And I know this is harsh,. But I'd rather you hate me or dislike me for guiding you the right way than to love me for letting you do what you want to do And knowing that's not

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:50]:
    the best way. I love that. Now, Jaylah, as I said before, your parents are both people that are involved in lots of different things. They have tried lots of different things, done lots of different things, and I know that, and I mentioned that already. So I know that they have had a lot of dreams for themselves, the A lot of dreams for you. How did they instill in you to be a dreamer for the life that you want for your life?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:19:14]:
    You know, I feel like maybe that is the Probably the trickiest question you've asked me in this whole time. And I say that only because I do think that as the Time goes on, we have to be honest that the world changes. And the way that life is set up now is not how life used to be set up. And I do think that now, like, for me specifically, I have what they would call bigger dreams. And, like, back then, I'm sure you guys can relate. Back then, you were just wanting to be something. Like, man, I just gotta make I came up this way or I came up that way, and all I wanna do is be successful.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:19:50]:
    I need to have a good job to just be able to pay the bills, and that's great. But for me, personally, I the Honestly had bigger genes beyond my career, and I always like to make sure that there's a big differentiation. The Because what I do every day on the physical place that I go to, which in my case would be the bank, it's bigger than that. And I have to even Darcy. People at work. Like, you see me showing up. I'm gonna be punctual. I'm a be on time.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:20:15]:
    I'm gonna be here. I'm a be ready to work, but let's not get it twisted. There's more to Jaylah. The So right now in my life, I'm really big on my influencer type of world, and I have started now the Trending with these videos where I post, you know, where I'm getting ready for work. And I think, you know, the other day, I was thinking and I said to myself, No. I said, isn't that something that for someone else looking on the outside end, they'd see it as or I mean, you're just making videos. But for me, I was It's actually deeper than this.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:20:42]:
    Like, I actually gotta wake up and be on time. So for me, I'm like, look at the lessons. Look at those small lessons the that follow you. You know? And dad and, you know, my parents, they've always been big on show up on time. It says a lot about you. And let's be real. No. Every day, we don't always we're not always perfect, but it tells a lot about who you are and what you're about.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:21:04]:
    And so I said, It's also a form of discipline. So there's something that I really want beyond just my career that has a lot to do with the Renewal my state. Then it's very much possible that one day I can actually be in business for myself, whether that's a company, whether that's the Getting myself paid directly without there being a middleman. So those are my bigger dreams. Right now in my life, as I approach 25, the I'm very well focused on using my corporate job to get me to where I need to be from the individual standpoint. And As you can see for yourself, that's what my parents are about as well. Everything that they do, they wanna be impactful, but it's also it's them acting as an influencer.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:21:45]:
    People sometimes attach to you based off of how you influence others. So you have the option. You can be a bad influence instead of influence others, the Or you can choose to be a great influencer and be of something worth value.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:57]:
    And Aqeel, I guess as you hear that and you think about what the Intentionally, you did to try to help your kids to realize those dreams. Talk to me about that. What did you try to do On a daily basis, on an annual basis, on a yearly basis, or just in a day to day life to help your kids to be able to the Push them to think about those dreams in different ways.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:22:19]:
    So one of the things I did, I actually had a historical African American book set that I actually purchased that probably about no 3 or 4 years prior to even our 1st child born. And then each year, I just build on top of that. So the children were And when I say required, it was not the required where it was, like, mandatory. You have to read it by this time. It was that I always put a book in their hand. And it wasn't always like a African American history, but I'm very big on our culture, very big on self improvement. And so the other thing is having world knowledge. I developed this thing too that wherever I go, I always read something.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:22:59]:
    You don't have to read it all, But you just read. There are a lot of signs and pictures around. You just read it. If you just read 3 sentences off, maybe, like, 3 or 4 sentences off of it and move on, You'd be surprised how much knowledge you're you're gathering. And so and with each child just talking about our oldest son the other day. And so with that, including Jayla, so No. Our oldest son, it clicked for him.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:23:21]:
    He got cut from the middle school basketball team in, like, 7th grade. So 1st time we've had what they would call a failure. And so but when he came out, I was like, oh my god. Lord, I am not prepared for this. And so when he got in, I could see it all on his face, so I had to quickly come up with something. And what God gave me was, I asked him. I said, is there anything that you think that No.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:23:42]:
    You could have done better. And he just turned to me, and he was like, well, yeah. I mean, I I guess I coulda worked on this. And then I just simply said, No. Maybe that's it. Maybe that's the reason you didn't make the team. And something so small when I tell you that it No. His life in such a positive way that this kid never stayed in the house again.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:24:02]:
    He was always out doing it. Now kinesiology major, he's a fitness. He's a influencer. He started his own business, and we were talking about this the other day. He said that moment he told me he said that moment No. Really defined everything. With Jaylah, it was the same thing.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:24:19]:
    She talked about her identity. Well, oh, this was hard because Even with Jaylah, you talk about we moved from North Carolina to Michigan. She had only spent, like, 3 days in high school as a freshman, No. And then we moved here. So she went from a class of about or school for about, like, 300 to 400 kids and walked into eastern with about no 1700 kids, and she shut down. And I gotta say this. So then she wanted to transfer. And the very school that she wanted to transfer to, No.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:24:49]:
    Only being here a week ended up having a shooting. And then she said, no. I wanna stay at Easter. And so we just had to keep working with her and then instilling to her No. You are beautiful. And believe it or not, when you look at her now to whomever's looking at her, she struggled wondering, was she beautiful enough compared to a lot of her friends? And just having that confidence, and and that was it. So it was like, take charge. No.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:25:12]:
    You are who you are. You're more than what you think you are. Take your eyes off other people. And then the other thing is is that we want you to have a multiplicity of friends. We're not just locking down to one, culture, 1 race, 1 nationality, the influence. And so all of our children, I I guess that's us and them, No. Have that ability to connect to a multiplicity of people. And she has the personality like me.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:25:39]:
    She can walk into a field, and somebody would think No. That she was talking to a scarecrow, and she'd be talking to the ears of corn. And so that is the thing. Even down to our youngest son, he's a very factual person. So if you say, no. It's only 2 left. He's like, no. It's actually 2.13.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:57]:
    Now, Jaylah, you heard your dad just talk about the fact that, the You know, you tried to build your self confidence in the in the self confidence of both your brothers. And I hear that a lot the from other fathers that and I see it in my own daughters that today it seems like, the the The self confidence of a lot of daughters, but also the whether it's social media or other factors are the Definitely are making an impact on the self confidence that they have about themselves. As a influencer influencer yourself, the someone that has moved on with your life and have found some more of that self confidence for yourself. What do you say to other dads the About this, about how they can best instill that self confidence in their daughters.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:26:47]:
    So I would say, first and foremost, understanding that it can't just the be you. The daughter's confidence is not gonna just come from you solely. And I do believe that it's healthy, actually, the For a lot of dads not to feel attacked when, they do tell their daughters that they're beautiful, and their daughters just don't see it. The Let's just be honest. There will be many days where, you know, dads just just glorify. You are so beautiful. Oh my god. You're so smart.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:27:16]:
    The You're this and your dad is like, but that's not what the world's telling me. If I'm that, well, why am I not runner-up? You know? And I think that It's important to, again, to understand it. Like, let take me inside of your world and allow me to the See what you see as my daughter. And let's just be honest. Sometimes you gotta disassociate the father and daughter thing. Because even for you guys, as a dad, it's the Easy for me to sit here and say, you know, dad, you've been the best dad ever. Like, dad, you're so awesome. And, you know, for what my dad does in acting, it's like, the Imagine him going in in in in trying out or auditioning, for the top dad role.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:27:54]:
    The Let's just say he's everything. He's awesome. And I'm telling him, dad, you got that. Yo. You got it, dad. Trust me. There there is no dad talking you, dad. The And then he goes in, and they're just like, not quite. Something's just not you know, to him, it's like, the Hey. Well, my daughter's telling I'm the best dad. It don't get no better than me. But let's just be honest. There's there's these self, the tick boxes that we tend to check as individuals even. And so it does come with The mentality, and the self confidence. So it is about self at the end of the day.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:28:31]:
    And there are things that dads can do, the with words of affirmation, and actions of affirmation. So that is the biggest thing. Actions of affirmation, conquers all of the Them. You know, words sometimes feel good make us feel good, but actions are even better. So as as daughters, we don't always wanna, the You know, here that we're beautiful, you know, we wanna see it. You know? We wanna see it. Like, what does that mean to To to tell a daughter that she's beautiful, what do you see? You know? And for me, I feel like even too now in adulthood, I find the best value, in understanding also the things that I don't do well because I feel like that's honest. That's where that truth, Dom.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:29:15]:
    Comes from so my dad will tell you all the time, like, you know, if if if he gets on video chat with me or if he gets on FaceTime with me, And I'm just not having a good day. I had rolled out of bed. I hadn't combed my hair or anything. He's looking at me like, okay. What's going on? What is going on? This is not my daughter. The And for me, it's just you know, I just understand that that means, like, he sees me. He knows enough about me to know the When I'm having a bad day, when something just isn't there, and then he can go in and provide that reassurance. Like, you know, you're doing it well.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:29:47]:
    You're doing things right. The You know, it's just something that comes with, with life. So like I said before, 1st and foremost, understanding that the You guys' dads don't always have all the answers. Everything's not gonna be perfect. You can't just, you know, say a thing or two and make it all better. Just just the process.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:30:05]:
    That was amazing because, Chris, what I heard there and what I wanted to say, and it oh my gracious. It prompted Domino's. Is to understand that these things that she talked about make us great dads. So if we didn't have the if we didn't have the shy daughter, we didn't have the Going daughter. We didn't have the trouble daughter. We didn't have this type of daughter. We didn't have this. How would we grow? With the boys, we sorta got that.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:30:27]:
    Not that we have it all down pat, but no It's more relate With the girls, the girls are like mini wives. I know this is about dads and daughters, but I think about my wife. It's something that my wife tells them too, And she'll she'll tell me. And she'll just simply say, Jaylah, what I always say? And what does mama always say? And who's gonna tell you that it's not work? Who's gonna tell you that it don't look good? And it's a mentality that you take on. And so seeing her, just going at it and going after not just something, no But naming it and going after it, that make it's more than just proud. It lets us know that they are really coming into their own, And that's the most beautiful thing. It's not about whether you make multimillionaires or billionaires. The value in it is the success.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:31:15]:
    What they want to accomplish, not with mom and dad. And that was what we did even with schooling. No. You do not have to be around you. Be around us when you go to school. Get as far away as you want as long as they make plain as trains of automobiles, we're good.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:29]:
    So true. Now one of the things that I would love to hear from both of you is the In this relationship that you've built over the years, there are opportunities to be able to have things that the are unique to the 2 of you, things that you share together that are important to the 2 of you. What the Has been a favorite thing that the 2 of you share together that is unique to your relationship.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:31:55]:
    So, okay, one of the things is our craziness. No It's just something about when we get together, we're gonna cut up. It's just spontaneous. I was just telling them we were just down from my mother's funeral in December, And we were talking about I said, wow. I miss us not being able to just be in the kitchen and start singing, you know, because she loves to sing. And honest to god, I told her I I I remember telling her, like, this is some years ago. This is before she even left home. I told her I said, you know, you're my favorite singer. And she thought I was joking, but it's just something about when she sings. It's like, you're my favorite singer. And in church a couple of weeks ago, A lady visited, and she sung Eyes on the Sparrow. And that's the song that I love my daughter to sing. But when I tell you just No. Endless laughter. It's like nobody's trying to be pretty.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:32:41]:
    We're not trying to be framed up. We develop a space to where we can really Be ourselves. And I know that that's what we share, but I love to see her strength. I even love the pushback. I shouldn't have told her that here live, but I love the pushback because no It tells me again that she's growing, and it also tells me that she does respect me because that's something that I Theo. So my wife and I, we don't want them to think like us or to be like us. We want them to be way much better than us. And so no It that that's the that's the thing.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:33:14]:
    I just love the freedom to where we can be across the room, and I could just look at it. She look at me, and we can just bust out laughing because we already know what the thought And

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:33:22]:
    I'll add to that. Like dad said, you know, it's personality. I I know that you can agree to Christopher even with, you know, your daughter that the It it's a personality match thing. Sometimes as parents, I know you see a lot of, you know, yourselves and and your children. So Domino's. I think for us, we just like I said, we have just that down to earth relationship. It's not always perfect, because it's a learning the experience, but it's definitely one of those things where my dad's gonna look back even in the next couple of years. You know, as I approach 30, that's the but it's gonna be interesting for them.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:33:57]:
    It's gonna be fun, growing experience. And then even when I move on to have children, the Oh, it's definitely gonna be 10 times more interesting to see how my children take after the things that my parents have instilled Dom. So I just think that as life goes on, you you develop your own ways, but you also still it's like you never detach the From the parenting skills that have shown in how you were raised by your parents.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:23]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you. And, usually, it's just a dad, but it's not gonna be just a dad this time. We're gonna ask both of you some questions. The So, Jaylah, I'm gonna start with you. In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:34:40]:
    I'll say accountability. That is a tough word. It can be so harsh, But I will say accountability. And I feel like accountability only because if you relate it back to the real world, the Accountability always reverts back to you as an individual. How does what you produce, or I should say your seed. What does it reflect about you? What does it tell about you? What does it tell about the things that you do well? What does it tell about the things that you the still need a little bit more help with. And so no matter whether it's the good or whether it's the, you know, not so good, it's a lesson in in itself, and it's the Always that room for growth and development as long as you're willing to take accountability within that process. In a queue?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:35:26]:
    To my word normally, I wouldn't use this word, but with describing god, and I'm gonna say ubiquitous. And that is to be Uniquely who you are all the time, everywhere with the same power, with the same authority, and with the same strength. Because, Uniquely, no matter what, your family needs to see whom you are in all those situations. So whether it's hard, it's peaceful, it's stress They need to know, and I guess this goes back to the accountability part. They need to know, are you gonna stand on what you say you stand on.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:02]:
    Now, Jaylah, when was the time that you feel like your dad finally succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:36:08]:
    So I will say A few years back, gosh, I would have been, at that time, feeling middle school. I was in school and personality. Right? You know your kids, the All of them. And you know how they're different. So you know what they're capable of, what sounds like them, and what doesn't sound like them. And I've always been a talker in class. The Neither, you know, my brothers nor myself were the extreme disrespectful type, so we wouldn't be at school the Disrespecting adults.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:36:35]:
    That that's definitely not the case. So this particular incident, teacher calls dad specifically, And it's just, like, in a huge uproar. Like, Jaylah is just she is just is not there. She's being rude. She's just saying things. She's Noes. Just clown and all. She's acting like a pretty fool at school.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:36:57]:
    And, you know, as much as I in my head, I said to myself, and I remember the Telling my friends and my other cousins that went to the same school as me. I said, it's over with now. The teacher done spoke, so my voice don't even count. The When a teacher calls dad, it's just gonna be the adult's word, and I'm just gonna sit over here in the corner and deal with the consequences. But, Ashley, it actually didn't feel that way. He showed up, and, again, communication and understanding, Dom. He listened.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:37:24]:
    And then he also gave me the opportunity to speak. And for once, I felt heard, and I felt like my voice matters. So it also gave me the opportunity the To be honest, just let them know I just said, hey. This is the type of day that the Tisha was having. The Tisha was actually very frustrated. And based off what you taught me, You taught me that if this is the case, then this is what should happen. And in so many words, like he said, what we would call in 2024, the He stood on business, and he basically addressed the situation for what it was. We raised Jaylah to, first and foremost, always respect her adults, the But all actions can't necessarily be respected.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:38:04]:
    Because if you teach your children and you raise your children, the Follow underneath, you know, god's teaching and god's word. We know that even adults, like, all adults don't follow that pathway. We've had especially nowadays in time where teachers come to school and they're frustrated, they have realized, and they bring those burdens to school as well. And so that does affect sometimes how they incorporate that in education and being able to handle and deal with other people's children as well. And so he just touched a little bit on that and just said that these are the expectations that when we send our children to school, she's treated fairly. She's treated equally. The She's heard just as you would want your children to be heard. And for once, literally, in in in my younger younger days of living in middle school, I I felt heard, and I just I enjoyed that part of his fatherhood and him being able to be there for me and and give me a voice.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:55]:
    And what about you, Aqeel? The What's the time that you feel like you finally succeeded as a father to a daughter?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:39:03]:
    I can't name a no Specific time write off. I'm sure if you gave me a little bit more time, but it it would be surrounding an incident just like this. And so in other words, when she when with the 1st or 2nd or 3rd time in a continuous behavior that she comes to me and has a conversation with me, and she says, dad, I'm thinking about doing this. No I wanna do this. I felt accomplished in because for your child and yes. And I would go on the limb and say, especially your daughter, to feel Even if she even though she has a little nervousness that she felt that freedom and that comfort to know that she can come and talk to you about something. And let's just say the hard topic.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:39:39]:
    Our daughters with boyfriends and guys they may like to come and talk to us about why they make certain decisions, why they may wanna make certain decisions, And it was beautiful. That was it. And, I think one other time is there maybe a b side to that. Right before Jaylah graduated with her bachelor's Northwood. She wanted a car. I may never forget this, and, she ended up posting on Facebook probably a year before, and I just happened to see the post. So I pick up the phone and I call her.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:40:09]:
    I go, so what's going on? It's like nothing, daddy. I said, yeah. So I saw this picture that you posted a car. So what's going on? The out of that came, she had been looking for a car, and I was like, woah. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:40:25]:
    Let's think about this. And so we talked that out. And lo and behold, the very next year, she still hadn't graduated. But She told me she said, dad, well, what she called me now, and we had this various conversation. What do you think about me buying a car now? And I so I told her. I said, well, listen. This is what's happening. I said, If you save your money, whatever you save, I'll match, and then we'll purchase a vehicle. Well, lo and behold, I met a gentleman that, you know, went at the dealership. No And, anyway, so through talking, I talked to him a price range and everything, and he said, oh, no problem. Well, the 1st car I sent No. Somebody ended up buying or they didn't wanna sell it or something to sometime. And, anyway, we found it again. So I said, well, Jaylah, I said, oh, I found one.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:41:04]:
    Nice car. It's clean. No lights on anything. And I said, I'm sure of this. I said, and here's the price. And she says, No. Okay. And I said, well, understand now.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:41:13]:
    You gotta pay tags, insurance. I'll handle all of that stuff part for you, but gotta have this. So do you at least have half of this? She says, oh, I'm good. I got that. I said, that didn't sound right. I was like, what do you mean you got that? She was like, oh, I'm good. I got that. I was like, you mean you got the Half of that? Or you say she's like, no. I got the whole thing.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:41:30]:
    And I was like

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:41:31]:
    Christopher, I didn't blink. Yeah. That's it.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:41:34]:
    Are you serious? So yeah. And so she literally bought And paid 4 in 4 her very first car. And that was when I that was another level then that I realized. No. So we didn't know that the day we dropped her off at college that she also started working probably that same week, And we didn't know that. She kept that as a secret, but I guess that business degree was really working.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:41:58]:
    I will add to that really briefly as we wrap up. It's very interesting because that was a very hard lesson in life, and I think this is really gonna wrap up our conversation surrounding dads with daughters and just fatherhood as the As a whole, is that I contemplated this so much because the rule of thumb was always you're not gonna get a job, you're the You're gonna focus on studies, what have you. And I sat in that room all night long, and I said, I gotta get a job. I gotta get a job. I can't do it. I gotta get this job. And so I said to myself, I said, I would be being rebellious because I would be getting a job with Doubt. Saying anything and doing it even though I know that that wasn't the expectation.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:42:43]:
    But I said to myself, I said, how cool will it be to prove the My parents, wrong, but also right at the same time. And just to touch base on that, the idea is that, you know, hey. You know, it gets the be overwhelmed. And when you work a job and you go to school at the same time, people typically don't do well. But I think that just showed how cool your specific children are when they are able to conquer that. So I remember I finished that semester, and the only thing I brought up was grades. And I say, you know what's gonna be interesting the It's to not only show them that I got the grades, but how I got the grades that I was working full time would say that. Dom.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:43:20]:
    It was honestly like a cool experience for me because for once in my life, I got a chance to prove that, yes, I get this was the plan, But, you know, I can be trusted. Like, I can work hard. That discipline is definitely to come. That won't be the the the first and last time that I may have to kinda, like, go a little bit around the parents, but in life, that's just how things end up sometimes. You don't expect, the You know, your children are go certain paths even like I said, for the oldest even, dad will tell you is just that we don't always go the route the that you think we're gonna end up going. But either way, we come out on top and success. And that right there, she that in a nutshell, that was exactly it. So allowing them the space to grow, to use their ingenuity, that's exactly what we taught them. So it was it's beautiful to know that was it. That's another level of showing that, oh, they really got it. They really understand the assignment.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:44:16]:
    Now, Jaylah, if I was to talk to you and your brothers. How would you guys all describe your dad?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:44:21]:
    I would actually say disciplined, but meaningful slash the Purposeful. And just a little bit on that, I say strict slash discipline because his teachings, they seem harsh at first. The Sometimes they seem a little way out there and over, you know, over the top. They do they it does seem extreme, But I can honestly say it's so funny how it always comes full circle, and it has a deeper purpose behind it. And, you know, the oldest, he has become just this scientifically factual person just as well as the youngest. And for myself, I'm kinda in the middle. Like, I'm not, the You know, too big on the facts and the scientific behind it, but after I found I finished my master's of science degree, it really taught me how to look at things the or what they are in terms of experiment. And as you know, when you conduct the experiments, there's always these findings.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:45:14]:
    So why this calls this? And I think that just goes back to what you put in is a big result of what you get out. So a lot of the things that he has instilled in us has developed and got it a lot of what we put into things At full cycle, sure enough, it comes back the great results that we have seen to get throughout the journey of what we've been pursuing.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:45:40]:
    The Now, Aqeel, who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:45:42]:
    Life has just really done that. Having grown up the oldest of 2 children, you know, I say these people, they start laughing because No. Know my story. Well, my children do it. I just say and my wife. And I say my biological parents, they separated and divorced when I was 6 or 7 years old, And I watched my mom do it. And my mom would literally go to work and survive off of.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:46:04]:
    Was it 25, 35¢ nabs and a soda? And I never knew that for all my life, but she always made sure we had. But she the one thing that she always said, she told my sister and I, she says, don't ever let me hear you say you hate your dad because No. She said your father. She says regardless of what happens between us, your father is still your father, and that reigned with me through my life. And so it has always been with me because psychology tells you that you're basically No. Gonna be like your parent, or the guy's gonna the man is gonna be like your father. And my father has some strongholds, and I didn't partake in those. No.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:46:47]:
    And I remember being older, maybe about in my thirties, and there was another psychologist who was taking, we were in academy, and he said this And I rebelled. I said, that's not true. I said, I don't smoke. I don't drink, and I have a great relationship with my family. So I said, Dom. That's not always true. So who inspires me to be better? My family.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:47:10]:
    The last thing I wanna do is fill my family, wife included.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:47:15]:
    Now you both have given a lot of pieces of advice today, a lot of things that, have helped both of you in the journeys that you've been on together. Jaylah, as we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:47:27]:
    Be you. And I would say to be you because there's nothing worse than the A dad getting frustrated because he can't feel another dad's shoes. When you trust the process and you you learn to be the dad that You're supposed to be. Everything works out in the end. I feel like a lot of fathers go wrong when, you know, they follow that the Society's idea of I'm gonna be the number 1 dad, number 1 super dad. It's always it's been like that for years. There's always been that, You know, that box where there's, like, dads have to be perfect. Like, I've gotta be perfect dad.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:48:04]:
    I've gotta be the dad that's just super nice and sweet all the time. I can't say anything. I can't discipline. I just gotta be perfect. I've gotta be light. And my dad touched on that a little a little bit earlier too is is, You know, you don't always wanna be the dad that's liked because I almost wanna bet you that you're probably not gonna get the best results always being the dad that's liked. So, yeah, to just be you. Haniqeel?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:48:26]:
    I think it goes just in those 2 words. I think when we look at that, and I'm sure you can relate to this, the Just in hearing dad versus your child or your daughter saying, this is my father, it does something right here in in in your the spirit right in your heart because a father is everything that we've talked about in this interview. That's not a dad. And so as Jaylah just said, no. I've never attempted to be like another man. I always think Beyond the outside of the box. And I wanna make the mold for myself, and everybody's position is unique.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:49:04]:
    And so I wanna be uniquely me and improve on me daily, and so I Do Continue to develop ways to better myself and my family. And so still to this day, what I do periodically is No. I send them self improvement messages as well and affirmation. I still send those out. So the way that my that my mother always said, she No. Despite how old you get, you're gonna always be my baby.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:49:33]:
    Now, Jaylah, I know you mentioned that you are becoming a social influencer. You're doing things out there. People get to know you in different ways outside of the work that you're doing at the bank. As we finish up today, if people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:49:46]:
    Yes. So please follow me on Instagram at jaylah.iman_ the Well, you'll also find out that I am a full time photographer as well, and I do the Travel occasionally as well for my very own business, Lady J productions, and then you can also find me on TikTok at jaylah dot Iman as well. Thanks for having me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:50:11]:
    Thank you for being here. And Aqeel, as I said before, you're busy. You're out there. If people wanna find out more about you, where's the best place?

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:50:18]:
    And please forgive me. I don't wanna sound over the top. I really just learned this from a couple of fans. Google me. I think everything pops up. That's so crazy to even do that. It's, I and so I literally had to do that one day. I googled myself, and I'm like, oh my god.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:50:34]:
    But, yes, Google me, Aqeel T. Ash-Shakoor or Aqeel Ash-Shakoor on Facebook. Again, Aqeel Ash-Shakoor. Instagram, Aqeel the actor. YouTube, again, Aqeel Ash-Shakoor, And my background is not showing now, but Empowered Minds, I do a lot of, Again, self improvement videos to spiritual videos as well.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:50:55]:
    So yes. And don't wanna plug, but

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:50:57]:
    Catch him on TV. Grab your popcorn. Grab the guys.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:51:02]:
    Been blessed to be a, recognizable face on the Law and Order SVU and Quite a few other to dig with projects and some movies and on television. And something that I'd really just found out, I didn't know that I'm actually presented as one of the No. When they do the Peacock advertisement for the shows, and someone's telling me he's like, I see you every day. I was like, impossible. No boy. He's like, no. I see you every day.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:51:27]:
    And I was like, really? It's like, wow. So that's an that's an honor within itself. Small town country boy that made an affirmation at 9 years old to his baby sister that one day, this is what I would do. And that's what has been instilling in my family that we do. And my daughter bless she did bless me about a couple of weeks ago. I read a post, And I confirmed it with her, and she said in the post, I just saw it, and it brought me to tears. I didn't tell her that part.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:51:57]:
    But She says my father made legends. And what else can you say? I'm a blessed husband and father.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:52:04]:
    Well, Aqeel, well, Jaylah, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here, for telling your story, for being raw and open about the journey that you've been on, and I wish you both the best.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:52:15]:
    No Thank you so

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:52:16]:
    Yes. Thanks for having us, Christopher. Thank you.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:52:18]:
    And for your fans, Christopher, I want them to know that this wasn't just No. A pop up. I've appreciated you ever since learning of you and knowing you for years as my wife, Tanisha, was in Thomas Cooleyham Law School, No. And you've always been a familiar face and always, a pleasant person to talk to. And back then, it was also go lug nuts.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:52:42]:
    No. Yes.

    Jaylah Ash-Shakoor [00:52:43]:
    That's it.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:52:43]:
    So yeah. Yeah. You you've always been special in our lives too, so no Thank you. Thank you ever so much. And for my 1st interview, I think I did that with dad with sons. Some time ago, we did an article. So, I I I applaud the work that you're doing. And and if I could be of help, please give me a call.

    Aqeel Ash-Shakoor [00:53:01]:
    Thank you, sir.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:53:03]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood the insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. The Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, the But more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together daughter. Of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with Daughters is a program of fathering together. The We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong and powered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:54:01]:
    We're all in the same boat, and it's the Full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. Them. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring the AK because those kids are growing fast. The time goes the just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, the Carpenters and musclemen get out and be the world to Them. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Steve Steele: A Coach's Journey of Love, Family, and Empowering Daughters

    Steve Steele: A Coach's Journey of Love, Family, and Empowering Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    Fatherhood is a journey filled with an array of unique challenges and rewarding moments. In the Dads with Daughters podcast, guest Steve Steele sheds light on his personal journey as a father of four, offering insightful perspectives and valuable advice. From embracing the differences in raising daughters and sons to balancing work as a coach and family life, Steve shares his experiences and the lessons he has learned along the way.

    Embracing Differences in Raising Sons and Daughters

    Steve starts by highlighting the differences he observed in raising his son, Simon, and his daughters, Gianna and Shay. He emphasizes that each child is unique, showcasing distinct interests and needs. As a coach, Steve acknowledges the importance of engaging with his children's individual passions, even if they differ from his own. He underlines the significance of being a playful father, actively participating in activities that resonate with his daughters, thus fostering a supportive and understanding environment.

    Parental Presence and One-on-One Time

    The significance of one-on-one time with each child resonates throughout Steve's narrative. Given the demands of a coaching career and the challenges of raising four children, finding dedicated time for each child becomes essential. Steve emphasizes both physical and emotional presence, acknowledging that being mentally and emotionally available for his children is as important as being physically present. He shares the value of carving out time for individual interactions, aiming to create meaningful connections and memories with each of his children.

    The Impact of Strong Family Foundations

    An essential aspect of Steve's journey as a father is the strong foundation built within his family. He recognizes the immense support and understanding of his spouse, highlighting the significance of effective communication and shared responsibilities. Steve acknowledges the mutual respect and cooperation between partners, emphasizing the importance of showing love and support in front of their children. By fostering a strong marital relationship, he aims to provide his children with a positive example of love, understanding, and collaboration.

    Work-Life Balance and Role Modeling

    Balancing a demanding career in coaching with family life presents unique challenges, particularly during the football season. Steve discusses the importance of disconnecting from work-related responsibilities upon returning home, ensuring undivided attention towards his family. He underscores the significance of being emotionally available for his children, setting an example by expressing his emotions and demonstrating a respectful, loving relationship with his spouse.

    Lessons from Steve: Presence and Love

    Steve's journey as a father is a testament to the power of love, presence, and understanding. His experiences and insights exemplify the vital role that fathers play in shaping their children's lives. Through his dedication to being present, fostering individual connections, and promoting a strong familial foundation, Steve encapsulates the essence of fatherhood, serving as an inspiration for dads navigating similar paths.

    As fathers, the lessons learned from Steve Steele's journey serve as guiding principles, emphasizing the significance of establishing strong relationships, fostering individual connections, and prioritizing presence and love in creating a nurturing environment for children. Steve's wisdom allows us to embrace the joys and challenges of fatherhood, reminding us that love, understanding, and presence are pivotal elements in nurturing and raising children to become strong, independent individuals.

    In conclusion, the wisdom imparted by Steve Steele provides invaluable insights into the multifaceted journey of fatherhood, inspiring fathers to navigate this path with love, dedication, and a profound commitment to being present for their children.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to have a conversation with you, to sit down with you, to the Walk with you on this path that you're on to raise those strong, independent women that you want your daughters to become in the future. And every week, It is definitely such a great opportunity for me to be able to work with you on this journey because all of our journeys are just a little bit different. The way that we father is different, and that's okay.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:55]:
    There's not one right way to father. We learn that every week through the people that come on the show, and I hope that you learn it from the dads that you are talking to in your own communities And that you talk to on a daily basis because it is important to have community, to build community, to the Create that community for yourself. Now every week, I love being able to have different guests on the show that are walking this journey in a little bit different way. And this week, we got another great guest with us. Steve Steele is with us today, and Steve is a father of 4. He's a teacher. He's a coach.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:32]:
    He's doing a lot of different things, and his football team just won the championships in, in North Dakota. So we're excited about that as well. And we're gonna be talking to him about the journey that he's been on with his kids, and I'm really just excited to have him here today. Steve, thanks so much for being here today.

    Steve Steele [00:01:51]:
    Thanks for having me on. Always great to talk about parenting and, you know, how we can make our daughters' lives as good as they can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:57]:
    Well, I really appreciate you being here. And first and foremost, I know you have 4 kids and I love the the show by being able to turn the clock back in time. And so I wanna turn the clock all the way back to that first moment that you found out you're going to be a dad To a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Steve Steele [00:02:12]:
    I didn't find out until she was born. We didn't find out on any of our 4 kids. We had our our boy, Simon, first. He's 6 now. And then, our second one was was Gianna, and, you know, we we actually were kinda stressing about names. You know, we had 2 boys' names picked out when we got married, and we had no girls' names. So, so it was Kind of one of those, soon as they told us it was a girl, and then we met her, then, we kinda had to figure out a name. So we ended up going with Gianna, and we loved that name, and then we and we obviously

    Steve Steele [00:02:39]:
    Loved her ever since. And then, same thing on that third one then, with Shay. Shay's our our 2nd daughter, and then ended up with Seth as our 4th, our little boy. So we've got Boy, girl, girl, boy. And, you know, like I said, it's it's never been so much of a preparation in terms of it being a girl or a boy because we had absolutely no idea what we were doing. We just the a healthy baby, and, we're blessed to have 4 of them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:01]:
    So as you said, 4 kids. You started with a boy, 2 girls, a boy. Talk to me about what you've learned along the way and some of the differences you've seen in going the From being a dad to a son to then being a dad to 2 daughters and now a son again. So what have you had to do differently in the way that you father As you became a father to a daughter.

    Steve Steele [00:03:26]:
    I think, honestly, this is one of those things where your 1st kid and I think everyone kinda says this. Your 1st kid, you're You're trying to be ultra prepared in all these things, and then, yeah, you have the 1st kid and kinda regardless boy or girl, you those books don't really tell you a whole lot once you you're faced with, raising this kid. And and, you know, I think that was a really good thing for us to understand was that, hey, you know, no matter how well you prepare, the You you can't be fully prepared to to drive home from the hospital with that beautiful baby, and then going into having a daughter, you know, everything was just Little bit different. You know, I think baby wise, I don't know that there's people that'll say it's one way. It's it's a little easier to sleep or not easier to the based off of boy or girl. I don't know that we found that.

    Steve Steele [00:04:05]:
    But, you know, once they kinda got into that playful age, you know, once they get into the the 2 year olds and stuff like that, then it it's definitely been a little bit different. So I think our boy, obviously, way more right into sports wanting to be like dad and do all these things, and our our the was way more into princesses and everything else. And as a coach, being able to embrace that side and not just be like, well, no. You know, we're only gonna do this, the You know, I'm gonna go play with Simon because I like sports more, which, obviously, I like sports more than princesses, but but still being able to to just go and be the playful dad and and and do the the that she enjoys doing. I think that's been the hardest and most important part to keep tabs on, I think, as you get older.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:43]:
    It is important. It's important to be able to the Be engaged in the things that, as you said, your kids are really excited about. And it may not be the things that you're excited about, But you can get them to be excited about the things that you're excited about in many different ways. And as you said, the Being a father makes you push yourself in many different directions, and you should be pushing yourself to be able to be engaged in that way. The Now you talked about the fact that your daughter does enjoy some of the girl things, some of the, you know, the Barbies or the dolls, the princess aspects, You know, things like that. But each of your kids is completely unique.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:21]:
    Talk to me about how you've had to work the To develop those unique relationships with each of your children. Also, the fact that you have a role where, the Especially during the fall, you're gonna be really busy. So how do you build those unique relationships to make sure that your kids know the That you are engaged and you are connected to them individually versus collectively.

    Steve Steele [00:05:46]:
    That's honestly been one of the biggest Challenges, I guess, as we've had. 1 from 1 to 2, and 2 to 3, and 3 to 4 is finding that kind of 1 on 1 time. You know, I think everybody the In the mornings, it's mayhem. Everyone's running around, getting dressed, and all that, and bedtime can be kinda similar. So I think finding the times to do things that she likes to do, and, you know, with our 2 year old Shay now, kinda she's starting to get to that age where we're looking to do things that she likes to do now too, you know, because she can have her own interest At this point and then just finding the time to to do them whether or not you wanna do them. You know, I think that's a a common parent thing where you get so tired, obviously, with babies, Especially where you're used to not sleeping, and you obviously got your jobs and all that, where it can be tempting to just get home and and wanna relax, And kinda try and shut the kids out and be like, no. No. I'm tired.

    Steve Steele [00:06:30]:
    I wanna do this, or I need to do that. And really just putting that aside and putting the kids first and doing whatever it is that they wanna do Because ultimately, that's how they're gonna know you care and that you love them because you're, you know, the I think they probably still understand. Okay. He's tired. Maybe he had a bad day at work or whatever else. If you're willing to put that aside and and and do what the kids wanna do, then they're gonna understand that you love them and care for them and and ultimately that they're important in your life.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:53]:
    So one of the things that I'd be interested in learning a little bit more about for you is as you you you did start with a son. You've moved into being a father of 2 daughters. And what have you found so far has been the hardest part for you in being a father to a daughter?

    Steve Steele [00:07:10]:
    I think the hardest part in a lot of ways is Probably, you know, when they choose things, it it is I mean, again, I I like the Disney movies. My Little Pony is a is a very big favorite of the girls right now, and Super Kitties. And And there are just some shows where I mean, it's it's hard to to want to be interested in some of them. And, you know, the books, we're really big readers, you know, with our family. I think that the Both are that was another big thing that my wife and I were very important on is trying to make sure that they've read a 1,000 books by kindergarten. They have a program here at our local library that all of our the Kids have now done. And then, you know, it really allows you to learn what they like and kinda see the different interests that they have through what books they choose at the library.

    Steve Steele [00:07:48]:
    And My Little Pony's just kinda been one, and, Fancy Nancy is another one where the girls really, really enjoy those, and, you know, obviously, again, it's you you read sportsbooks or my son's into Star Wars, and Those are a little bit easier for me to get into when you're reading to them, but really just diving in and and making it being goofy, being silly, and And and kinda making sure that you're having just as much fun reading those books can be a challenge at times. So finding the ways to to kinda let yourself out of that box of What you feel like you might enjoy, and and just being goofy and and having fun with the girls the way that they need to have fun too is is been a challenge, but it's something that I think's Been very rewarding for for both myself and my daughters.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:26]:
    Now as a coach, in a lot of ways, you are a mentor, you are a dad To many other people in many different ways and how you have to work with the people on your team to be able to get them to the Accomplish what you're hoping for them to accomplish and to work together. How has being a coach helped you In the way that you father.

    Steve Steele [00:08:50]:
    You know, I would almost argue it's the opposite in that, you know, really having kids has has made me a better coach. Just in that sense that, you know, I think the the the schematic side of of coaching is is something that you're gonna get from from playing that sport or whatnot, and obviously, from your coaching mentors and all that kind of stuff. But, you know, when you have your own kids and and you You have that love and that caring that it's you really can't understand until you have your own. I mean, then all of a sudden when you're coaching kids, you're you're coaching other peoples. You know that what they love, and they've loved forever, and will love forever. And I think that really kinda changed my my mentality of a lot of ways, and I think that's changed, the My philosophy of coaching a little bit just in that sense that it does make you really focus on the person first, and focus on the good kids and giving them the experience that I would want for my own kids. And, you know, I think that my kids are are fortunate.

    Steve Steele [00:09:37]:
    They get to be around the team a lot. You know, all season long, they they're ending up at practice the here and there. One's at one thing, then the rest will be at practice or or vice versa. And the the kids love having them around, and I think it goes both ways in the sense that they also See me being a dad, and understand that, hey, I'm a football coach, but right now my kids are here, and we're not just gonna leave them, and they're gonna be equally as involved as the everybody else because they're here right now, and, you know, some of the the kids do great jobs having fun with our kids, you know, whenever they're at practice, and managers do an awesome jobs with the kids. And the All of our other coaches have kids too, and a lot of them are at practice. So it's a very family friendly atmosphere and, you know, something that I hope benefits the kids as they Obviously, graduate, go on, and and then have families of their own, but also something that I think really benefits our own kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:22]:
    Let's talk a little bit more about the That life work balance because I think that that's challenging for many dads. And as I said, you're a busy guy. You've got a lot of things going on, especially during the football season. And, you know, you're gonna be pulled away from your family in many different ways. And with kids being young, that's not always an easy thing to understand. So Talk to me about what you've had to do to be able to have that balance, to be engaged in that way that you want to be engaged even when you're being pulled away the In that fall term where you're in that football season.

    Steve Steele [00:10:54]:
    Yeah. You know, I think this is probably the most important thing, and by no means am I remotely perfect on this. I know I can always be better But, you know, finding ways to disconnect from your phone. I mean, I think that's a huge and important thing where, you know, especially, again, in the coaching world that you're gonna go home, and you're gonna get text From parents and kids and players and coaches and everybody else with questions, some of them are important questions that that need to be answered, some of them are not. I think the the most important thing that we we're trying to do is just put that phone on do not disturb until the kids go to bed. Whenever I get home, it's, you know, hey. This is their time. I've no my time at work.

    Steve Steele [00:11:26]:
    I've spent my time at practice. So the kids are gonna go to bed at 7:30, 8 o'clock. They're still young. So if you get home at 6, the giving them that dedicated 2 hours is important. You don't want them to see them for the 2 hours a day that you get to see them where they're seeing you on your phone. So really just making sure that when I am home, the My attention is on them. And like we said, we're trying to find the 1 on 1 time. You know, usually, we kinda let 1 of them stay up after bedtime of the rest of them to kinda spend some of that 1 on 1 time

    Steve Steele [00:11:51]:
    Just so that we do get some every week, but, you know, otherwise then once they're all in bed and everyone's happy, then you can try and get back to the phone and and answer some of those questions if they're there.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:00]:
    Talk to me a little bit about a lot of times this goes down to this goes down to the fact that you have to have a strong foundation the in your family to be able to support your kids and allow for your kids to be able to see that strong foundation too. You talk about the fact that you and your wife are working hard to be able the connect and to help your kids to be strong, but you've got young kids. And having young kids definitely can cause a lot of stress too. And while you're trying to create those strong relationships with your own daughters, you also have to maintain a strong relationship the Inside your family with your significant other. So what have you had to do to be able to maintain that strong relationship with your spouse even when it's stressful, When you're busy, you're being pulled out. When you've got the demands of 4 kids that are all needing something a little bit different. Yeah.

    Steve Steele [00:12:52]:
    I mean, first and foremost, I mean, my wife's a champ. I mean, she's Know the right way to describe it, but nothing would function without her. Coaches' wives are so heroic in what they do and and being able to the the household when we are gone for those extended periods. And I think the important part is then recognizing and and celebrating that and then understanding, hey. There's gonna be days where she's had a bad day at work or Dads with She's not feeling it, and and you've gotta be able to put pick up that slack. And, you know, and I I think we do a great job of communicating for the most part. Obviously, that's a Doug.

    Steve Steele [00:13:20]:
    A huge part of all relationships in life is communicating and having the correct expectations, and that can only be done through communication. But then, you know, just again, not being afraid to ask help. Thursday night or a day that we're having a tough time, then communicating that and understanding that, hey, it's okay. I'm gonna have to pick this up, and that's okay, because, you know, there's gonna be the days where that's me and She's gonna do the same thing for me, so I just think that's probably the most important part. Is again, just having that complete open communication, and, Dom. Making sure that we're always on the same page of what needs to happen and what our needs are as spouses for each other.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:52]:
    So important and definitely something that's not always easy, But you have to keep communicating. You have to keep talking. You have to make sure that you're on the same page because as your kids get older, they will test that, the And they will definitely put kind of make you kind of go 1 to 1. I've had that happen many times where the One of my well, my daughter will say, well, mom said this, and I go back to mom and mom says, I never said that. That's not what I said. So we always have to personally, in our family, we always have to go back and we have to check-in and say, okay. Did you really say this before I answer my daughter? I'm going to make sure about that. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:37]:
    Are you ready? Yes. The In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Steve Steele [00:14:40]:
    Love.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:41]:
    Now when was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter.

    Steve Steele [00:14:46]:
    This last weekend, we took our girls, again, trying to find some of the more 1 on 1 time and my wife's turn, and and we took them to Disney on Ice. We kinda had the girls go there and the boys go somewhere else, and we kinda put this together, obviously, kind of as a little family trip where we did some things, but really hearing them talk about it afterwards and just seeing that the raw, unbridled, the excitement from them, Docs Really just one of those things where, you know, that there is and then obviously, you know, from the wife understanding that, you know, seeing some of the pictures she got to take and and hearing her recollection of everything. I mean, that's what it's about. You know, you created some special moments that weekend, and it's as much as, you know, I wanna be involved, obviously, in all those moments, it's Equally important for my wife to be able to have those same moments with our daughters. So just very recently fresh in my mind, one that comes to mind and Very, very special weekend.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:35]:
    Now if I was to talk to your kids, and I know not all your kids are talking right now, but if I were to talk to your kids, How would they describe you as a dad?

    Steve Steele [00:15:43]:
    They call me a coach, and they call me goofy. You know, I think, very, very rarely. I get trouble from mom too from being goofy at times. I'm definitely not a strict disciplinarian. I'd say I'm very, very fun and and kinda goofy around the kids a lot more than I am. If I'm getting after them, then they know that the The lines have been crossed, and they need to settle down because I'll I'll play with them just about as long as they are allowed to play.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:04]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Steve Steele [00:16:06]:
    Honestly, my parents, I don't know that I could have asked for a greater example in life, both of them, really. I mean, they sacrificed so much to give me at least the opportunity to No. Every single interest that I had. I think I was interested in sports. I was interested in music. Whatever it was, I mean, they made sure that I was able to try it despite Despite all the challenges that come along from that from their end and just seeing the example they set of of what a loving marriage and couple should look like, just something that again, I I know it's benefited me in my own life, Just a constant thing to look up to and and hope that I can live up to.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:36]:
    Now you've talked about your own experience. You've shared some advice that you have learned along the way. As we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice that you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Steve Steele [00:16:45]:
    I think so much is be present even not just physically present. Be mentally and emotionally present. It's okay to cry in front of your kids. You know, it's okay for them to see you, experience the emotions that you have. And then just again, I think the other important part that I don't know that I really touched Your relationship with your wife, you know, or or your spouse is is what you're showing them love is. You know, so I mean, if you want them to obviously be looking for that relationship someday, it's it's your job to kind of also show them what a man should look like in a respectful Marriage. So, you know, I think that's another important part.

    Steve Steele [00:17:19]:
    So I think those are the kind of the most important things that I hope I'm getting across to my own kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:24]:
    Now, Steve, before I finish up today, if people wanna find out more about you and your coaching and your team or anything else about you, where's the best place for them to go?

    Steve Steele [00:17:34]:
    Yeah. We've got our football websites, TFrigsfootball.weebly.com, and that's got all of our football info. My email is [email protected]. Again, always always happy to to the Talk about being a dad or talk football. They can't do too much of either one.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:54]:
    Well, Steve, thanks so much again for sharing your story today. I truly appreciate it, and I wish you all the best.

    Steve Steele [00:18:00]:
    Thank you very much.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:01]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information the that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, the and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together .org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with Daughters is a program of Fathering Together.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:59]:
    We're all in the same boat, the and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. The the Bring your a game because those kids are growing fast. The the goes by just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, the Carpenters and muscle men get out and be in the world shoes. Domino. Be the best dad you can be!

  • Growing Together: Nurturing Mental Health and Creating Special Moments with Daughters

    Growing Together: Nurturing Mental Health and Creating Special Moments with Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    Being a father is a journey full of joy, challenges, and growth. In a recent episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomed guest Tim Cox, a father of two, to discuss the unique experiences and challenges of raising daughters. Their heartfelt conversation touched on various aspects of fatherhood, including creating special moments, balancing work and family, mental health, and nurturing unique connections with each child as they grow. Let's explore some of the key takeaways and insights shared in this insightful episode.

    Creating Special Moments and Individualized Experiences

    Tim Cox emphasized the importance of spending quality time with his 8-year-old daughter, especially with the arrival of her 3-year-old brother. He and his partner make a conscious effort to create separate and special experiences for each child, recognizing their individual needs and interests. This highlights the significance of fostering unique connections with each child and ensuring that they feel valued and cherished.

    Engaging in activities that resonate with each child, such as playing games, being inspired by educational shows like Bluey, and sharing a love for music and creativity, plays a pivotal role in strengthening the bond between father and daughter. These shared experiences lay a strong foundation for building trust, communication, and lasting memories. It's a testament to the power of quality time spent with children, nurturing their emotional well-being and overall development.

    Balancing Work and Family

    The challenges of balancing work and family are a common concern for many fathers. Tim and Dr. Christopher acknowledged the difficulty of managing professional responsibilities while prioritizing family time. Tim, who works in social media for a university, expressed his struggles with finding a balance and not missing out on creating memorable moments with his daughter.

    This resonates with many fathers who strive to provide for their families while also being actively engaged in their children's lives. It underscores the need for open communication with employers, setting boundaries, and making intentional choices to foster a harmonious work-life balance.

    Nurturing Emotional Well-Being and Mental Health

    Tim Cox's candid discussion about his daughter's anxiety and his own experiences with seeking help for depression sheds light on the importance of addressing mental health within the family dynamic. His openness in discussing anxiety and therapy with his daughter demonstrates the value of normalizing conversations around emotional well-being and seeking professional support when needed.

    Moreover, Tim's journey towards seeking help for his mental health highlights the courage and resilience required to navigate personal challenges while also fulfilling the responsibilities of fatherhood. By sharing his experiences, Tim exemplifies the strength in vulnerability and the impact of prioritizing mental wellness for himself and his family.

    Evolving Connections with Growing Children

    As children grow, their needs, interests, and levels of independence evolve. Dr. Christopher emphasized the ongoing parental relationship as children mature, emphasizing the significance of adapting to these changes and nurturing evolving connections.

    Tim's shared experience of deciding whether to prioritize his daughter's emotional distress over work underscores the nuanced decisions fathers face as they support their children's emotional well-being. This highlights the importance of being present, empathetic, and responsive to the dynamic needs of growing children.

    Embracing Imperfections and Collective Learning

    Tim's advice to other fathers to acknowledge their imperfections and learn from others reflects the humility and willingness to grow as a parent. Fatherhood is indeed a collective learning experience, and the willingness to seek guidance, connect with other fathers, and learn from different perspectives enriches the journey of raising empowered daughters.

    In conclusion, "Dads with Daughters" continues to provide valuable insights and resources for fathers, encouraging them to embrace the joys and challenges of parenthood. Tim Cox's thoughtful reflections and experiences highlight the significance of creating special moments, navigating work-life balance, prioritizing mental health, nurturing unique connections with growing children, and fostering a collective approach to parenting. As fathers engage in these conversations and embrace the journey of fatherhood, they play an integral role in shaping the lives of their daughters and creating enduring bonds built on love, support, and understanding.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, the Raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, every week, I love being able to sit down with you, to Talk to you to be on this journey alongside of you. Because as I've told you many times, I've got 2 daughters myself, and I the feel like I'm learning something every day, and I know that you have the same type of path that you're on. And we're at different phases in our daughters' lives, but that doesn't mean we can't learn from each other and we can't support each other along the way. That's why every week I love being able to sit down with you to be able to talk about issues that are sBeing a father is a journey full of joy, challenges, and growth. In a recent episode of "Dads with Daughters," host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomed guest Tim Cox, a father of two, to discuss the unique experiences and challenges of raising daughters. Their heartfelt conversation touched on various aspects of fatherhood, including creating special moments, balancing work and family, mental health, and nurturing unique connections with each child as they grow. Let's explore some of the key takeaways and insights shared in this insightful episode.ometimes the Ones that are not that easy to handle or not that easy to talk about, but sometimes they're lighter issues or things that the We all just deal with in everyday life, but we kinda struggle through it. And I think it's important to Talk about these things to be able to have honest conversations about them so that we can normalize it the And allow for all of us to know that that it's okay. It's okay to talk about these things, to be able to the Engage with other dads about these things, and that's why every week I love being able to bring you different guests, different people with different experiences that have gone through either being a father to a daughter or have other resources or things that they are doing to support dads. Because we have to be able to ask for the help that we need when we need it, and that's why it's so important that we have these every week. This week, we got another great guest with us. Tim Cox is with us. Tim is a father of 2, and we are gonna be talking about Being a dad to a daughter and what that's been like for him. I'm really excited to have him on. Tim, thanks so much for being here today.

    Tim Cox [00:02:14]:
    . Thank you for having me. I'm very excited to be on this.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:17]:
    Now I will be honest and say that Tim has been a part of the fathering together family for many years. He was one of the the Initial people that was part of our leadership team and helping us with our Facebook communities, helping us with our videos, and helping us to Doc. To really amp up the way in which we were telling our story, so I am excited that we that I'm finally getting him on the show. The And 1st and foremost, Jim, one of the things that I love doing is turning the clock back in time, and I wanna go all the way back to that the moment when you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:50]:
    What was going through your head?

    Tim Cox [00:02:50]:
    I think I was scared. My daughter is the 8 years old now. I just turned 44 2 days ago. So I was you know, we waited a little later in life. I was 36, I guess, And I was nervous. My wife and I had decided that we weren't going to have children, and we were kind of enjoying our younger days with that. The And then we sort of you know, we had our nieces, and then they started to grow up.

    Tim Cox [00:03:14]:
    And then we were like, okay. You know, maybe we do want kids. And so we decided to have a Dyle, and it was definitely nerve wracking. I was trying to read every book I could find. I was trying to find everything . Possible every resource, talking to people. It was it was a a wild time.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:32]:
    It definitely can be a wild time, especially the As you said, you know, there's no one right way to father, and there's lots of books out there. There's lots of resources out there that you can turn to and other dads that you can turn to as well. Now you talked about having some fear at the beginning of having your daughter. The What would you say has been or is your biggest fear in raising your daughter?

    Tim Cox [00:03:57]:
    Well, I'll go with my my first fear first after she was born, And we were getting ready to leave the hospital, and I carried the car seat upstairs. And I was like, how do I put this tiny thing the in this car seat and secure it safely. And the hospitals were like, well, we can't really help you with this because they wanna make sure that they're backed the up in case there was some kind of accident or anything, so they play it safe. And I remember that was we did all the parenting classes and everything like that, and the That was the first thing that I was like, we didn't talk car seats in the parenting class. This fluffy little kid with the big outfit and stuff on, like, how do we Titan and, you know, the car seat enough, and is this hurting the child and all this stuff. And, you know, at that point, I didn't realize that, like, you don't want anything puffy. Like, you know, my kids the Still don't use jackets and car seats.

    Tim Cox [00:04:48]:
    And so it was all those kind of things. That was, like, the first fear of being a dad or the first, the like moment of confusion. And I remember I was quickly YouTubing videos to try and see what to do with this car seat. And then but when I look at, like, the Big picture. I want to make sure that my daughter and I have a 4 year old son, almost 4 year old son also, the And I wanna make sure that they grow up to be good people, and I wanna make sure that they grow up caring about other people. And that's my biggest fear is what if I'm not doing enough to give them the tools they need to do that. And I think I believe I am doing enough for that, but that's the Probably my biggest fear in life is just what should I be doing better for my kids to make sure that they have everything they need to succeed?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:37]:
    So I think one of the things that many dads struggle with is, like you said, you want to raise kids that are kind, that give back, that are doing things the To allow for them to be a part of society in many different ways. Talk to me about what you are doing or the have done to be able to

    Tim Cox [00:05:58]:
    do just that. I think we try and read a lot of books that show strong female figures in the books, And we try and have our kids get them give them experiences that put them to give them the ability. Learn about the future and learn what it is to help people and you know? So I think those are, like, the kind of things that we do the most, But still that leaves you to that, am I doing enough? What could I do more?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:24]:
    And that's never an easy thing to know is the impact that that what you're doing now the And what that impact is going to be 5 years from now, 10 years from now, 20 years from now. But the little things that you do the Step by step where you may not see an impact right away. You're setting the seed and you're letting it grow. And I think that that's the What's so important for fathers to do is to be consistent and to continue to do the things that you're hoping that they will do in the future. By doing that, as I said, it's planting that seed and it's allowing that to take root. And then as you said, reading books or other things, great concepts, great ideas. Now you now have 2 kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:06]:
    You have a son and a daughter. And with each of your kids, you have to be able to do what You Can to build those unique relationships because each child is very different. Not only do they have different ages and different stages that they're at, That need different types of bothering in many different ways. What are you doing to be able to build that strong relationship the With your daughter.

    Tim Cox [00:07:30]:
    I try and I try and do things with her, and I think that's really important to do. There's a lot of the jealousy comes in, especially she's 8. He's 3. She had a long time with just mom and dad Until he came around, we would decided we only wanted 1 child for the longest time, and then we were like, well, maybe we'll have a second one. The And that's how, you know, there ended up being a spread out, which I think is the greatest thing is having that spread because she can be you know, help teach him also. So the things I'm teaching her, she's then teaching him. But, you know, we really want to try and make her feel special.

    Tim Cox [00:08:12]:
    So I'll take her somewhere to something that I won't take him. I'll do it during nap to make it easy. My partner does the same. She'll take our daughter to something. I think she's taking her roller skating tonight, and I'll stay home with Jude, my son. And, you know, so I think the big thing is trying to the Separate time and build out time for them to have you as just you.

    Tim Cox [00:08:36]:
    So they're not this the forgotten child or they don't become jointed with their sibling at all times so that they still feel special to you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:45]:
    And are there Specific things that you and your daughter love to do together that are special just for the 2 of you?

    Tim Cox [00:08:52]:
    Yeah. We do. We both play a lot of Silly games. Even just the game Marco Polo typically done in a pool. We play in our driveway. The She always cheats, but it's okay. Suddenly, you know, she'll, like, well, they all freeze, and then you have to, like, walk towards the person with your eyes closed. And somehow, she the Always finds me, and she just says I'm bad at it.

    Tim Cox [00:09:14]:
    But we do stuff like that. You know, she loves playing. One of her favorite shows is the show Bluey, which the is one of my favorite shows too, and I think every parent of a young child that's watched that show loves that show because it's so real. The And we play games from that show that we learn, like Shadowlands, where you can only step on shadows, and we go for walks around the block. She really likes the music, and we've played guitar together. She's not quite there of knowing what she's playing, but she likes to the Make it up, and she likes to make up lyrics to songs. And me being a musician, and I've played in Torden bands and played in bands the My whole life up until the pandemic, basically, was when I kind of took a break from music. You know, it's fun to see that creativity from her the where we have just like a little kid drum set, and she will sit at it and start playing.

    Tim Cox [00:10:08]:
    And sometimes, like, that is a perfect drum beat. The So we have these kind of, like, little things that that we can share that Jude, my son, isn't quite at the age to the Be able to I mean, he bangs on the drums, and he actually does decently on drums too. But he's obviously a 3 year old little tornado running around. The So, you know, my daughter and I, we love to kinda do all these things together that's just kind of us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:36]:
    It is important, especially when you have kids that Door. Vastly different in ages, and there is that gap. As you said, your daughter had you in her life first, So being able to make sure that there's not animosity there, and we had the same we didn't have as large of a gap, but between our oldest and our youngest, . There always was a little bit of separation, a little bit of animosity that was there that our oldest ended up Dom. Losing that 1 on 1 time in her mind in some aspect, even though we still did many things together just the Between her and us, but it does make a difference, and you have to work hard in that regard. And being a dad is never easy. What would you say has been the hardest Darts. For you in being a father to a daughter.

    Tim Cox [00:11:23]:
    I think the hardest part is probably trying to balance work and life the and time with her. Work obviously takes up a lot of time. Days, I feel like, you know, from morning when I make her breakfast . When I, like, kiss her good night at 9, it's the entire day is is done, and we're kinda running around, and there's all sorts of activities. . So I think it's finding ways to chisel out time to spend is important, and I'm not the best the At work life balance where I do social media for university, and I am sitting there and I will the host things at night, like, 11 o'clock at night. And I'm don't always have the best ability to just, like, turn off and be with the the family at all times, but I'm I really try hard to do that. And I think a lot of dads have that same issue, and I think we're all Doc.

    Tim Cox [00:12:20]:
    Kind of in the same boat, and a lot of times we'll, you know, act like we're always able always there, you know, because everyone puts the best the Image forward on social media, but we're all in kind of the same thing saying, like, okay. Did I do something with my daughter today? Did I give her a the special moment that she will remember. And I think the biggest thing I try and do is just make sure that that exists. For example, she gave me a book the For my birthday, we celebrated it last night because girl scouts was the night before. So I waited a day for my birthday, and she gave me a book of the top ten reasons I have the best dad. The And the book is adorable, and it shows all sorts of things like I love you because you help me when I get hurt. The And she drew a little picture of me putting a Band Aid on her. She loves when I play with her, and the picture was me as a horse on the ground with her jumping on top of me and the Riding me around.

    Tim Cox [00:13:14]:
    And these are the kind of things that I do, and a lot of times I'm very tired, but I'm like, there's gonna be a day that she doesn't wanna play. And one of the saddest things to think about and I carry her around all the time, and she's 8 and I'm £65, and I'm carrying her everywhere I go the When I can or I put her on my shoulders or any of those kind of things. Because as dads, we have to realize there is going to be a day. That you put your child down, you put your daughter down, and you never pick her up again. And it's heartbreaking to think of that. And I can't even . Imagine that day coming, but it's getting closer and closer that she still wants me to comfort her.

    Tim Cox [00:13:56]:
    She's daddy's little girl, and it drives my partner Crazy sometimes because she's always like, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy, daddy. But I'm loving it, and I'm trying to just remember that I need to make the Time for this because I don't know when that time is over.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:14]:
    And it will be over before you know it or at least I'm not gonna say completely over. You're not gonna be able to carry your child eventually because, you know, they do get the Larger, and it becomes a lot harder to do that physically. But that being said, you'll always be her dad, . And you'll always have that connection. So doing what you can now to build those strong relationships and to connect with her now the And show her that you are always there for her will still continue even after they leave the house. I mean, I've got the My oldest is at college and but we still stay connected, but it's in a little bit different way. And as they do get older, you have to take the cues from them. I'm not always the best about that, but it is something that you have to be willing to do.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:05]:
    My oldest has gone to college, and She is about 11 and a half hours away from our house, and we had to set up parameters of the How our relationship would continue and listen and try to follow her lead. And I'm sure that as she the Gets older, that's gonna have to continue because when she gets out of college and moves to the next step, more and more, they're going to not need everything that we have Offered them as a young person, but they will still need us in some ways and will come back to us the Because of that for some reasons. So I say those things just to say for all of us as fathers, there's going to be these the Times, these ebbs, these flows, these things that are going to be these seasons that we go through, that our kids go through. And some of those seasons, you will need. To be more involved, and other times, you won't have to be as involved, and you'll have to take a step back. And that's not easy, and you the just have to know that it's not going to be easy, and I can tell you that 20 times, 30 times, 40 times. And you may still find that the You're still not prepared. And that that's okay, but it's just something to be aware of.

    Tim Cox [00:16:19]:
    And I think that's really important too, you know, because You know when they do need you, what you're able to do. For example, this morning, I put her on the bus and drove to work. And when I got to work, which is like a the 25 minute drive or so, I got a call from the school, and she was crying on the phone that today was stuffy day, And she forgot to bring her stuffy to school. And in in 3rd grade, it's the year that the teachers stop communicating with the parents as much, And they try and teach the kids to do it, so we didn't realize that it was stuffy day. And I had to kinda make a decision where I was literally . Into my office, and I'm like, do I continue on, or do I turn around, drive 25 minutes back, pick up Sniffers, .

    Tim Cox [00:17:07]:
    And bring sniffers to the school and then come back to work. And that was, like, the kind of thing where I was, like, you know what? I was, like, I this is important to her. The She's clearly upset about it, and I'm gonna bring that to her. And it's kind of the thing is where she gets bad anxiety about things. She gets all these kind of things where . She's afraid of getting sick, so she'll just tell us she's sick and not go to and try not to go to school. And we ended up putting her in the therapy for these kind of things because it's important to to catch something early and have her start working out the feelings now while she's younger. Because the While not having a stuffy at school is not fun, she's probably not the only kid that forgot it, but to .

    Tim Cox [00:17:51]:
    Then, you know, get really upset into where, like, I knew she wasn't gonna be able to feel good through school without having the Stuffy. That's where I had to decide. Okay. I need to go and do this for her because we're working on this and with her anxiety, and that's Something that's gonna be important.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:08]:
    You know, that just kinda shows I mean, there is a point in time where you do have to decide. And like you said about, the There's things like this where you have to make a decision. Is this a learning moment moment, or do you actually the Come back in, and we'll say save the day to bail your child out of something that they probably should have told you up upfront the and told you about. But there's going to be those times where is 3rd grade the time to do that, or is it more 6th the Great. Well, you know what? You need to learn about this, and you need to be able to. So those are things internally that you have to struggle with and figure out as you along. And there is that learning that happens as your kids get older, and you're going to learn so many things. And I think that that's important.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:53]:
    I think it's so important that you're willing to the Open yourself up to learning and being willing to know that you don't know everything and be willing to the Reach out or find resources. As you think about the experiences that you've had as a father, how has that resonated with you that you've had to take that step the to be willing to learn.

    Tim Cox [00:19:15]:
    It was tough and easy at the beginning. Easy because I knew I had to learn, but tough because I've always kind of felt the Proud I was able to do things on my own or figure things out on my own. And every day is just I'm learning something new every day, and especially with having the 2 children who are very different people. My daughter is gets anxiety and she's s. Nervous about things, and she's very lovey and gets hurt constantly whether it's really hurt or not hurt or just wants an ice the hack that happens where my son is completely wild and is not one that gets hurt and is just the Runs around the house like a tornado, and you have to learn how to navigate this journey with 2 very different Children. And what I do for her may not be the same thing that I would do for him, and it's not necessarily a learning point the For either of the kids, but just knowing how they will handle it. Like, he had stuffy day to stay at school too. He has a stuffy at the School.

    Tim Cox [00:20:21]:
    He's in preschool. He has a stuffy there for nap. And I don't know if kids were bringing other ones or not, but I was like, you know what? Let's just . Not send him with 1 because then it's 1 less that needs to be washed, and we think he'll be fine with it. So I think the biggest thing is just the Knowing that you don't know everything and that it's okay to make mistakes. I make mistakes all the time. And there's the Times I wish I could go back and change what I said or what I did, and I let frustrations get out sometimes. And that this past

    Tim Cox [00:20:53]:
    Year I've tried to take a better look at my own mental health, and I finally talked about depression to my doctors. I Doc. Got on some medication and all these kind of things are taking care of myself to know That I can make myself become a better father. And when I mess up, that, you know, it's not the end of the world, that . I just need to own up to it, and that's also being honest with my kids where sometimes I'll say, like, hey. I wish I didn't say that, or, hey. I wish I the I was able to do this with you. I'm just being honest with them is extremely important to to my own growth.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:31]:
    Well, talking about mental health, and I know that you said that the You kind of have focused a bit more on your mental health. Why did you decide that that this was the right time to do that, and what did you hope to do with the The journey that you started.

    Tim Cox [00:21:45]:
    I think it was one of those things where I mean, it certainly got worse over the pandemic. I don't remember and and And also that is we had our son right at the beginning of the pandemic to where that was a whole different thing. You know, they I Doc. I was almost not gonna be allowed to go to the hospital, which I wrote a chapter in the 1st Fathering Together book about that issue. But one of those thing, it kind of, like, creeped up on me more,

    Tim Cox [00:22:10]:
    and then I decided, like you know, I started feeling like I wasn't myself at all times. Doc. And sometimes I would be just sitting there washing the dishes at night, and I'd start feeling like I'm a failure. Like, I can't even explain the things I was feeling. And then finally, like, I was going to the doctor and I, you know, had my regular physical, and I was just like, this is kinda going on. I don't feel Doc. Suicidal or anything like that, but I do feel depressed and down and to the point where I didn't feel like I would do anything to myself, But I didn't necessarily care if something happened to me.

    Tim Cox [00:22:46]:
    And other than you were, like, you want to make sure you're there for your kids, but There came point where I was like, there's stuff going on that I'm just kinda moving through life, and it's just stressful. And and it was it was a huge Docs changed by having that talk with the doctor, being honest with myself that this was something that I should bring up, and now Still working on it and still have those days where you just feel exhausted or worn out. The kids are fighting, and you are just like, I can't even Do anything with us anymore. I just need to, like, go lay down or something. But it's happening far less because I feel like I've finally taking a step in the right direction.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:25]:
    Now taking that step in the right direction, you also are showing your kids Something about taking care of yourself. What kind of conversations have you had, especially with your daughter, about the Some of the things that you I know that you said that she has struggled with and how what you're doing, and Doc. It may impact her in many ways in the future.

    Tim Cox [00:23:48]:
    I don't think she knows about depression or anything like that yet. She has anxiety, . But we have tried to show her that, like, it's totally normal. A lot of kids have it. A lot of kids go to therapists the for this. And she's it's okay to have big feelings, basically, and not understand how to fully grasp the what you're feeling and talk about what you're feeling. And so I think we just this year, all this started this year of us making this decision to the have her start going to therapy every week, and it was just one of those things where we know that if we have the opportunity to look at this the at this young age and be able to do something about it instead of waiting until it's older. And part of the thing with that may have been that I the understanding that, like, I what I was going through.

    Tim Cox [00:24:39]:
    My partner understands what she's going through, and those kind of things that were like, you know what? Like, the Let's find a way to help our daughter learn to deal with these feelings before that becomes something.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:52]:
    . That's so important, and it's important to be willing to put yourself out there and be willing to understand when you need help. And I don't know that every man is willing to admit that, and instead, they internally kind of say, Nah. I can handle it myself. I don't think that I need help. I I can man up and push through it. And that sometimes comes with fatherhood too, the Dad, there is a lot of dads that kind of are like, I don't need help. I can figure this out.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:23]:
    I don't need to ask for help. I've always said that You've got a community of people that have been fathers that are all around you, and there's no reason why you can't go the to your neighbor, to a friend, and be very open and honest with them and say, you know what? I'm struggling with this. And have you ever dealt with this? Or . If you did, how did you deal with this? Because I'm having a lot of problems, but that's not easy. And it's definitely not something that is the Innately put into the personalities of most men that you're willing to be vulnerable in that way. So I commend you for taking that step for yourself, for your family, and being willing to put yourself first the In some ways, to be able to also put your family first because you knew that you had to focus on yourself to be able to be the dad that you wanted to be the and the husband that you wanted to be. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five, where we ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Tim Cox [00:26:28]:
    I am ready.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:29]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Tim Cox [00:26:31]:
    I'm gonna follow what we've been talking about, and I'm gonna say learning.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:37]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Tim Cox [00:26:42]:
    I think that there's different times where You feel that way, but just hearing some of the sweet things that she does where if she sees a the kid not playing with anybody. She's the one to go up to that kid and say, hey. Do you wanna play with us? And, like, you know, that's where I remember there was something like that, and my Doug. Wife and I, like, we looked at each other, and we were like, yes. We did this. Like, we succeeded here because she cared more about someone else the who wasn't involved in something, and I think I wanna say she was in kindergarten or 1st grade when that happened. And it felt really good to know that the She is a caring person, and we're teaching her the right way.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:24]:
    If I were to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Tim Cox [00:27:27]:
    I believe they would probably the Talk about me being funny. That was one of the pages in her book that she wrote about me because I try and, you know, make them laugh. I'm goofy. I try and be as the fun of a dad as I possibly can.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:41]:
    Who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Tim Cox [00:27:43]:
    I think that's my father. He has done so much for me. Me. He's my stepfather, but he's my father in my mind. He's been in my life since I could talk, since I you know, they've been married since I was 5. The And he's such a great dad, and he's such a great papa to the kids that an inspiration for me to the Try and strive to be like that and also while being my own person at the same time. For example, the other day, my daughter, she has the spray paint chalk, and she asked if she could spray paint a couple, like, rows of bricks on our house by the garage. And knowing it's chalk, knowing it's gonna come off, I was like, I the I don't know if my dad would've let me do this, but what does it matter? Yeah. Go for it. And we now have some pink bricks on Firehouse by the garage. And it's not to say, like, he let me do a lot of the Fun Things. But those are the kind of things where I'm just like, you know what? It's not gonna hurt anything, and I'm just going to do it. So I try and also take the What I've learned from him and then add my own goofy touch to it, which he's also a very funny person too, which is probably where I get it from. But I think that's kind of where I get my inspiration.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:50]:
    Now you've given a lot of piece of advice, things that you've learned along the way with your own the Kids. As we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice you'd want to give to every dad?

    Tim Cox [00:28:59]:
    I think the biggest advice is we're all human. We all make mistakes. No one's perfect. A lot of times on social media, people put out the most perfect version of themselves, and you have to realize that We're all in this together, and that's kind of where I think being involved with fathering together and all the the Dads that I became friends with from the dads with daughters groups and everything, I've really learned, hey. We're all doing this together. Doug. We're all learning, and you have to always be open to becoming a better version of yourself even when you think you're the perfect version of yourself.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:38]:
    Well, Tim, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing your own journey, and for being vulnerable with us and the Sharing some of the highs, the lows, and everything in between of the things that you've experienced with your daughter, and I wish you all the best.

    Tim Cox [00:29:53]:
    Thank you so much. It's very exciting to be on this, and I really appreciate you asking.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:57]:
    The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information the that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, the and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together .org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with Daughters is a program of Fathering Together.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:39]:
    We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared Doc. To helping you raise strong, empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:49]:
    We're all in the same boat, Don. And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the the We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy s. Presents. Bring your AK because those the Kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, the Donnie. Be the best dad you can be!

  • Parenting with Grace: Dan Rose's Approach to Raising Daughters

    Parenting with Grace: Dan Rose's Approach to Raising Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    In a special episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, guest Daniel M. Rose joins host Christopher Lewis for a heartfelt conversation about the beautiful and sometimes challenging journey of fatherhood. As fathers to daughters, they share their wisdom and personal experiences, offering valuable insights on building strong, independent relationships with their children. This episode is a reminder that fatherhood is an ongoing journey of growth, grace, and understanding.

    The Initial Fear and Ongoing Love:

    Dan Rose vulnerably shares his initial fears and uncertainties when he found out he would be a father to a daughter. Like many fathers, he worried about being overprotective or not doing a good enough job in raising his daughter. This honest admission resonates with many dads, highlighting the common fear of not being able to provide and protect our children adequately. However, as Dan and Dr. Lewis attest, this fear is often replaced by a love that grows and evolves throughout the different stages of a daughter's life.

    The Unique Bond and Shared Activities:

    As the conversation unfolds, Dan Rose emphasizes the special bond and shared activities between him and his daughter. It's heartwarming to hear how, despite initial differences, they found common ground through shared interests in pop culture and TV shows, particularly during the challenging time of the lockdown in March 2020. This emphasizes the importance of staying open-minded, adaptable, and finding ways to connect with our children, especially during difficult circumstances.

    Teaching Gratitude and Building Foundation:

    A significant takeaway from this conversation is the importance of teaching gratitude and being thankful for what children have from a young age. Dan acknowledges that building a foundation of gratitude in childhood allows for more freedom and less overreaction in parenting during middle and high school years. This essential parenting aspect reminds us of the significant impact that instilling values of appreciation and mindfulness can have on a daughter's development.

    Responding with Grace and Vulnerability:

    Dan's emphasis on responding to his children with grace, understanding, and vulnerability rather than judgment or discipline, is a vital aspect of nurturing strong father-daughter relationships. This echo from Dr. Christopher Lewis aligns with the podcast's focus on embracing grace and vulnerability in fatherhood. It's a reminder that by being open, empathetic, and willing to embrace our vulnerabilities as fathers, we can foster trust, openness, and resilience in our daughters.

    Initiating Honest Conversations and Building Trust:

    The importance of treating daughters with respect and initiating honest conversations to strengthen the relationship cannot be understated. Dan encourages fathers to respond with love, listen, and learn from their daughters, fostering a relationship built on trust, respect, and understanding. This highlights the significance of creating an environment where daughters feel heard, valued, and supported. Moreover, it emphasizes the role of fathers in providing a safe space for open, honest conversations with their daughters. Conclusion: In this deeply insightful and emotionally resonant episode, '

    Dan Rose and Dr. Christopher Lewis remind us that fatherhood is a journey of grace, gratitude, and vulnerability. By embracing these qualities and nurturing open, loving relationships with our daughters, we can empower them to grow into strong, resilient individuals. This episode serves as a powerful testament to the enduring bond between fathers and daughters, and the profound impact of intentional, empathetic parenting.

    In this episode, Dan Rose's vulnerability and Dr. Christopher Lewis's thoughtful insights offer an invaluable roadmap to fathers everywhere on the profound and transformative journey of raising daughters. Through these conversations, we can glean wisdom and solidarity that enriches our own journeys as fathers.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. The Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down with you and talk with you about the journey that you're on and really the Go on this journey with you because as you know, I've got 2 daughters myself, and you never stop parenting. You never stop being a father, the And you're gonna continue to learn because the different phases of life that your kids are in are gonna push you in many different ways, ways that you the Right now are probably not even expecting, or if you are older and have kids that are older, you may be looking back and saying, oh, I wish I would have known. The And you could give some good advice too. But I love being able to to sit down, talk to you, have you listen every week because Doug. It is a journey, and it is something that we all can work on to become better at, to just like anything that we do. And by being able to listen to others, to learn from others, and be open to being vulnerable in many different ways and being open to learning and trying new things, you will be able to be that engaged dad that you wanna be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:37]:
    This week, we got another great guest with us today. Dan Rose is with us, and Dan is a father of 2. He's got both a son and a daughter. We're gonna be talking about his Dog. His experience as a dad of daughters. He is a pastor of a network of house churches and works to Bring his ministry all over Southeast Michigan and works with a number of different communities as well. Dog. So I'm really excited to have him here.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:04]:
    I've known him for many years, and I'm really excited to be able to talk with him today. Dan, thanks so much for being here today.

    Dan Rose [00:02:10]:
    I am glad to be here, man.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:12]:
    I'm excited to have you here as well. And one of the first things that I always do and love to do is turn the Doc. Back in time. And you've got 2 kids now that are grown and flown. They are older now and out of the house and doing their next the The thing is they are preparing for their journey into adulthood. When you think back to the very beginning and you go back to that first moment, that first moment when you found out that you were going to be a the Father to a daughter.

    Dan Rose [00:02:39]:
    What was going through your head? Abject fear. That was was the first thing. To be our son was born first, and I grew up with the 2 younger brothers, and so figuring out how to be a dad to a son seemed pretty straightforward. And, when we found out we were having a daughter, That was scary. And and yet it was also kind of the sense of just what an honor That it was gonna be to raise a daughter and thinking about what it would mean to be a daddy as opposed to just a dad. And Shortly after Libby was born, Amy was working with college. Amy, my wife, was working with with college students, and She wanted me to to write a little thing for these girls in her bible study about what does it mean to raise a daughter, to be a girl dad, which wasn't a phrase at the time. So for me, it was the this this idea of of being a daddy and being being someone who would be able to take strength and the Give it to my daughter so that as she moved out in this world, that she would be as strong as my son and be able to hold her own because, boy, this world is it's just hard, and it's particularly hard, I think, for women.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:49]:
    Now you kind of touched on this just a little bit, but you also said that When you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter, you were scared, there was fear. What would you say was or is your biggest fear in raising a daughter?

    Dan Rose [00:04:01]:
    I think one of my biggest Fears was being too protective, was overprotecting her, making her dependent on me in such a way that She felt like she was gonna have to go through this world needing a man or something along those lines. But then kind of the the the alternative of doing such a a the Poor job that she would not like men at all or that she would be not trusting of men or would fear men or would just have some sort of the Irrational relationship towards men. So kind of a double edged sword there on the fear thing. Too much and too little. Trying to figure out how do you stand on that razor's edge.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:41]:
    The Now as I said, your daughter now is older, and she has gone off to college and doing some different things. The And I guess as she went through those phases in her own development, as you went through those phases the Throughout her development and you think back to the fear that you said that you did have, how does that look different now that she left the house and gone to that next the phase of her life.

    Dan Rose [00:05:08]:
    Yeah. So she just finished her 3rd semester at Michigan State. And so for anyone that's not living under a rock, Last year, they at Michigan State had a campus shooter and knew people who were shot and killed, and her friends knew people. It was one of those things you never think you'd experience. And so now that and there was no way to protect her because she was an hour and 20 minutes from my house. I couldn't go rescue her. And Watching her handle a situation that none of us know how we're going to respond and watching her face that with courage, with a strength that I don't know if I would have. And then to see her move forward from that situation as the semester continued on and Dog.

    Dan Rose [00:05:55]:
    As she is continuing to grow, to see her just continue to press on with a tenacity and a strength that comes from a the Deep, deep place. And so as we walked through that whole thing with her last year, it became very clear that she was ready to take this world. And she was strong and resilient and has everything you need to succeed. So it has been fun. It's really been fun to see her to see her just Thrive now in light of of everything that's been going on.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:25]:
    It's so exciting to hear that. And, you know, I went through a similar thing this fall the When there was a shooter on the campus where my daughter is a freshman, and luckily, she did not know the 1 person that was the Shot and killed, but it still impacts, and you have to deal with that. And for us, you know, she's over 11 hours away. So as you said, you can't rescue. I definitely could not easily rescue, and she didn't need the rescuing either. She dealt with it in her own way and the Showed her resilience in that way, and I think all the students did. And but it's hard. It's hard to take that step back, the Take that and and know that they're on their own, and you wanna just hold them and be there for them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:14]:
    And I think the The only thing that we could do at the time was make sure she knew that and make sure that she knew that we were there for her and the Go from there and support her in any way that we could. Now one of the things that I am kind of interested in is that, you know, you have 2 children that are different. They're different ages. They have different interests. They're doing different things, and you build those unique bonds the With your children to be able to be engaged with them in many different ways. What is the favorite thing that you and your daughter like the or do that you share together.

    Dan Rose [00:07:51]:
    We struggled for a minute. When she was younger, we didn't have a lot of things in common. She is a girly girl, And one of my favorite stories about her is we were helping my mom was a teacher, and we were helping her do the annual move into your classroom bit. And so we're carrying things up the To the classroom, and Libby is taking a stuffed animal, a singular book. My mom says to her she was probably the 4 at the time. And so my mom says, Libby, you can carry more than that. Libby put her hands on her hips, and she said, mom, These arms are made for strapless dresses, not for carrying things. So it's like, okay.

    Dan Rose [00:08:30]:
    She did the dance thing. She she lived in a world that I did not understand at all, and quite honestly, a world that my wife didn't understand either. And so So fast forward to March 2020, and the whole world shuts down. And it was It was transformational in our in our relationship. She was a sophomore in high school, and then her and I all of a sudden Started spending every day together, all the time together, and we have discovered that we enjoy the same Similar TV shows. We enjoy a lot of the kind kind of pop culture stuff. So her and I, like, we bond over pop the culture and over kinda knowing who's who out in the Hollywood world and that kind of thing. And, you know, my wife and my son are just the clueless about it.

    Dan Rose [00:09:21]:
    They're like they have no idea what's going on. So Libby and I have these inside jokes. We can just and we laugh at Ethan and Amy all the time. The And, and so are there are few people in this world that I enjoy bantering with more than than my daughter. And her sense of comedic timing is just perfect. The She might be the funniest person that I know. And so, honestly, it's just spending quantity time with her because the more time We spend the more the conversation spirals and gets hilarious and and things just get more fun in every single conversation.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:56]:
    The I love that. And you probably know way more than I do when it comes to some of the pop culture stuff.

    Dan Rose [00:10:02]:
    I have to.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:02]:
    Well and that's just it is that I think that as a father, you the have to be willing to have some grace and know that you that your kids are not gonna always like the The things that you like, they're not going always going to do the same things that you're going to do. You're gonna connect with your kids in different ways. And the I know that you and I were talking before we started about the importance of grace. And when when I know that when you talk about Grace in parenting. It's not the same as grace in religion. So why don't you give me a definition? When you're talking about grace in parenting, why the Has Grace been so important for you as a parent? But first, let's define it, and then talk to me about how you have Incorporated that into the raising of your kids.

    Dan Rose [00:10:51]:
    It's funny. If we were having this conversation 10 years ago, 15 years ago, my answer to What is the definition of grace and parenting would be different than it is now? Now, really, once we kinda hit the middle school years Doubt. Was when this definition changed and kinda locked in for me. I would define grace in parenting as maintaining access, the Doing what is necessary to maintain access because it's it's at that time when they're 11, 12, 13 when they're pushing boundaries, when they're they're testing. They're trying to figure out, okay. We've had these rules as as little kids, and now we're we're not quite adults. Everything in their world is changing. Their friends are changing.

    Dan Rose [00:11:32]:
    Their bodies are changing. Their emotions are changing. Everything. Dog. And so now they start pushing and testing, and they're and they're separating themselves from us as mom and dad, which is healthy and good. And I see so Doug. Many folks during that time lose access to their kids because their kids break a rule or are disobedient or you know, they no longer are just trying to make mom and dad happy. They're trying to figure out what does their world look like the And how are they going to move through this world? And and so all of a sudden now, it's, I had to ground little Sally Bell.

    Dan Rose [00:12:11]:
    For 2 weeks, wouldn't let her see her friends for 2 weeks, took her phone away, all of these things. And so if someone was treating me like that, what am I gonna do? I'm not gonna give them the anymore. I'm gonna shut them out. And so when they got into that middle school, man, it became all about how do I how do we as mom and dad maintain our So that when when those important conversations need to be had, when those hard relationship things that are going on in middle school and high school the are happening that they're coming to talk to us and not going to another 12 year old or a 13 year old with all of their vast wisdom.

    Dan Rose [00:12:50]:
    I know. 12 13 year olds have all the answers and know all the things, but maybe maybe we know a little bit more. And so and so we wanted to do everything we could the to maintain access. Now how did that look? Oftentimes, that looked like us making a mistake and then the Apologizing to them for that mistake when we overreacted. It was very rarely that we underreacted. We pretty much always overreacted as parents. And so when we realized that we had overreacted, we would the Come in and apologize. And we would own our mistake as a as a parent in our overreaction, and we didn't do so in a way that the Still spun it back on them. Like, we left because, sure, our overreaction was probably almost always because they didn't do something right, but it still didn't Require the overreaction that we gave.

    Dan Rose [00:13:41]:
    And so when we would go in and and apologize and ask forgiveness for overreaction, we wouldn't tie it to their behavior at all. Dog. We owned our own behavior and simply asked for forgiveness of our own behavior in the way that we would want other people to come to us. We began to treat them as more and more as equals. And so now as a result, we have our son is the He's 22. Libby's 20, and our family chats and our texts are they're brutally honest and brutally open, and they hide nothing from us. They've never hidden. As far as we know, there's just there's not a lot that they hide from us.

    Dan Rose [00:14:19]:
    And I think about all of the things that we hid from our parents. Our kids haven't seemed to do that, and I think it's because we really sought to do whatever it took to maintain access in their lives. So we defaulted a lot to yes. Can I go to so and so's house to spend yes? Can so and so come to our house and spend the night? Yes. We didn't use grounding as a punishment, and we didn't use taking away their ability to the Connect with others as a form of punishment because we thought that is just critical to our lives as people. We tried to dive in and figure out doc. In those situations, what what was really going on? And a lot of that was grounded when they were 4, 5, 6, 7 years old. And so By the time they got to be 13, 14, 15, those lessons had been learned.

    Dan Rose [00:15:03]:
    And so, like, for instance, I think both our kids have had situations where they wanted a particular the thing. Right? Some toy. And we didn't have a lot of money when they were younger, and so we it would cost us to get them this particular toy or this the that they wanted, and then they would respond in the way that 3, 4, 5, 6 year olds would often respond to not having a lot of gratitude. And so instead of Losing our stuff, we would just take that toy back, put it up on the shelf, and say, hey. When you're grateful for this thing that you have, you can have it back. And it would take some time, but they learned that. Right? It was that deeper issue. It wasn't that they're necessarily being disobedient.

    Dan Rose [00:15:40]:
    They needed to learn gratitude. They needed to learn To be thankful for the things that they have. And so that one little lesson then translated out to when they were in middle school and high school, no And we didn't we didn't seem to have those same kinds of a lot of issues where we had to overreact or overparent too much because of things that have Things we had learned in the past allowed us to really be gracious in middle school and high school. So there was kind of this process of building a foundation when they're younger, Which then allowed us to to grant a lot of freedom when they were when they were older.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:11]:
    I love hearing that, and I think that every person needs to hear the that, especially if you're a young dad and you can start making those changes now. Now if a father has not been doing that, And they've got kids that are coming into their teenage years, and they have defaulted to no. And they have not the Built that relationship that has been conducive for access to their kids, and their kids may be hiding things or or other Things that you've been able to avoid. Are there things that you would recommend to dads that the See that in themselves, see that in the relationship that they have with their own kids that they could start to make intentional changes that would help Doc. To build a stronger relationship with their kids in the long run?

    Dan Rose [00:17:04]:
    I think the first step would be to identify how the How would I want somebody to open that conversation with me? If there's somebody in my life who has kinda defaulted to know or doesn't trust me or doesn't hasn't dealt graciously with me and they've Dog. They want to change how they relate to me. How do I want them to approach that subject? What would it take for somebody to change that the in relationship to me. And then turn that around and say, okay. Well, I guess this is how I need to begin to move towards move towards my daughter is the I'm gonna start because I guess it's as fundamental as this. I'm gonna start treating her the way that I wanna be treated and taking some intentional time To go out, grab a grab a mocha frappuccino or a, you know, whatever the latest TikTok Starbucks fancy drink is, And going and sitting down and having an honest conversation, you would just be shocked at how our kids will respond to honest, open, Real talk. To sit down and say, I know this is kinda the way it's been. I don't like the way that I've been doing things.

    Dan Rose [00:18:02]:
    I'm Trying to figure this parenting thing out too. And I need us to talk through some of this stuff. How can I be better? How can we then move together as a dad and a daughter towards the More openness towards more honesty. You will be shocked, but then the kicker is you gotta back it up. When She comes home and tells you a story, and it makes you uncomfortable because she's doing something that you did in high school or that you did in middle school That you're like, my kid's never gonna do that. And yet here she is doing that. You get to decide how are you gonna respond. Are you gonna respond in judgment? Are you gonna respond with discipline, or are you gonna respond by saying by listening and by extending grace the And by thinking about your response to it and just slowing down a minute and saying, alright, how am I gonna respond when she tells me this thing that I don't wanna hear? And and kinda having a plan in your head of maybe it's something like or you say, oh, thanks for sharing that with me.

    Dan Rose [00:18:58]:
    Doug. I appreciate you you opening up. Right? And and then that's it. And and then maybe you look for other opportunities Doc. To have conversations about that in a way that's not gonna be a judgmental thing, a way that's not gonna slam the door on that access. Because if if they come and they bring something to us and and we immediately slam the door on them, that access is gonna get shut down real quick again. Doc. Couple of the phrases, especially now that my kids are older, that I'm learning to say, that I've been intentional about trying to say is, the How can I help you? How can I help you? Or do you want my advice, or do you just want me to listen? And now the door's open to them.

    Dan Rose [00:19:37]:
    Now they're giving me the insight, the And all of a sudden, I look like a superhero because I'm just doing the very thing that they want me to do, and I don't have to figure it out. So those things work I think doc. Can work well even even, you know, middle school and high school with kids in that age that, again, opening seeking to open the door and giving them some room doc To direct it a little bit so that it's a give and take relationship. It's a both and. We have to make that shift from one up, one down relationships to relationships of mutuality with our with our daughters, and that's hard. It's it's it's really, really hard.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:08]:
    It is hard. It it is definitely not something that is always the something that you would innately think that you would do. And I think it is a mind shift and something that you have to be willing the To, as I said at the very beginning, be vulnerable. And sometimes with men, let's be honest, that word is a triggering word.

    Dan Rose [00:20:30]:
    That's right. My palm started sweating just as you said that v word.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:32]:
    And it it's not a bad thing, though. Be vulnerable, being willing to the Say I don't know or be willing to just sit and be in the moment and explaining Where you're at is important, and it shows a human side to you that, especially as your kids young, they don't always see. Every child seem for the most part, every child tends to see their parent as a hero, as the person that they the Just love innately. And as long as you love them back, you're gonna continue to have that love. But then there is gonna be that point that, Dan, you just talked about that your kids start pushing back. And That grace is so important that you are willing to be in the moment, be there, be the Open, honest, and real with them. I can't say that I'm I've always been the best example of that. I try my best, And I try to admit when I'm failing as well, and I could do better.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:44]:
    And I'll be honest about that, but I think that the All of us can be better, and it's so easy to try and solve their problems. It's the So easy to get back in jump right back into that mindset of I'm gonna come and rescue you. And Especially for our daughters, for the most part, that's not always what they want. And asking the question, Dan, that you said of do you just need me to listen is important because so often the the women that are in our lives, whether it be our daughters, Our spouses, friends, men tend to try to solve. They try they jump in and they Don't always listen very well, but you're gonna come out ahead so much further ahead if you're willing to the Shut your mouth and just listen and then respond. Again, I'm not always the best at that. My spouse would tell you that From day 1 that I'm not always the best at that, but I do try. And I fail, and I try again.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:54]:
    And I the fail and I try again, and that's what you have to do when you are a parent as well. We definitely have to keep being teachable and the And learning and growing, and that's what this podcast is all about is being willing to be vulnerable, being willing to know that you don't know everything, the There's not one right way to parent. There's not one right way to father, and there's not one the playbook that you can pick up and say, this is the this is what I have to do. Because as you just heard, the way that Dan Fathers is different than the way that I father is different than the way that you father. And and that's okay, but we can take pieces the of what each of us do and learn from each other. You can build a relationship with that dad next door the And start to listen and learn from what they're doing and say, I like that. Don't really like that, but pick the things that you do like And start incorporating them. Try some new things just like Dan was talking about.

    Dan Rose [00:23:56]:
    Tell you what, man. I think one of the ways I learned some of this grace thing was in conversation with my father-in-law the raised 4 daughters. After his 3rd daughter was born, he went to the bar. So we were talking as my kids were probably late elementary school, and the He's from Southern Indiana, and he says, Diane, let me tell you something. And we sat and talked about parenting. And one of the things he said was You gotta give them enough rope when they're in middle school and high school to just about hang themselves, but not so much that you can't pull them back. Doc. And he's like, you want them to learn the lessons when they're still under your roof, when you can still put your arm around them, when you can still pick them up when they fall.

    Dan Rose [00:24:40]:
    And that was some of the best parenting advice that I've ever received because it opened up so much freedom. Like, I no longer Had to be a perfect dad, and my kids didn't have to look perfect. They could go and make mistakes, And then I could pick them up, and we can brush them off, and we can help them figure it out so much better that they the Figure out and make their mistakes when they're in junior high and high school than when they're in college 11 hours away or 2 hours away Because it's a lot harder to pick them up and brush them off when they're out there. And when you're over 18, your mistakes are they're way more costly. So when you make mistakes, when you're 13, 14, 15, and you got somebody there who can help pick you up and brush you off, It's just it's just such a such a better way. And that bit of advice from my father-in-law was was huge for those very reasons.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:37]:
    Now, Dan, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five where we delve a little bit deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Dan Rose [00:25:44]:
    I'm ready.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:45]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Dan Rose [00:25:46]:
    Joy.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:47]:
    When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Dan Rose [00:25:52]:
    When She put a professor in his place this semester at Michigan State.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:57]:
    You gotta tell me more about that one.

    Dan Rose [00:25:59]:
    To me, this is like, Doc. She's gonna be just fine. She's a public relations major. And because that's, you know, kinda more on the business side of things, everything That they do is group work, it seems like. And so Libby wants to get good grades. Libby is very conscious about wanting to the Just wanting to be successful and succeed. And so she kinda took this 1st group project all on her own, and she's like, you guys aren't getting it done. The I'm gonna get this thing done.

    Dan Rose [00:26:29]:
    So she rocks out this group project with minimal help from her group, turns it in, gets the grade back, and they only got an 80. And she was mad. So she flips to the back, looks at the comments. And in the comments, the professor writes, you missed, the Like, 5 different things in your group assignment that you just didn't do. And so she marched up there after class and walked him through and showed him where All 5 of those things were at in the paper and said they're here, here, here, and here, so fix it. And he scratched out the 80 and gave him a 90. And I was like, this girl, she don't need me anymore. She just put this dude in his place, and she advocates for self. She takes no crap from anybody. And so that I was like, alright. We hit a home run. She's on her way.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:18]:
    I love that. Now If I was to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Dan Rose [00:27:22]:
    Well, I hope they would describe me as loving, as the Herring as somebody who always has their back no matter what. We told both of them. Dog. I've told both of them numerous times when they're getting ready, especially they're getting ready to walk into a hard situation. You got this. You can do this, but just know that I'm the cavalry. If you need me, I've got your back. And so I I hope that's how they would describe me. I think that's how they would.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:52]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Dan Rose [00:27:54]:
    I think my father-in-law. I really my father-in-law, I think, is he he's not perfect. The Talk to my mother-in-law for 5 minutes, and you'll find out that my father-in-law is not perfect. But we just celebrated his 80th birthday and listening. And one of the things that we did was Dog. All of his grandkids spoke about the impact he's had on their lives. All 4 of his daughters spoke about the impact the that he's had on their lives. And, man, if my kids and my grandkids will speak of me the way that they spoke of the of my father-in-law.

    Dan Rose [00:28:25]:
    And I know from talking to my brothers in laws, the way that we've the 4 of us feel about him. That's dad goals in a big, big way. In so many ways, when I grow up, I wanna be my father-in-law. Again, not perfect, but, boy, he loves fiercely and really and he embodies what a I think what a good dad really looks like.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:43]:
    Now you've given a lot of piece of advice today. As we finish up, what's 1 piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Dan Rose [00:28:47]:
    If you're gonna on the side of love. The So often, once the door is closed, once the relationship is broken, it is so hard to get it back. So if you're gonna make an error, error by loving too much, by granting too much grace. If we on the side of love, the odds are we're gonna get it right more times than not. I tell the people I pastor, Tell my kids. Tell anybody that listens. I don't think we're gonna stand before god or the divine or whatever at the end of our lives, and and they're gonna say, you know what? You love too much. Dog.

    Dan Rose [00:29:18]:
    You just loved too much. That is never gonna be our problem. So if I'm gonna if I'm gonna make a mistake, if you as a dad are gonna or make a mistake, make it on the side of love. Making on the side of loving them too deeply, too much, with too much love. That's the error. If that's the thing that at the end, you know, my kids are sitting in counseling and because dog. They're gonna everybody's gonna need it. So when they're sitting there, they're like, you know, my dad just loved it too much.

    Dan Rose [00:29:42]:
    I'll take it. He didn't have enough rules. I'll take it. That's my piece of advice to every parent. It's just air on the side of love.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:48]:
    Well, I appreciate you sharing that, Dan, and I appreciate your time today. Now if people wanna find out more about you the And what you're doing, is there a great place for them to go?

    Dan Rose [00:29:57]:
    Yeah. So I try to write pretty regularly, and they can see my longest the form stuff at danielmrose.com. And then I write some shorter things that are only about 250, the 300 words, and I do that mostly daily ish at the kjd.net, the knee jerk devotional.net. So those are 2 places, but they can find me on just about any social network known to mankind. My username everywhere is Daniel m Rose, All one word. So Twitter/X at DanielmRose, Facebook at Daniel M. Rose, Mastodon, which is where I live most of my days now because It's nice. So is that Daniel M. Rose at writing.exchange, Instagram at Daniel M. Rose. You can find me at Daniel M. Rose. When in doubt at Daniel M. Rose. So

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:47]:
    And we'll put links in the notes today. Dan, thanks so much for joining us today for sharing your journey in being a father, and I wish you all the best.

    Dan Rose [00:30:57]:
    Hey. Thanks, Christopher. It was good chatting.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:58]:
    The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. The We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information the that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, the and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fatheringtogether.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Daughters is a program of fathering together.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:41]:
    We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters the And be the best dad that you can be.

    We're all in the same boat, the And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. The Dogs. Presents. Bring your a k, because kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast, calling astronauts and firemen, the Donker. Be the best the dad you can be!

  • Building Positivity: A Dad's Journey to Mentorship and Fitness

    Building Positivity: A Dad's Journey to Mentorship and Fitness

    · Dads With Daughters

    In a heartfelt and candid episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, Dr. Christopher Lewis engages in an inspiring conversation with Joe Martin, the owner of Relentless Positivity Fitness and a dedicated father. As Joe reflects on his journey as both a father and a mentor to middle school-aged children, he emphasizes the importance of perseverance, positivity, and building strong relationships. The discussion delves into Joe's personal struggles, triumphs, and the profound impact of leading by example in fatherhood and fitness.

    Mentoring and Building Relationships:

    Joe Martin sheds light on the pivotal role of mentoring, particularly with middle school-aged children, recognizing this age group's vulnerability and potential. He stresses the significance of trusted resources outside the home, like a coach, in connecting with kids and fostering meaningful relationships. Joe's emphasis on building relationships with children through shared activities and finding common ground underscores the powerful impact of positive mentorship.

    Fitness and Overcoming Challenges:

    As the owner of Relentless Positivity Fitness, Joe Martin's passion for fitness emanates from his experiences as an athlete, where he battled weight gain and injury during his football career. Through his own fitness journey, Joe not only overcame adversity but also redefined his identity. His journey serves as a testament to the transformative power of perseverance and the impact of modeling a healthy lifestyle for children.

    Personal Transformation and Resilience:

    Joe Martin's openness about his past struggles, including arrests and incarceration, offers a poignant insight into his journey of redemption and personal transformation. His determination to change his lifestyle, while initially centered on weight loss, ultimately led to a holistic transformation, reinforcing the importance of resilience in overcoming adversity.

    Parenting and Fatherhood:

    The conversation pivots to the challenges and triumphs of fatherhood, with Joe Martin eloquently articulating the emotional journey of watching his son embark on a new chapter at the Air Force Academy. Through his vulnerability, Joe emphasizes the importance of allowing children to fail, sharing personal struggles, and prioritizing one's spouse in parenting. His candid reflections resonated with Dr. Christopher Lewis and emphasized the depth of emotional investment inherent in fatherhood.

    The Power of Positivity and Community:

    Joe Martin's dedication to spreading positivity is not confined to fitness but permeates his podcast and book, both titled "Relentless Positivity." During the conversation, the significance of countering negativity with uplifting narratives and inspiring stories becomes evident. His book, combining personal experiences with lessons on fitness and back pain management, emphasizes flexibility and inspiration over rigid approaches—underscoring the value of a positive mindset.

    Fatherhood Insider and Community Engagement:

    Dr. Christopher Lewis invites dads to join the Fatherhood Insider, a valuable resource, and encourages involvement in the Dads with Daughters Facebook community. This proactive approach seeks to foster a supportive environment where fathers can learn from each other's experiences, gaining insights and strengthening their roles as active participants in their daughters' lives.

    The engaging conversation with Joe Martin encompasses the profound impact of mentorship, fitness, and positive parenting. His journey from adversity to resilience, coupled with his unwavering dedication to fatherhood and positivity, serves as an inspiring example to all. By amplifying the importance of building strong relationships, personal transformation, and embracing a mindset of relentless positivity, Joe Martin's narrative resonates deeply with the mission of "Dads with Daughters" in promoting and empowering positive father-daughter relationships.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the dads with daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent Women. Really excited to have you back again this week. As always, every week, you and I are on a journey together. You know, I've got 2 daughters. You've Got Daughters. We're on this fatherhood journey together, and we're doing the things that we can do to be able to be the best dads that we wanna be. And the That comes with work, that comes with some hard work, that comes through the days, the weeks, the months, the years that the You go side by side with your children to be able to help them to be the people that you're hoping that they become, and you don't have to do this alone. I've said that Numerous times, and I will continue to say it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:03]:
    There are so many other dads out there that are going through the same journey, And they struggle with very similar things, and they go about fatherhood in different ways. And that's why it's so important that we have these conversations, that we sit down, we Dog. Talk about it. We build a community for you to be able to meet other dads, learn from them because there's no one right way the father. There's many different ways that people do father, and you learn along the way. You learn as things change in your life, in your kids' life. And you can learn from the dads around you, but you can also learn from dads through things like this. That's why every week I love being able to Dog.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:42]:
    Talk with you, sit down with you, and bring you different guests with different perspectives, different experiences that can help You to think about fatherhood in a little bit different way. This week, we've got another great guest with us. Joe Martin is the owner of Relentless Positivity Fitness. He teaches in person as well as online classes. He's won several awards, including Huntsville's healthiest trainer, Huntsville's healthiest male. The Relentless Positivity Fitness was was just recently voted the best place in Huntsville to work out, and his book, the Relentless positivity hit the Amazon's bestseller list. Now we're gonna learn a little bit more about that, but he has a long journey of being a athlete and working in fitness and found also at one point, he was above 50 pounds overweight. And I I think all of us at one point in life can probably look at that and look at ourselves and say, are we where we wanna be, and how is that impacting us as men, But also how is that impacting us as fathers? And it's a it becomes a turning point for yourself, and it was a turning point for Joe too.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:47]:
    So I'm really excited to be able to to learn from him today, learn from him as a father. He's a father of a son who is just about to go off to the Air Force Academy, and he's gonna grow. He's gonna fly off the nest here to go and do go into the next phase of his life. Doug. So he is going through when I what I told you I was going through last year. So I'm really excited to talk to him, to learn from him, and to share him with you. Joe, thanks so much for being here today.

    Joe Martin [00:03:14]:
    Dog. I'm really excited to be here. We talked a little bit before we we started that there's no instruction manual when it comes to being a dad. So what you're doing is so important. Building strong dads out there that can build strong daughters Doc. It's so important. It kinda, you know, that old Frederick Douglass quote talked about it. It's it's much easier to build strong children than it is to fix or or repair a broken man or a Woman.

    Joe Martin [00:03:32]:
    I'm in the fitness world, so I've been training women exclusively for 15 years. And a lot of the stuff they're dealing with as adults goes back to childhood. What you're doing right now, helping people cut that off before it ever happens, man. It's so important. So I appreciate what you're doing out there.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:44]:
    So now I usually start with some conversations to talk about the What it was like to be a father of a daughter. You don't have that experience, but you do have a you were a father of a son. So talk to let's go back a little bit. Let's talk a little bit about that journey that you've been on the And what you've had to learn along the way. So let's turn the clock back. Your son is a senior in high school, and as you think back to that first moment, the first moment when you found out that you were going to be a father, what was going through Doug.

    Joe Martin [00:04:07]:
    Man, all the emotions. All of them. You think, oh my gosh. I'm not ready. I'm excited. I need to make more money. I need to be less busy. All these things are going through your head.

    Joe Martin [00:04:16]:
    Doc. You don't know what to expect. You know, anytime you you're doing something new, all the fear comes in. Also a lot of excitement, and I was really excited about being a dad. I had amazing parents growing up. So I kinda I got modeled that growing up. I was excited to give it a shot. And I was the 1st in my family to have a kid, man.

    Joe Martin [00:04:29]:
    So it's very exciting. I've got 2 brothers and 1 older, 1 younger. So I was, like, kind of the first one. So no one the They couldn't ask my brothers about us, you know, but I've got a lot of people around me that really helped me out. But mainly, it was just the overwhelming thing with excitement and gratitude, just be able to have this chance to be a dad.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:43]:
    Now fatherhood is never Always roses. It's not always easy. You go through peaks and valleys as you go along. Talk to me about Doc. What you had to go through as a father to be able to be the father that you wanted to be as you went through those peaks and valleys.

    Joe Martin [00:05:00]:
    I think a lot of it's, you had a previous guest Docs. Talking about watching your kids fail. How it's it's so hard to do, but man, it's so important. Even watching them hurt themselves. You know, when you tell them over and over, don't do that. Dog. Well, words mean one thing, actions mean another. You know, when they go and I tried to tell you and then you, you know, you touch the burning stove or whatever that version of that for your kid is.

    Joe Martin [00:05:19]:
    But That was one I'm just watching them fail. I mean, it's so tough. You wanna put them in this, you know, bubble wrap and send them out the world, and don't get hurt. Don't have to any challenges, but that's not the way the world works. Docs. And that's not how you grow, and that's not how you change. That was a tough lesson to learn. Also with, sports, like, you mentioned I was an athlete growing up.

    Joe Martin [00:05:35]:
    My son sports important to him. He's gonna go play Dault Air Force Academy. It's huge opportunity. But just looking back on his journey, when he first started getting a sport, he's telling me, oh, how good I was back in the day. Nobody cares about Dog. Right? Are you sure about how good you were? That doesn't mean anything to these kids. Tell them your struggles. Tell them that, hey, man.

    Joe Martin [00:05:51]:
    I had this coach that told me I would never play a down on varsity ever. Tell them I was scared the to death to go out of my 1st varsity game. I thought I was gonna throw up. You know, all these things that share your struggles. That's where they lean in and connect, and they say, oh, okay. Well, I struggle. I'm not very good at this yet.

    Joe Martin [00:06:06]:
    The I just started playing this. I don't wanna hear about how good you are. I'm terrible at this. I wanna hear that there's a chance that you struggled and you became better. I think as dads, you kinda wanna, back in the day, talk about how good you are and how you the Throw that football over a mountain back in your day. But if you can if you can share your struggles, I think that was a big lesson that I learned personally that, you know, they're gonna connect with that much more than they are. You talk about how good Door Stuff. And then just, hey, teaching them that your wife, their mother is the most important thing in their world. And you you do that by you modeling I'll tell

    Joe Martin [00:06:34]:
    Doc. Tell you this what. I had one of my mentors tell me one time that put your wife on a pedestal and see what child you raise. Put your wife down all the time and see what kind of a person he become. Doc. You could talk like I said, we talked about earlier. All these words are very important, but they can wanna wanna watch what you do with your actions. So if you, you know, put your wife up on a pedestal to show you how important she is, how the She loved all these things, and you continue to date your wife, love your wife, show what love a true relationship looks like. That's what they're gonna do. But if you go the other way, it's Docs.

    Joe Martin [00:07:00]:
    What they're gonna do as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:00]:
    So talk to me about the hardest part that you have found in being a dad to a son and just being a father in general. What's been the hardest part for you?

    Joe Martin [00:07:08]:
    I think the hardest part for me is coming Dog. He leaves. And he goes, he's the only child, man. This is, my wife and I's only child. We've been tight since day 1. And and just, you know, that Daily routine and just checking in and doing all these things. And our life pretty much revolves around what he does. His activities, hanging out with him, Doc.

    Joe Martin [00:07:24]:
    Seeing him and his girlfriend, what they're doing, going to church together, all these things. I mean, like, 3 fourths of our days revolves around, yo, what's he doing? Yo, man, what's he doing? What are we doing together? What's for dinner? That's a big one around here because he's a he's a big kid, man, so he's always eating. That's gonna be tough. That's what I like I said, our daily routines, his basketball games, his school, dude, his laundry. I'm I'm not gonna lie. I'm not I'm not ready for that one to go away, but there's a lot of thing. I think that's that one's coming up. He's been a pretty awesome kid growing up.

    Joe Martin [00:07:50]:
    Probably the ones I've I've shared before the biggest struggle, just watching him fail along the way and have watching him hurt, have his heart broken, you know, when his 1st girlfriend breaks up and those type of things are so hard to go through. Dog. I imagine this one coming up is gonna be big. When you're going through it right now, let me ask you. How's that going for you so far?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:03]:
    You know, it is different. We but we have 2 kids, so we still have 1 at home, but They both daughters are very different from one another. So my oldest was uber involved in everything. So just like your son, the We got involved in all the things that she did. Whereas my younger daughter is not involved as much Dog. In is involved in very few things that she gets involved in. And because of that, she is just a very different kid. And so There is a sense of loss when you as parents, when you start missing out on the The things that your kids used to do that you spent a lot of time doing.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:47]:
    You have to get over it and you have to keep keep going. And just because they're Not there and not doing those things doesn't mean you can't go to the basketball games or to the you know, if they were in involved in marching band, go to the marching band competitions or Or other things like that, but it's just different. And you have to then adjust, and you have to look at the new normal. And I know it's gonna be very different when the youngest goes off to college, and then we are empty nesters per se. And you're only seeing them when they come home for Breaks or in between terms. I mean, your kid's gonna be going far away from home. My kid went about 11 hours away from home. Dom.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:27]:
    So we try to stay in contact through things like FaceTime or through weekly check ins, daily check ins, but we let her tell us the what the schedule needs to be and try not to push our agenda of wanting to talk to her. And I'm sure that pretty much every the Parent has to have that kind of a conversation. It has to be willing to let go and step back and be willing to let their kid fly a bit And then let them dictate how much or how little that they do communicate. I found that I was over communicating a little bit. The And my wife came to me and said, our daughter has said that you're sending too many things. And I said, that wasn't my intent. The I was just responding to what she was sending me. Well, she was responding to me because I was sending her something, but I was sending too much.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:20]:
    So I said, okay. I will step back. I won't say anything, and I will let her take the lead. And it's it's hard to do, Dog. But you have to do it.

    Joe Martin [00:10:31]:
    For sure. Yeah. That's what we're looking at. And then who are my wife and I when we don't have kids together? We have to kinda rekindle that and figure out what we look like together as a couple without the kids. So that's gonna be another Docs. When you go to Air Force Academy, you got 6 week to boot camp, 0 communications. That's gonna be something that we struggle with right there. And then he's gonna be super busy, Dog.

    Joe Martin [00:10:47]:
    That's part that's how it works. That's how it's supposed to work. Talk about flying out of the nest. That's how it's supposed to work. Right? You graduate high school. You're supposed to go be your own person, and Dog. Probably the best way. Just rip the Band Aid.

    Joe Martin [00:10:57]:
    Let's get it going.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:57]:
    That definitely is ripping off the Band Aid when they fly away and they go for the first time That far away, we had those conversations about you're not gonna be able to come home. You're not gonna be able to constantly be able to just leave for a weekend and take a trip back Because of the expense and the amount of time, and we may see you once or twice the in a term. And that becomes the reality when your child does go far away. But that happens even after they graduate from college or they go the Into the workforce, and they move away if they're not gonna be close to home, and then you have to deal with that too. And you're right, though. You do have to come to that new reality with your with your partner in life the To be able to figure out who you are again and hopefully along the time, along the years that you have been together, That you have built a strong foundation so that when all that time and all that effort that you have put into raising your the Child goes away, and I say go away. It's still there because you're always gonna be a parent, but it's different. And the house is much quieter, and the You're going to have to come up with that new normal so that you still connect and that you then have other things to connect on Outside of all of the effort and time and passion that you put into raising your child.

    Joe Martin [00:12:17]:
    I'm not gonna lie. I'm I'm kinda excited to see what it looks like. The My wife jokes around that she's just gonna adopt another basketball player. We'll do it all over again. And I've I've nixed that idea, but she's she might be serious. I'm not sure.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:26]:
    There's been some families that I know that after their child graduates or leaves, they may have exchange students, or they may do something else Doc. To fill that void, to be able to or or they get involved with mentoring, or they get involved in coaching, or they get involved in something else Doc. That still connects them with youth in different ways because of the void that they feel internally.

    Joe Martin [00:12:53]:
    Yeah. I get that. I've been working with kids for a while. Still end up Dom. Middle school age is 10 to 14 year old. That's when kind of a that's the age it's so crucial, and it's it's a tough age. So I like to work with that age group. I imagine I'll put more resources Docs.

    Joe Martin [00:13:05]:
    That. We we did have an opportunity to host a foreign exchange student from Croatia. I'm not sure if we're gonna do it or not, but he's a basketball player. So my wife's pretty excited about that. So Doug. I don't know. We'll we'll see what that looks like, but you're right, man. It's gonna be something you can put your energies into.

    Joe Martin [00:13:17]:
    I'm excited about that as well. Just kinda freeing up that space to to make a difference. Dogs.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:21]:
    Now I know you said you work with a lot of that middle school age population, but you also have done a lot with mentoring and and trying to build those strong relationships with not only the kids that you're mentoring, but your own son as well. And I know you've done things to be able to better understand what mentoring the is or should be. So talk to me about mentoring and the importance of mentoring in kids and what you found the That you've had to do to be that positive mentor for youth that you work with.

    Joe Martin [00:13:50]:
    Yeah. We also talked a little bit before we got on about how we're kinda experts in our field, But our kids don't care. You know, you hear she was talking to your daughter about getting college admission. People pay you really good money to do that. People pay really good money to me to do fitness. Our kids do not care. So you kinda need that trusted resource outside of the home that can help, like a coach or something like that. That's kinda where I'd my I got a coaching background.

    Joe Martin [00:14:11]:
    I coach fitness. I coach football. Doc. That's where my background came from. So so with some kind of some steps you could do if you're looking to connect with your kid, or maybe it's you're an uncle or something like that. You wanna help out one Doc. Your friend's daughters or something like that. You're an aunt.

    Joe Martin [00:14:22]:
    Something like that you wanna help out. 1st, though, you gotta make a connection somehow. These kids have to know that you care about them. You have your best interest in mind. Doc. And I'm just saying, if they like it, I love it. You know, I got kids that they wanna talk about Minecraft. Not my favorite subject.

    Joe Martin [00:14:35]:
    I don't know if you're familiar with Minecraft, but if they like it, I love it. So I'm gonna find out what is what is about it. I'm gonna, hey. What what are you doing with that pickaxe? And they're like, what do you know about pickaxe? I was like, well, what I Googled. That's what I know about it. But, Dog. Just kind of finding the the common ground that we can work from there. A lot of the kids I work with, they like my dog.

    Joe Martin [00:14:52]:
    We can just talk about my dog because Doug. I I don't know if you've seen that with your kids that it's easier to get them to talk when you're doing an activity rather than sit down and just face to face, we're talking like we are right now. My son, it was Doc. Either we'll we'll be in the car and we'd be driving, so it's not the awkward, like, staring at each other, or we go throw the football or shoot baskets or do something else other than just sit there face to face and have Dads With conversation. We've had some of those, some important ones. You gotta sit down and do that. But to kinda get them to talk to you sometimes, it's easier if you're doing an activity. So we kinda take it Dog.

    Joe Martin [00:15:21]:
    The approach, like, for me, it's fitness mentoring is what I look at it. The kids kinda come in and think, oh, I'm gonna exercise and get a little bit better shape and do some things like this. So it's not like Doc. Most kids are, hey. I wanna go get mentored. They don't really know what that means, but they've you know, I wanna go in there and do some fun exercise, move around a little bit. Because the first thing you do is gotta make that connection. Dom.

    Joe Martin [00:15:39]:
    If you're a parent, you probably have that connection with your kid. But if you're mentoring another kid, you probably need to find some kind of way. I recommend looking and finding out what they're most into, and you get into it as well. Dog. And we start there. And then far as what we actually do together, far as goal setting and things like that, I'll talk to the parents, I'll talk to the kids, and we'll figure out a a realistic goal that they can do. Doc. Some of them just wanna move around a little bit, just feel better.

    Joe Martin [00:15:59]:
    A lot of kids I work with, they're not athletes. They're more on the computer game side. They're ready to play the A video game or or read a book or something like that, more artistic or things like that, that the physical realm is not really something they're familiar with. I mean, just getting them moving a little bit is so big as far as mentally, the Physically, emotionally, all these different things because and a lot of them are have to do with bullying. So if we can just get talking about that, and that's a big thing, Dog. Especially at that age group. It's middle school, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th grade, around there. Like I said, I've been working with kids about 15 years and social media changed the game.

    Joe Martin [00:16:29]:
    And then COVID changed it even more. Even the past 3 years, I've seen a huge difference in how the kids are in the past few years. A lot of it gets back to the parents. Docs. Some of them kinda checked out during the pandemic. They're dealing with so much other stuff. They kinda checked out and the kids are kinda left to do their own thing.

    Joe Martin [00:16:45]:
    And just getting back in and making a physical connection. These kids, a lot of them don't have in person friends like we used to growing up that we didn't have choice. Doggy. The kids in your neighborhood and things like that. Some there's kids all around my neighborhood. I rarely see them outside. We I live right next to a park.

    Joe Martin [00:16:59]:
    And unless there's organized sports, Dog. Many kids that just go out and play and do physical activities. Just kind of getting to reconnect with that and just get kids moving. It doesn't matter what kind of movement. We're not doing Docs. Some kind of serious fitness program or something like that. If we can just teach kids some general movement patterns and and we got one because I have a I got hardwood floors in my gym. 1 Dog.

    Joe Martin [00:17:18]:
    Kid, he likes to take his shoes off. I have TRX. He likes to slide on his socks on the hardwood floors. And we have set up these foam rollers. So it's like this Angry Birds game where he knocks over the the Foam rollers like he's bowling himself. So it's great movement. He's moving. He's moving his body.

    Joe Martin [00:17:31]:
    So find find another connection and getting them moving. Just those 2 things right there can make a huge difference for these

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:36]:
    So you've been doing fitness for a long time, and you as I said at the very beginning, you have a business called relentless positivity fitness. The And and you also have a podcast called relentless positivity podcast. And, you know, you're doing a lot of different things to engage people in different ways, kids, but also adults, To be able to push them to find fitness in their lives, what drew you into fitness, and why did you decide that this was your your calling and your passion?

    Joe Martin [00:18:04]:
    I was an Athlete all growing up, all through high school. And then, I played football as my main sport. Start off as a tight end. If you're familiar with football, that guy blocks a little bit. He catches a little bit. I cannot catch very well, and I gained a lot of weight, Docs. So I became a lineman.

    Joe Martin [00:18:15]:
    So if you're familiar with lineman, there's, like, big guys that run into other big guys. So so I was playing football. I was about 250, 260 pounds, and I got hurt. I was gonna go play in college, but I got hurt. So Dog. I put my whole life into football. That was all I care about in high school. I just knew I was going all the way.

    Joe Martin [00:18:29]:
    Right? I was one of those kids that that that was kind of my identity. You know, when you're in high school, you've Dog. Find your niche, and that's who you are. I'm in the band. I'm play sports, so I do this. Whatever it is, you kinda put yourself in this box, and that's who you are. Dog. So without that, I I kinda felt lost.

    Joe Martin [00:18:41]:
    You know, getting arrested, and I went to jail. And then just all these things started spiraling out of control. It got to the point where I was suicidal. That's Knowles. Passionate about working with these kids because I've been there too. So I kinda got to the point in my life that I gotta do something. And I started with losing weight Dog. Because I every time I looked in the mirror, it's just a reminder that I don't look good, I don't feel good, and I'm not the person I wanna be.

    Joe Martin [00:19:02]:
    So I started Doc. With one little thing, just I started reading food label. They'll label full. They'll tell you what's in there, how many calories, and all these things, and what you're putting into your body. So I started there and started the Losing weight. Like I said, I lost 50 pounds. I felt great. Like, man, I would love to help other people have the same feeling.

    Joe Martin [00:19:16]:
    So that's where I went from there. It's just that that's how I got into the fitness Dog. I've been on the other side where every day, you know, your body hurts and you don't feel good. This is not who I wanna be. Not that your weight defines who you are or anything like that, Dog. But it can be a reminder that, man, I just I just don't feel good.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:30]:
    You definitely can feel that way, especially as you get older and and the the Lack of movement, the lack of of intentional movement, I'll say, can definitely impact you and lead to the Other health implications in the future. Now as fathers, I think you said at the beginning, you know, we need to model the Not only the relationships that we want our kids to have, but we also need to model the lifestyle that we want our kids to see. And If we are out and we're active and we're actively engaging with them and we're playing shooting baskets or we're out doing walks or running or the At the gym or whatever it might be, our kids are gonna see that. None. They may not follow. As you said, you've been doing fitness and your kid doesn't like to listen to you. I get that. But at the same time, though they don't say that they are listening, they're listening or they're seeing, and it does impact in many different ways.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:27]:
    So the For a father that is hearing your journey and thinking to themselves, I need to take that next step because the I'm hurting. I can't keep up with my kids. I am having a hard time just day to day, and I need to do something to start moving the needle. The What are some things that they can do to start that? Maybe not even going to a gym, but just starting something to be able to Docs. Start seeing some gains in some aspects.

    Joe Martin [00:20:56]:
    I think the biggest mistake people make, and you'll see it in January, but when the gym is absolutely packed the 1st 2 weeks of January, the And then by week 3, 4, it started to look like a ghost town. You know, they say by 90 days into the new year, 90% of people started working out, they're done. It's over. They've given up. So people come in and wanna do I'm gonna exercise for 2 hours every day. I'm gonna eat broccoli and chicken every this is my year, and it's not sustainable. I suggest you start with something so small that it seems like nothing. That you have on a scale of 1 to 10, you're about a 9 or 10.

    Joe Martin [00:21:27]:
    I could definitely Doc. Maybe it's a 5 minute walk. I don't know where you are in your journey right now. Maybe you need to take a 5 minute walk. Walk around the block. Maybe you do a couple squats. Dog. Maybe go and ride your bike.

    Joe Martin [00:21:37]:
    Something so small, maybe you just need to drink a little more water, and then you start adding these on. So if you can just do one thing, do it consistently, and then you layer things on. The 5 minutes this week. Maybe you do. Maybe you do 7 minutes next week around the block. Go a little bit further. Because what you'll find usually if you start with that 5 minutes, oh, well, I can do 10 today. With the whole thing, the As humans, we're we're built to conserve energy.

    Joe Martin [00:21:57]:
    Right? That's just kinda through evolution. That's what got us here. So naturally, we are quote, unquote lazy. Docs. That's just your body trying to save you from doing we're not supposed to be out there running marathons. Right? So if you can do that, if you can just talk yourself into that 5 minutes, Doc. Usually, a lot more will actually happen. But if not, at least you got that 5 minutes in.

    Joe Martin [00:22:14]:
    You're getting consistent with it. Because don't be the person that goes in and they just Dog. Have an amazing 1 week in January, and then the other 51 weeks, they do not get I'd much rather you come in slow. Number 1, you're not gonna hurt yourself like a lot of people do. Doc. It's gonna be sustainable, and you're gonna go slowly add these on where it's not overwhelming and it's sustainable. You want a plan that's sustainable that you actually enjoy. If you can find a way to move your body that the like, don't not what someone told you is the best way to burn fat or build muscle or all this.

    Joe Martin [00:22:42]:
    What do you like to do? I remember years ago at my church, there was this guy, Dog. 80 year old man. He kinda came up to me. He's like, oh, asking me these fitness questions. He said, well, this is kind of embarrassing, but I like to do hip hop abs. He had a VCR tape with Sean Tee. This guy did hip hop ads. The guy is probably not the target market for this video, but he did it all the time, and he did great.

    Joe Martin [00:23:02]:
    It's like, that's not embarrassing, man. That's awesome. I wish I was in my eighties doing a hip hop ab routine. That's very cool. So it's just finding a way you enjoy moving your body and doing on a consistent basis Doc. And be amazed at what other habits start coming in. Because you start exercising a little more, well, maybe I'll start eating a little bit better because maybe I can, you know, do a little bit better in my class that I'm taking or I go a little bit further.

    Joe Martin [00:23:21]:
    Drink a little more water, none of them exercising more. And maybe if you cut down on my drinking a little bit, and all these things start kinda layering in. But if you try to do them all at once, they all tend to just fall off.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:31]:
    Definitely, I've seen that as well. And you're completely right. You get into that mode of the, New Year's resolutions. And you say, oh, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna do that. And a lot of times, the bar is set so high, it's really hard to maintain. And the So then at the end, you end up failing. And and that says something to your kids do, and they see that. The Indeed. I I think you're completely right when you say that you start small and start something just to start something and then work up from there. The Doesn't mean you have to be ready for an ultra marathon a month into working out.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:08]:
    You're not gonna be there, and that's okay. You just have to take the time to prepare Doc. And to move toward the goals that you want to set and be and then go from there as well.

    Joe Martin [00:24:18]:
    And I think it's very important to let your kids see you struggle with exercise. If it's tough, you don't don't hide that from your kid. Let them see because they're gonna be there one day, whether it's it's an injury or maybe they'll let themselves get out of shape or maybe they don't exercise at all now. But they see you Docs. Doing that dead I love to see people who look like they haven't exercised in a way, but they're out there doing it. That's the people that people try to make fun of and things like that. I love to see people out there. So Docs.

    Joe Martin [00:24:39]:
    Those are people that haven't given up. I think that says much more to your kids than someone who's always stayed in shape and things like that. It's so hard to start. Doc. Just whatever it is, it's so hard to get going. If you can just get started, that's usually the hardest part. So letting your kids see that it's okay to struggle. They'll they'll Put that maybe they're not fitness or something like that.

    Joe Martin [00:24:55]:
    Maybe it's school or or relationships or things like that. Seeing you struggle and not give up is so important. Like you Talked About Modeling. That's a huge thing right there.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:03]:
    It definitely is. Now I know I mentioned the fact that you also have a podcast and a book. Doc. Talk to me about those. And what are people gonna find if they, you know, listen in to your relentless positivity podcast or they pick up the book itself? What's your hope that the When someone listens or when they read, what are they gonna take out of

    Joe Martin [00:25:21]:
    those? With the podcast, I started that during the pandemic. I think a lot of people found a little no time on their hands. I wrote the book during the pandemic as well. It's just all I saw on the news was negativity, and that's what was kinda was just everywhere. Whether you're reading or watching the news or anything like that, I just wanna counterbalance that with having people on there that are like yourself that are doing amazing things out in the world that maybe people don't they haven't heard about it that need to be highlighted Noor stories or people out there that are changing the worlds in their neighborhood. Those unsung heroes. I love to highlight them. And just fun stories and maybe some dad jokes in there.

    Joe Martin [00:25:51]:
    You know, those are very important Docs. And things like that. They weren't getting shared. So I just that's why I started that, and it's just what we're doing. And then with the book, I just wanted to have it's kinda more I call it infotainment. Doc. Right. So I share stories from my life to kinda have some lessons about how you can lose weight, get in shape, and have less back pain, and things like that.

    Joe Martin [00:26:06]:
    That they're not about, here's Docs. Exactly what to do and why you're an idiot if you don't do it this way. There's options. There's ways to do it. There's strategies and things like that. And some inspiration. All those things that I Dog. I think there's a lot of negativity in the fitness world that people if you don't do it this way, then there's no other way to do it.

    Joe Martin [00:26:22]:
    So this kinda would giving people options, giving them inspiration, and you're doing it the In a positive manner because it's gonna get tough. You know, how do you handle the rough times when they come in? Whether it's, you know, life or your fitness or things like that. Do you handle the tough times? That's what's gonna define who you are and what you succeed in life about. So I just wanna kinda help people out with that. Just see I just trying to fill needs that I thought were not being filled. So that's kinda why the Start with the book as well as the podcast.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:43]:
    Oh, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Joe Martin [00:26:50]:
    I'm ready.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:50]:
    The In one word, what is fatherhood?

    Joe Martin [00:26:52]:
    Strength.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:53]:
    When's the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father?

    Joe Martin [00:26:56]:
    I think when my son did his commitment to the Air Force Dog. To play basketball. Man, that was just a culmination of all these years of watching him struggle and become who he is as a man. It's just it was a great moment.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:06]:
    Now if I was to talk to your son, How would he describe you as a dad?

    Joe Martin [00:27:10]:
    Goofy yet serious about discipline.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:12]:
    Who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Joe Martin [00:27:14]:
    That's my dad. I watched it growing up. Got to see it Firsthand, best dad ever.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:18]:
    Now you've given a lot of piece of advice today as we finish up. What's 1 piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Joe Martin [00:27:24]:
    Don't give up on. Yeah. Doc. I wanna look back on my life when I was like I said, I was in jail, been on probation, all these different things. My life did not look that great. Don't give up on those kids. Just a snapshot of my life. It looked like I was going nowhere.

    Joe Martin [00:27:36]:
    I had no future, nothing going on. Wasn't very good at school. The Literally did not how to know how to spell the word business. Spelled it wrong till I got to college. It didn't look good, but my parents never gave up on me. And I've turned it around, Dog. And your kids

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:48]:
    can too. Well, Joe, I really appreciate you being here today. If people wanna find out more about you and what you're doing, where's the best place for them to go? I

    Joe Martin [00:27:55]:
    can go to my website, the fit and positive .com. You can look it's got the link for the podcast. It's got the book on there, the mentoring program, if you wanna know. If you just wanna talk about how you can help your kids, you the With the mentoring or anything like that, you can reach out. It's got my contact information on there. Before I go, if you're listening right now, you need to stop and give this man Docs. A 5 star review on whatever podcast platform you're listening for. We need more strong dads out there raising strong daughters, and he's doing the world a the Good service out here.

    Joe Martin [00:28:19]:
    Give him a 5 star review. He deserved it. You know, you've listened to him before. He deserved your 5 stars. You do that right now.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:24]:
    Well, I appreciate you saying that, Joe. And I truly do appreciate all that you're doing to be able to inspire kids around you, inspire your own son as he prepares for the future, and I wish you all the best.

    Joe Martin [00:28:35]:
    Thank you very much. Thank you for having me on. This is great. Keep up the great work. I'd love to have you on my podcast as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:39]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information the that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, the And more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:26]:
    Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters the And be the best dad that you can be. We're all in the same boat, the and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time.

    We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents. Bring your A game because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just Dog. Like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, Domino's. Be the best dad you can be.

  • David Samson on Fatherhood: Navigating Challenges and Supporting LGBTQ Youth

    David Samson on Fatherhood: Navigating Challenges and Supporting LGBTQ Youth

    · Dads With Daughters

    As the societal landscape continues to evolve, it's crucial for dads to have open conversations and seek understanding when it comes to supporting youth in the LGBTQIA+ community. In a recent episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, David Samson, a father and advocate for LGBTQIA+ youth, shared his experiences and insights. From fatherhood to the work he does at Time Out Youth, Samson shed light on the challenges, triumphs, and the importance of creating a supportive environment for LGBTQIA+ youth. In this blog post, we explore key takeaways from the conversation to provide guidance for dads looking to support their children and other LGBTQIA+ youth.

    Fatherhood: A Journey of Understanding and Acceptance

    Fatherhood is often described as a journey, and for David Samson, it’s a journey filled with unique challenges and triumphs. Samson emphasized the importance of creating a supportive community for fathers raising daughters and navigating the complexities of fatherhood. He underlined the significance of not parenting alone and highlighted the need for fathers to engage with other dads for support and guidance.

    For fathers of LGBTQIA+ youth, Samson’s perspective offers a valuable reminder that parenthood is an ongoing learning process. Each child’s journey is unique, and it’s crucial to provide unwavering love and support no matter what. Samson beautifully articulated the joy and challenges of being a father, touching on profound moments such as the first day his son went to school, demonstrating the emotional layers of parenthood.

    Supporting LGBTQIA+ Youth: Challenges and Opportunities

    When discussing his work at Time Out Youth, Samson highlighted the vital support they offer to LGBTQIA+ youth. From mental health services to housing support and community engagement, the organization serves as a beacon of acceptance and advocacy. The issues faced by LGBTQIA+ youth are complex and varied, ranging from homelessness to societal unacceptance. Samson discussed the challenges faced by trans and nonbinary youth, emphasizing the crucial need for understanding and support in today’s society.

    Through his insights, Samson underscored the impact of the recent years, including the COVID-19 pandemic, on LGBTQIA+ youth. The increased periods of isolation and trauma have highlighted the critical need for supportive environments and understanding from family and the broader community. Dads of LGBTQIA+ youth can leverage resources such as Time Out Youth and PFLAG to enrich their understanding and create safer, more supportive spaces for their children.

    Embracing Change and Acceptance

    An essential aspect of Samson’s narrative is the potential conflicts parents may encounter when their children come out. He emphasized the importance of choosing to support and believe in one’s child, even when it challenges long-held beliefs. Samson acknowledged the internal struggles but emphasized the necessity of prioritizing one’s child over preconceived beliefs. Dads in this situation can find solace in resources like PFLAG and Trevor Project, which offer guidance and support in navigating conversations and acceptance.

    Educating and Advocating

    A Call to Action for Dads Samson highlighted the importance of being actively involved in youth-serving organizations and advocating for the LGBTQIA+ community. By participating in local prides, engaging with neighbors, and opening conversations about acceptance, dads can foster inclusive communities. Being present and supportive serves as a powerful start to effecting positive change in society.

    The conversation with David Samson offers valuable insights and guidance for dads looking to provide support and understanding for their LGBTQIA+ children and other youth. As fathers, embracing change, practicing patience, and committing to learning and understanding are essential in creating inclusive environments for all children. By engaging with resources and proactive conversations, dads can empower themselves to be unwavering beacons of love and acceptance for LGBTQIA+ you

    Navigating fatherhood while supporting LGBTQIA+ youth presents its own set of challenges and responsibilities. However, by acknowledging the significance of acceptance, education, and advocacy, fathers can create an environment that nurtures and uplifts all children, regardless of their sexual orientation or gender identity. The conversation with David Samson provides a compelling and informative starting point for fathers to embark on this journey and become stalwart advocates for LGBTQIA+ youth.

    Through empathy, openness, and a willingness to learn, dads can play a pivotal role in shaping an inclusive world for their LGBTQIA+ children and others in the community.

    In conclusion, Samson’s insights and experiences highlight the transformative power of loving and supporting one’s children unconditionally, thereby forging a future that embraces and celebrates diversity and inclusion in all its forms.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong independent women. Doc. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love being able to sit down with you, to work with you, to be able to talk to you Dog. About this journey that you and I are both on. I've tie told you before, I've got 2 daughters myself. I've been where you are at, And I know that every day is a little bit different, and every day is a journey. The biggest thing here that and I say this over and over again to you is that the You don't have to do this alone.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:54]:
    It is so important to know that there is a community of fathers out there that you can reach out to, that you can talk to. The You don't have to go alone and think that you have to father alone because that's really lonely, and that is really Docs. It's something that that that a lot of times as society, we've kinda feel like we have to man up. We have to the Figure it out for ourselves and you don't. So that's why it's so important that every week we sit down, we talk, we learn together from other their fathers from other people with many different resources that they're sharing to be able to help you on this journey that you're on. Every week, I also love being able to bring you different guests, the different people that have had different experiences that are fathers that have resources that are here to help you Doc. To be that dad that you wanna be in today, we got another great guest. David Sampson is with us today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:49]:
    And David is a father. He is the He lives down in North Carolina, works for a organization called Time Out Youth, and we're gonna talk more about that today. The David has worked to raise over $30,000,000 in funds to support nonprofits, but he works with youth to help youth in many different ways. And the And the things that he's doing, especially in the intersection of working with LGBTQ youth, I think is really important because the All of us are working with different kids. Our kids are maybe in that same community, and we have to be able to support our kids no matter what. The So it is important to understand and to know, you know, what David has learned along the way in working with youth, the But also learn about his own experience in being a father as well. So I'm really excited to have him here. David, thanks so much for being here today.

    David Samson [00:02:41]:
    Hey. Thanks so much. It's so great to be here and to be able to share some perspective with you and the great folks who are listening and who you're supporting. I really appreciate it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:50]:
    I appreciate you being on. And 1st and foremost, we gotta talk about you being a dad because you are a father of a son. I wanna turn the clock back in time. I wanna go back to that first moment that you found out you were going to be a the Father, what was going through your head?

    David Samson [00:03:01]:
    I have a 5 year old son. Gosh. When I found out I was gonna be a dad, it was At the end of a very long journey, Jasper was born via surrogacy. So the planning for him to come really was Decades worth of work, honestly. It was, you know, saving money and planning and trying to understand what it meant to be a gay dad in this world. We had just no marriage equality. So we were sort of in the midst of a transition as a country, but I always knew the From the day that, really, I became an adult that I wanted to be a parent. So to have that opportunity to have and and raise such an an amazing boy was a dream come true, no Quite honestly, I remember the 2nd we got the positive pregnancy test, I was just, like, in tears.

    David Samson [00:03:48]:
    And I don't think I stopped crying from that point until Dom. The 2nd I held them in my arms for the 1st time, it was really magical.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:56]:
    Now I have to ask this question because I think the You have that glow and that that magic. As you said, it's magical when you're holding your child for the 1st time, but it's not always roses. It's not always the Positives. The there's ups and downs to parenting, and you have to learn along the way how to balance all of that. Talk to me about what's been the hardest part the for you in being a father.

    David Samson [00:04:19]:
    So it's I feel like it's different for every parent. Right? Like, Jasper was the easiest infant. He really was. You know, we sleep trained him. And from the time he was 12 weeks old, he was sleeping 12 hours a night. Like, it was unbelievable. And then he turned 3. And when he turns 3, it was like, oh, This is what everybody is talking about because up until that point, I'm telling you, he was the easiest kid. Even when he learned to walk and, you know, was running around, he was still pretty the Cautious. He didn't you know, wasn't too reckless, didn't injure himself or do anything, but, man, he really found his space when he turned 3. The And kinda since then until now, it's I feel like we've gotten our our punch of tough parenting. So we've learned to set boundaries. We've learned, the Kinda what it means to push back, and we've learned a lot of his tricks along the way. But it's a different experience for everyone, but infant, easy. Toddler, tough.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:22]:
    So as a father, what would you say has been your biggest fear in raising a child in today's society?

    David Samson [00:05:28]:
    Feel like I'm always gonna say the wrong And I think that that is a fear that every parent has. You know, I think back to to my childhood, and there are A lot of things that my parents said to me that stuck. So I always try and pause a little bit before I speak. I listen to him. I try and look at him and and try and figure out what he's going through in that moment and what he actually needs As opposed to looking at him throwing a tantrum on the floor. So, yeah, I feel like just really thinking about the words that come out of my mouth, really Understanding the impact that everything that we say as parents have on our kids. But, yeah, it's a it's a fear I live with every day that I'm gonna traumatize them somehow say the wrong thing.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:14]:
    I smile at that because I think that I think every father feels that way, that what we say, what we do is going to, as you said, scar them, the Make you know, do something that's going to impact who they become. And I think that it's the Possible that there are things that you can do definitely that could scar them or impact them, but they're pretty resilient. The And they definitely forgive more than and they forget things a lot more so than we do. So just to give you some some perspective.

    David Samson [00:06:47]:
    I appreciate that. Yeah. I've learned how to apologize more as a parent than ever than at any point in my life. Like, I've gotten really good at saying I'm sorry to my son because I think that's really important. Right? Because you're always wondering, is this the moment that he's never gonna forgive me for Slightly raising my voice, and I'm like, oh, I just you know, I curl up like a kid in the corner. I really do. I'm like, I want you to be okay. I want you to feel love, and I don't want you to to, you know, to feel this energy that I'm giving off right now in this sort of heated moment.

    David Samson [00:07:19]:
    So, yeah, thank you for that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:21]:
    The Now one of the things that I I just mentioned was the fact that as a parent, as a father, you do have to find that balance for yourself the To be that engaged dad that you wanna be, but then there's also the pull to the work that you do and the things that you do to provide the family as well. So talk to me about balance in thus far how you have had to or what you have had to do To balance both work and raising your son.

    David Samson [00:07:51]:
    Yeah. Because he can't do one without the other, Right. As it turns out. And I've had progressive responsibilities in my role here at Time Out Youth. I I started in the midst of the pandemic as the director of development and then the director of advancement. Now I'm the the chief operating officer. So it's not like my my work has gotten less. It's gotten much more.

    David Samson [00:08:11]:
    So I find myself really Struggling at times to have the time to to dedicate, but you have to. Luckily, I work for a wonderful nonprofit who understands that work, life balance is incredibly important. They know Jasper. They love Jasper. They see me as a person, first here at Time Out Youth and not a number in, you know, no Some big corporations. So I I'm lucky enough to have a supportive work family who respects my home life. I start my day by getting up with him or he'll crawl into bed with us and curl up for 20 minutes, no If that ever ends, I'm just gonna lose my mind because those are the best moments, but it's really nice to start my day with him. The You know what I mean? I just get to start my day with my son, and it centers me immediately.

    David Samson [00:09:01]:
    You know? And then I get up, and I read my work emails, and my brain gets going, and then I have to stop again, and I have to make breakfast for him. And then I have more moments with him in the morning. And then it's no A struggle getting him ready for school and packing his backpack and rushing around and getting out the door, but then more moments in the car. So I think that truly finding those steady moments throughout the day when you're together, even when you're in the midst of, you know, your busiest time at work or whatever it might be. Truly just capturing and having those very few moments with him, even if they might be fleeting, are Incredible opportunities to bond as parents, and I really value them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:44]:
    It is really important to find those moments, Dom. As you said, the the opportunities to make those specific bonds with your child. Now you have 1 child. Now the What do you do individually as a dad to be able to make that connection, to develop that connection with your son? The Because we know that each child is unique, but that your children may have very different interests in very different ideas of what is fun than what you may think is fun. So what do you do to be able to build that unique relationship the that you want to have with your son.

    David Samson [00:10:23]:
    No. You're exactly right. He's into totally different stuff than I was when I was a kid or I am now. I was a music major in college, so I had this, like, grand vision that my son was gonna come out and be a the A pianist or a vocalist or something, and that is not happening, which is sort of heartbreaking for me. My husband bought us a the Piano for my birthday last year. And I was like, oh, I'm gonna teach Jasper how to play the piano. He's gonna sit down with me. Like, You know, like, my mom sat down with me and taught to you know, taught me to play the piano.

    David Samson [00:10:57]:
    He doesn't care at all. Nothing. Now he can he knows where middle c is. We've done a few lessons, but he would much rather go do, like, LEGO robotics, which is, like, So far outside of the realm of anything that I was interested in or am interested in. So I feel like for a while, I tried to push him into things that were in my comfort zone, but it has nothing to do with my comfort zone. It's about supporting him and the things that he wants to do and Really fostering that that passion and that fire in whatever it is that he wants. So he's only 5. Right? So we're still in the midst of, like, the Trying to figure out exactly what it is that he likes or what he's good at or what he thinks he's good at.

    David Samson [00:11:39]:
    So we still try and push him in as many different directions as we can. But when he latches onto something and when we can kinda see the wheels turning in his head, It's really exciting. And we latch onto that with him, and we get excited for him. And we're already finding ourselves, like, the Pushing him towards the things that he really loves and, you know, just going all in with him as much as we can.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:04]:
    Well, that's so fun. And and maybe there's some intersection there. Because if he likes the LEGO robotics, you maybe you can do some stop motion type things where you bring music to the robotics that he builds And do something fun like that.

    David Samson [00:12:18]:
    Yeah. Look inside the piano lid and see the hammer. Right? Like, yeah, it's super cool. It's all connected. They'll figure it out. We'll help them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:25]:
    Now You mentioned the fact that you are or I mentioned the fact that you are a part of Time Out Youth. You talked about that as well and the organization itself. Tell me more about Time Out Youth. I know it's been around since 1991. It's serving LGBTQIA plus youth, but tell me more about the organization, What your mission is and how you're working with youth in many different ways.

    David Samson [00:12:49]:
    Yeah. Absolutely. So you mentioned it has been around since 1991, and that's right. The We are the oldest in the Carolinas, and we are also the biggest in the Carolinas. In between, Washington DC and Northern the Florida. Time out youth is the standard of LGBT youth centers on the East Coast. So our mission, is to support LGBTQ the youth by offering vital programs, fostering unconditional acceptance, and creating safe spaces for self expression through leadership, the community support and advocacy. So we do that in a number of ways.

    David Samson [00:13:23]:
    Our bread and butter are youth 13 to 24 the Here in the Charlotte Metro region, we have mental health services, free counseling services. We offer really vital housing support the Services here at Time Out Youth. And then we have social interaction space. So 5 days a week, we offer programming whether virtually or in person here in the center. The And then Fridays Saturdays, we have drop ins space. So Friday nights are for our big kids, so 18 to 24. And then Saturdays are for our younger youth who no We're 13 to 18. So on any given day from the time we get here at 10 o'clock up until school's out, We're usually offering housing services, job search functions to our kids who are houseless or have been kicked out of their homes due to unacceptance.

    David Samson [00:14:12]:
    So in in that time period, we're really seeing a very specific group of kids. And then in the evenings, it's anyone's guess. These are kids. So we might have 30 or 40 kids who are coming in and just wanna hang out and play video games, or we might be having a trans specific group That evening or talking to our our youth who identify as asexual, any number of things can happen at any given moment here. Along with all that, we also offer community engagement work. So we have a really fantastic community engagement manager who goes out into the community, the Works with educators, administrators, corporations, small businesses, you name it, and helps to educate folks on the best way To serve LGBTQ youth when they're not within safe space of our 4 walls. So last year, she educated 2,000 community members here in the metro regions. It's really a full slate of services that we offer our youth as well as our community.

    David Samson [00:15:09]:
    I'm really proud of and the work that we do.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:11]:
    Now you work with a lot of different youth or your organization does as well, and I'm sure you do as well. And the Things have changed over the years. I know many people that were very silent when I was growing up and did not the Come out until college or beyond because of the unacceptance in society. I'm seeing much more now the In the generation that my children are in, that at least children are very accepting and are much more accepting the than they would have been when I was a youth. So as you're working with these youth, what are some of the big issues the that they are bringing to you. You talked about homelessness, but what are some of the other issues that are really prevalent in today's LGBTQ youth that other people may not be aware of.

    David Samson [00:16:05]:
    Yeah. You know, you're right that things have changed, especially politically. Right? What has not changed is that there is still rampant unacceptance in the form of religion, in the form of the Family structure that is unsupportive traditionally of our youth and that sometimes these kids have no place to go. Those kids are always going to exist. Docs. Whether we turn the clocks forward 50 years, there's always gonna be something. And especially for our trans and nonbinary youth, Especially here in the south. Things are very different in New England or California even than they are here in North Carolina.

    David Samson [00:16:45]:
    The In North Carolina, there is a a really large movement to really isolate our trans and nonbinary youth because as we've seen at no Any point throughout this movement, people don't understand, and they're just scared of what they don't understand. So we really work hard the To help people understand what our youth are going through, how to support them, and who they can be as people just to make These kids not feel so alone. These feelings of isolation, especially after 2020 and 2021 when a lot of our youth were forced To stay in unsupportive homes around the clock 247, there's a lot of trauma that happened in those years that were unraveling. And as our youth reemerge and, you know, come back into the building still, there was a lot that happened there that that we need to work through, and and we're working hand in hand every day with those youth to try and figure it out with them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:37]:
    Now there are dads out there that may have young kids, the may have kids that are struggling right now and trying to figure out who they are and try or they know who they are, but they're the Scared to come to their parents with that reality of who they are themselves? Are there specific things that you would recommend to dads, To parents that could help to create that atmosphere in the home that would allow for them the For that home to be that accepting place. And the 2nd piece of that is if personally, as a father, you have the Views that are contrary to typically accepting LGBTQ, but your child comes to you the And says, I am this way. I feel this way. I am this person. How do you reconcile that Doc. And are there resources that can help you to move and to a accepting of the person in that sense, Even though you may still have those fundamental beliefs that are at opposite ends.

    David Samson [00:18:44]:
    Yeah. It's an internal struggle. I'm not that person, but I I understand that those people exist. You know what I mean? It makes total sense. My dad was the An air force colonel. He was in the air force for 30 years, and I grew up around this toxic masculinity that really invaded a lot of our family life. And so as a young person coming out, I was terrified.

    David Samson [00:19:09]:
    I was absolutely terrified. My mother's a pastor. I get it. No. It turns out that they were incredibly accepting, and I had nothing to worry about. The But that's just not the case. But I there's a choice to be made. Is your kid gonna come first? And I know that sounds harsh, but, truly, Doc.

    David Samson [00:19:29]:
    Is your kid gonna come first? Do they come above these beliefs that you have developed for yourself your entire life? The Are you willing to change for your child? Because your child is not going to change for you. They might pretend. You know? They might pretend until they're 18, but the You're running such a risk, and how sad to run the risk of losing a child just because you, as an adult, who should have the skills the change. You're just so unwilling. So, yeah, there's a choice to be had, and there are great resources out there. PFLAG, which stands for the Parents and friends of lesbians and gays. There's a chapter in every major city in the United States and no A lot of smaller cities in the United States. So go to pflag.org and find resources to help you as a parent Navigate that with your child.

    David Samson [00:20:21]:
    It's incredibly important. You know, we started this conversation with me saying I was always scared I was gonna say the wrong thing. It's the Really easy to say the wrong thing to someone who is so fragile in the coming out process, whether they're coming out as gay or lesbian or Brands or nonbinary or whatever it is. There are very specific things that you can say that are not gonna help and that will just Make your child feel even, you know, more isolated and even more of an outcast than they already feel like they are. Dogs. So it's important to be careful and to really consider every step along the way the impact that that that you're gonna have on your child.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:00]:
    I think it's so important, and, the You know, I've talked to other fathers that have youth that are at many different aspects of the spectrum in regard to the Whether they are they're they're gay, they're lesbian, they're, you know, they're asexual, they're trans, and They go through their own journey just like their child goes through a journey of better understanding. And I think one of the things that I hear from I've heard from them many times is the The some of the times, the challenges of pronouns and changing your brain to think in different ways. And I think one of the things you said earlier is so important, especially when you have a child that is LGBTQIA QIA plus and they come to you and start talking is to be honest and open with them and say, I'm gonna make mistakes, And I may use the wrong pronoun. I may say something that's going to upset you, and we need to be able to the Talk and communicate and be willing to have this type of conversation so that I can learn just as you're learning about who you are.

    David Samson [00:22:14]:
    Yeah. It takes an extra layer of patience sometimes, and I totally get it. Like, you know, a teenager is still a teenager. Right. So if you tell a teenager, like, be patient with me, they're not gonna be patient with you. They're a teenager. But I get it. It's this extra layer.

    David Samson [00:22:29]:
    And the the pronouns conversation, It's the easiest one to have. You're gonna make mistakes. Absolutely. It's okay. You say sorry. You correct yourself. You move on. That's it.

    David Samson [00:22:38]:
    You know what I mean? You don't make a big deal. Those struggles that people have with with pronouns are not about the person that is asking you to use the correct pronouns as about themselves. I'm named after my dad. I understand that if I changed my name to him, Dom. That would have seems like some sort of slap in the face because he gave me his name. That happens all the time. But, again, That's not about him. Like, it's a choice that you as a parent have to make to respect your child and to believe your child and just listen to your DIL.

    David Samson [00:23:11]:
    And I hope that the majority of people out there do that and understand that truly.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:16]:
    Now for dads that are out there that the May not have a child that is a part of the LGBTQIA plus community, but they want Docs. Support the community, and they want to support other youth, other friends of their children. What's the best way for them to advocate or to support the The community from a external perspective.

    David Samson [00:23:39]:
    Yeah. Absolutely. So find your local, youth serving organization, LGBTQ youth serving organization. They're smaller in a lot of places, but they're incredibly vital resources. You can go to our website, which is no Time at youth dot org, and we have a resource section where you can go find local pflag chapters. You can go read Trevor Project studies. I mean, Trevor Project also has an the amount of resources, including crisis resources throughout the United States. So but, really, go support those organizations and show up where you can.

    David Samson [00:24:12]:
    Show up at your local prides. Show up in support of your youth at schools and out in the community, and just Be there as a supportive face and as a smiling face. Showing up is half the battle. Right? So really just being there is is Enough sometimes.

    David Samson [00:24:28]:
    Well and the other thing that I think that I'd throw out there is as you get involved and if you bring your families and have them be involved, the You can start having conversations and start to allow your children to better understand the The people that are around them and that there are differences, and that's okay, And that it normalizes things as well.

    David Samson [00:24:54]:
    Yeah. No. Absolutely. It's the know your neighbor campaign. You can put a the Face and a name to all of these different labels that society has put on us. So, yeah, having those conversations is an incredible first step. Doc.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:07]:
    Now, David, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    David Samson [00:25:15]:
    Oh, boy. Ready?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:18]:
    In one word, what is fatherhood? Floating. When was a time when you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father.

    David Samson [00:25:26]:
    The 1st day that Jasper went to big kids' school, he gave me a hug, he turned around, And he walked in that front door confidently.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:37]:
    Now if I was to talk to your son, how would he describe you as a dad?

    David Samson [00:25:42]:
    I hope that he would see Me as the caretaker. My husband is the fun dad. He plays with him not more, but better than I ever could. I think That. I think I'm the caregiver. I don't know. That's a tough one.

    David Samson [00:25:58]:
    I cook and I drive him to school and, you know, I clean. I I feel like that's my zone. You know what I mean? So I don't know. Ask me in 10 years.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:07]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    David Samson [00:26:09]:
    My dad. He was incredible.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:12]:
    Now you have given a number of pieces of advice, resources that dads can take and can use for themselves. The As we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice that you'd wanna give to every dad?

    David Samson [00:26:23]:
    Be patient with yourself. We've talked a lot about mistakes in this conversation. Know that you're gonna make mistakes And learn to forgive yourself and know the importance of apologizing to your kid.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:35]:
    Well, David, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing your story and for telling us more about Time Out Youth. I really appreciate the work that you and your organization is doing, and I wish you all the best.

    David Samson [00:26:49]:
    Thank you, Chris. I appreciate you so much. Thank you for having me on.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:52]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the dads with daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are the Figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. The Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts, the But more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together.org. If you are the Father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today. Dads with Daughters is a program of fathering together.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:41]:
    We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters and be the best dad that you can be.

    We're all in the same boat, and it's Full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents. The the mind blast, calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Donuts. Get out and be the world, choose them. Be the best dad you can be!

  • Kelly K: A Journey of Faith, Consistency, and Instilling Self-Worth in Daughters

    Kelly K: A Journey of Faith, Consistency, and Instilling Self-Worth in Daughters

    · Dads With Daughters

    In a heartfelt and insightful episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, best-selling author, pastor, and evangelist Kelly K shares his personal journey of parenting, step-parenting, and maintaining faith in the modern world. Joining the host, Christopher Lewis, Kelly K offers valuable advice and wisdom on the importance of consistency, faith, and instilling self-worth in children. Let's delve into the key highlights of this enriching conversation.

    Consistency in Parenting and Faith:

    Kelly K underscores the significance of consistency in parenting, emphasizing the need to instill godly principles in children despite the evolving landscape of parenting approaches. His message of open and honest communication, treating children with respect, and nurturing self-worth resonates deeply in today's world. By sharing his personal experiences in guiding his daughter through challenging relationships and finding solace in the teachings of the Bible, Kelly K encourages parents to embrace a steadfast approach in shaping their children's lives.

    Parenting Daughters and Instilling Self-Worth:

    Christopher Lewis delves into Kelly K's experience of being a father to daughters, acknowledging the challenges of instilling value and self-worth in them. Through Kelly K's candid narrative of guiding his daughter through difficult relationships and ultimately witnessing her find a godly partner, listeners gain invaluable insights into the complexities of raising strong, independent daughters. This segment serves as a reminder of the pivotal roles fathers play in shaping their daughters' identities and fostering their resilience.

    Using Social Media as a Mission Field:

    Kelly K's unexpected journey of utilizing TikTok to spread messages of religion and spirituality unveils a fresh perspective on engaging with a younger demographic. By viewing social media as a mission field and voicing the initial hesitance followed by a divine calling to connect with the platform, Kelly K presents a compelling narrative of adapting to novel ways of spreading faith and values.

    Authentic Content Creation and Faith:

    Emphasizing the essence of authenticity in content creation for the younger generation, Kelly K touches upon the significance of making biblical truths relatable and comprehensible in today's society. His success on TikTok is attributed to providing a fresh perspective on biblical teachings, underscoring the impact of authenticity and relevance in reaching a global audience through social media.

    Empowering Through Devotionals and Writing:

    Kelly K's transition to becoming an author and the motivation behind writing "Think About That for a Minute, Volume 2, a 40-day devotional for a fresh perspective" further exemplifies his unwavering commitment to sharing God's word. Addressing the pressing issue of biblical illiteracy in today's generation, Kelly K's dedication to crafting devotionals that resonate with his audience signifies an empowering endeavor.

    Navigating Step-Parenting and Family Dynamics:

    Kelly K's poignant account of his step-parenting journey sheds light on the complexities and rewards of building strong family bonds. His emphasis on displaying love, grace, and mercy towards stepchildren serves as a testament to the transformative power of genuine relationships, offering guidance to individuals navigating similar challenges.

    Kelly K's profound insights on parenting, faith, and embracing modern platforms to spread meaningful messages serve as an inspiration to parents, step-parents, and individuals seeking to integrate faith into their everyday lives. His unwavering commitment to instilling self-worth, resilience, and values in children resonates deeply, affirming the enduring impact of love, grace, and faith in our journey through parenthood.

    In conclusion, this episode of Dads with Daughters with Kelly K imparts invaluable wisdom, serving as a guiding light for individuals navigating the intricate roles of parenting, step-parenting, and living a faith-driven life. For more engaging conversations and insights on fatherhood, join the Fatherhood Insider and the Dads with Daughters Facebook community. Visit kellykministries.com for more information about Kelly K and his transformative work.

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:
    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:
    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Docs. Really excited to have you back again this week. I love being able to sit down and talk to you every week about the journey that you're on the In raising those daughters of yours. Every week, we have a great opportunity to be able to listen, to learn, to the Walk on this path together. And I say it's a path together because, you know, I've got 2 daughters. I know you've got daughters. You're listening because Dogs.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:48]:
    You're passionate about your kids, and it is so important to be open to learning because there's no one right way to father. Dog. It's so important that you are open to be able to listen to others and listen to their experiences because you may find some kernels, some things that are Dom. Help you along the journey that you're on as well. I love being able to also bring you different people, different guests, different men, women, Dog. And others that have had different journeys, that they've been on different journeys themselves, that have different experiences and different resources that they can share with you. And today, Dog. Got another great guest.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:27]:
    Kelly Kaye is with us, and Kelly Kaye is a best selling author, pastor, and evangelist the Whose passion is traveling the world telling people about Jesus. Kelly Kaye has made a huge impact internationally by leveraging social media with daily the Teaching videos on TikTok. Kelly's unique style of speaking and communicating the Bible has captured the heart and attention of 1,000,000. The He's also got a brand new book that he's working on. He's authored a couple of different books including Think About That For a Minute, the Volume 1 and volume 2, get lit, stay lit, spread it, and reckless love revolution. So it's got a brand new book that we're gonna be talking about as well that he's just finishing up, gonna be sending out into the world here very soon. But the Above and beyond that, he and his wife, Lindsay, have 5 children, and 3 of which are daughters. So we're gonna be talking about his own journey the As a father.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:23]:
    Kelly Kaye, thanks so much for being here today.

    Kelly K [00:02:25]:
    Man, thank you so much for having me. It's an absolute honor.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:28]:
    It is my pleasure having you here today. And one of the things that I love Dove. Doing. 1st and foremost, I wanna turn the clock back in time. You've got 5 kids, but we're gonna focus on those 3 daughters that you have. The Think back. We're gonna turn the clock back in time. What was the first reaction that you had when you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter?

    Kelly K [00:02:48]:
    So first, let me explain. My oldest 2 daughters are actually my stepdaughters. So my oldest daughter is 23. Her name is Brennan, Dog. And then my middle daughter, she's 19. Her name is Avery. And then I have an, 2 year old daughter named Jet. Now I gotta tell you this, though.

    Kelly K [00:03:04]:
    Dog. I remember my my wife when we were dating, you know, she asked me, does it bother you that I have 3 kids? And in the moment, it was without hesitation the that I was able to say not at all. It didn't bother me at all because I had the most amazing stepmom in my life that you could ever I'm telling you, she was she raised me since I was 2 years old. Never treated me like I wasn't her child. The always included me. I never felt that she was not my mom. Right? And so I just kinda knew that god gave me her for a reason. And when I started dating somebody seriously that had children, it made sense to me, like, okay, god.

    Kelly K [00:03:41]:
    You gave me this stepmom because I'm gonna have to repay the What she gave to me to these other children, I didn't think I was gonna have to do it times 3, but god's got a sense of humor like that. So, honestly, when I found out I was gonna be a dad, it's Dog. Different than most people because, I'd already met these kids. That brings up another issue, though, is that Brennan, when I started dating my wife, Docs. She was 7 years old, and she thought that I was the enemy. She thought that her relationship with her mom and dad the Ended because of me, which that was not the case at all. They've, you know, long been split up before we started dating. But I had to make a choice to say, yes.

    Kelly K [00:04:19]:
    I I still wanna do this with her even though she was Making life pretty miserable for all of us for a short amount of time, but I just always knew. Haley, god gave you an amazing stepmom, and it's gonna be your job Docs. To pay that back. So to answer your question, what did I think? I just kinda knew. That's what god wants me to do. He wants me to be a father, and he wants Daughters and to speak their worth and value into them. And it doesn't matter if they have my blood or DNA or not. Dog.

    Kelly K [00:04:47]:
    That's what's amazing about God's family is that he picks and chooses. He puts you together for a purpose, on purpose. And so, to be honest with you, I was very Doug. And happy about the task at hand.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:57]:
    So one of the things that you had talked about was that Brennan and you had the build that relationship because she saw you as that enemy. And there are other dads out there that are stepping into relationships or they're stepping into the That rule of being a step parent, maybe a little bit scared about that as well because of stepping into that, not knowing what to expect. Doc. Talk to me about what you had to do with Brennan to be able to heal that relationship, to build that relationship, to be able to get to a point the Where she didn't see you as that enemy, but saw you as a father.

    Kelly K [00:05:36]:
    Absolutely. Domino's. You know, here's the thing. Because I I get it. It it can be intimidating when you come into a relationship and there's already kids there, and you're not the father. Man, I get it. Dom. The first thing that you have to remember and the first thing that I tried to keep on the front of my mind is that I chose them.

    Kelly K [00:05:52]:
    They didn't choose me. So a lot of times, we can get into these relationships Dom. Because we love the mom, we love the woman, and then the kids don't really reciprocate that. Well, they didn't choose this, so you need to remember that. So there needs to be a Doubt. Ton of love, a ton of mercy, and a ton of grace for those children because this is brand new to them too, and they didn't do anything wrong to deserve this. They didn't pick you, the So you need to come in with as much grace as you can. So, you know, I let her be herself.

    Kelly K [00:06:18]:
    I let her air her frustration. I let her say and do what she needs to do. I mean, within reason. I'm still gonna be the father, and I'm still gonna keep things in line. But at the same time, I gave her space, Docs. And I let her talk about it. I let her tell me how she felt because the truth is I knew because of the relationship I've had with my stepmom that there's gonna come a time in the future Doc. Where she realizes who the dad is.

    Kelly K [00:06:41]:
    Yeah. I may not be the biological father, but over the next 20 years or so, Doc. She's gonna see me at every basketball game. She's gonna see me every single day. I'm gonna be the one paying for her supplies for school. I'm gonna be the one taking care of what and and there's gonna come a day where it's gonna Dog. And she's gonna say, oh my gosh. I missed it.

    Kelly K [00:06:59]:
    I didn't understand then, but I understand now. And it was when that day came for me, it was so amazing. Dog. And what's really cool now is that Brennan and I are best friends. We are the closest out of all my kids, she and I. Matter of fact, just a couple nights ago, we went to dad daughter date. I took her the dinner. We went shopping.

    Kelly K [00:07:15]:
    We went to a movie, and that's just something we love to do together. We have an extremely close and tight relationship now, but Dog. The only reason that we are able to have that is because I allowed her a ton a ton of mercy and grace at the beginning because I knew She didn't choose this. I'm choosing this, and I need to let her develop and come into this on her own. If we come in and try to make them feel awful and tell them how horrible they are for being that way, They don't understand that, and all you're gonna do is divide your family even more, and you're gonna put gaps and drive wedges Dog. Between everyone. So, really, it's just you've got to love them on their level because they're not able to love you at your level yet, and it's just that understanding that's really gonna help bridge that gap.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:56]:
    The I really appreciate you sharing that. Now I talked to a lot of dads that have daughters. One of the things that I hear from a lot of dads is a fear. The And in the fear for you might have been a little bit different because you're stepping into being a stepdad and dad to a existing family. But the A lot of dads say that there's specifically some fear to raising daughters specifically. What would you say has been your biggest fear In raising daughters.

    Kelly K [00:08:24]:
    Oh, man. You know, I think my biggest fear is sending them out in the world with a feeling of being undervalued. Doc. Especially when you you come in as a step parent, they already have this sense of reject rejection. They're already gonna be carrying that around that Dog. My dad, for whatever reason, he left. And I get it, you know, from being from a divorced family as well as I carried around that weight Dog. Forever of what did I do? Why didn't you want me? How come you didn't love me when that's not really the case? So my fear was coming in to this.

    Kelly K [00:08:54]:
    Dog. They have this feeling of rejection from their own father. Whether it's validated or not, they're still gonna carry it. I didn't want them to leave the house Dog. At 18, 19, 20 years old still carrying that, that was probably my biggest fear is that I want them to make sure that they know who they are, who god says about them, and that they are worth so much that they don't have to just go give themselves to the 1st person that that wants them because they don't feel any value. That's the last thing I want. Was another daughter that's a statistic the of teenage pregnancy or or just somebody that that just allows themselves to be used. That breaks my heart to see girls and women like that, and that's what I didn't want to put out into the world.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:31]:
    The Now one of the things that is always interesting for me because as I said, I've got 2 daughters myself. The You've got 5 kids, and every parent of multiple kids has to be very intentional Dog. About what they're doing to build those relationships because every child is completely different, and the You have to understand what those differences are. So talk to me about what did you have to do to build those the Relationships uniquely with every child to be able to be the dad that you wanted to be.

    Kelly K [00:10:07]:
    For sure. Well, I mean, again, the Grace, man. If I gotta come back to 1 word over and over, it's gonna be grace. It's understanding each child is different just like you said. They're not all gonna receive love the same. They're not all gonna receive no discipline the same. So it's really spending time getting adjusted to each child, learning their personality, what they enjoy. So what I would do is, you know, with with Brennan, you Dog.

    Kelly K [00:10:28]:
    Know, she loves to go to movies, so something I would do special is just make sure I would take time out to to take her to a movie, to take her to dinner. That's what she really enjoys. My son, Chase, Dog. Also my stepson, which I'm referring to them as step kids to you. I've never referred to them as step kids in front of their face or to them not one single time. That's another thing. If the coming into a relationship with kids, do all you can to make them feel like like they are yours. Whether they're calling you dad or not, you refer to them as your kids.

    Kelly K [00:10:56]:
    I'm telling you that does something their self esteem. But so just when I was getting to know them, I knew that's what she liked. Chase, on the other hand, he doesn't like to go do movies and stuff like that. Dog. Would have to find other things that he enjoyed. Or if if Avery likes to get gifts, you know, I'll buy her something and bring it to her. It's really just understanding each child is different, what is their love language, and then try to communicate with them on that level. That is gonna be so big.

    Kelly K [00:11:20]:
    What we can do, though, as adults and as parents is that the We want to love and speak to them the way that we want to be loved and spoken to. And we don't realize sometimes that that can actually be very damaging if their the Love language is quality time, and they wanna spend time with you, but yours is gifts, and you just show up with gifts all the time. Man, that's great for you. You feel like you're really knocking out of the park, but really all they wanted was Doc. Go to a movie or go to the park or just spend some time. And now that I feel neglected or less valuable to you because you're not the time with them when, really, in your mind, you went above and beyond. Right? You love to buy gifts, so you're showing them love. But it's not about what you want.

    Kelly K [00:11:57]:
    Dog. What they need. So it's really spending time getting to know them. I mean, our our generation has this horrible problem of just handing kids a phone or an iPad and tell them to go away. The Don't bother me. Go be on this device. We don't even know our kids. We wouldn't know how to parent them or love them or correct them properly because we don't even know who they are.

    Kelly K [00:12:14]:
    The We need to actually spend time getting to know them, and your kids are awesome people. They're amazing. Spend time with them. You will be the with the things that they say, the things that they know, the things that they're picking up on, and it gives you so much insight into their lives and into how Don. To be the correct parent for them, we just ignore that so many times, and then we wonder why we can't relate to our own kids. And, really, for a lot of us, it's our own fault at times.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:37]:
    The Definitely so true, and it makes me think back to my own kids and and trying to better understand who they are. And I've only got 2. So the Being able to have 5 at at very different ages is definitely a challenge. Now talk to me about about that because the The way that you have to interact, the way that you have to father your 2 year old is gonna be very different than the Your interactions with Brennan. And so having the that very diverse age range of kids and wide age range of kids, the How do you see yourself fathering in a different way, parenting in a different way, and how do you maintain that?

    Kelly K [00:13:15]:
    That's a good question. You know, we were pretty intentional About letting the 3 older kids get a little older before my wife and I had children together only because I had this fear the If I have another child, I don't want to love my biological children more than the other 3. Yeah. I mean, there's there's a love there that that it it just it is what it is. You're gonna love your own child different than your stepchildren. There's nothing wrong with that. It's just that the eternal nature, you you know? But we can't let that be seen to those other children. We I don't want them to feel that way.

    Kelly K [00:13:51]:
    So the We were intentional about letting them get a little bit older first before we even tried just because I didn't want that. So that was part of it. So by the time that we had the Jackson Jett. The other 3 were a little a bit older. They understood. We were pretty established with our relationship, so it was okay. Yeah. It it's been a big difference the Raising an 8 and a 2 year old now versus a 23 year old, 19, and an 18 year old.

    Kelly K [00:14:15]:
    And, really, it's it's the Trying to keep it in perspective. Just because I've changed, I can't treat these 2 too much differently because I don't wanna paint some picture Docs. Sure. It's my older kids that I love them less or differently. So it's it's really a a juggling act of just trying to be consistent. However, if you will train your kids up the In in the way that that God tells us to and you follow the bible, it's all gonna be pretty much the same. It's gonna look pretty much Docs. Yes.

    Kelly K [00:14:40]:
    You're gonna grow and you're gonna change and you're gonna do things differently. But if we're consistent in just honoring god with his word, You should see some consistency in the way that we raise our children as well. Right? We're still installing godly principles into them. We're still speaking value into them. Dog. We're still letting them know who god has called them to be. So you have this element of it all looking the same even though is it the same? No. Not at all.

    Kelly K [00:15:05]:
    I've changed. You know, when I was in my twenties parenting, it looks a lot different than me in my forties parenting. So it's really just trying to find that consistent thread and make Docs. Sure that all of your kids and your entire family sees what you're doing. That way, they have some grace for you too, understanding that, hey. You're growing. You're changing. And I I'm just very open with my kids.

    Kelly K [00:15:23]:
    There's nothing I won't talk about. And I tell them, yeah. I did this with you. I'm sorry I did it that way. I was young and dumb. I'm doing it this way now. I wish I would the done that with you, and they they have grace for you. I'm telling you, if you will be open and honest with your kids about any obviously, there's some things you don't wanna Dog.

    Kelly K [00:15:38]:
    Talk to your kids about. But I'm just saying, on the whole, talk to them like they're real people, not somebody below you or beneath you. Give them the respect that you want given to you. Doc. And, man, they will have grace for you when it comes to parenting because they see how much you love them and that you're really pouring into them. And so many parents don't do that Doug. Today, and it's just a cultural thing that we just kinda push our kids to the side. And, man, it breaks my heart because your kids are amazing people.

    Kelly K [00:16:03]:
    I've said it before, but I'll keep saying it again. Your kids are awesome.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:06]:
    The So with 3 daughters, it's not always going to be easy. You talked about one aspect of your experience in being a father to a daughter that that was not the easiest the When you first were in the lives of your first 3 kids, talk to me about or you with raising daughters, what's been the hardest part the Being a father to a daughter.

    Kelly K [00:16:26]:
    You know, the the hardest part, it's just gonna keep coming back to that value. Now was it the hardest part because I feared it Dog. And because I kept thinking about it and fearing it, that that's what I had to deal with, or is that just what all girls go through? I don't know. But the hardest part has been in the that value into them. I watched Brennan go through high school, date some real, quote, unquote, winners the That just really broke my heart that she was with them, and I saw the way these boys are treating her. And I just had to keep trying to tell her, Brennan, you're worth more than this. This is who you are. And I kept trying to show her in the word of god.

    Kelly K [00:16:58]:
    Dog. This is who god says you are, and you're valuable, and you're worth more than this. It's worth stating yourself for somebody, and and it took man, let me just give some hope to some of you. The If you are watching your daughters make these bad mistakes, there is hope. There is hope. Keep speaking truth into them. Listen. It's not your job to change anybody.

    Kelly K [00:17:16]:
    Only Jesus can. Dog. It's not your job to save anybody. Only Jesus can. Your job is to keep speaking the truth and showing them who Jesus is in their life. And that's what I kept doing with Brennan through each boy. Doc. Every time she would come to me crying about some guy that cheated on her or did her wrong, I just kept instilling that value of who god says the She is.

    Kelly K [00:17:33]:
    And I'm so happy to tell you that 23 years old, she'll be 24 next week. She is engaged to the most amazing, godly man that we are so the that he is about to join our family. We are thrilled to have him a part of our family, but we had to watch her go through terrible relationship after terrible relationship until Docs. She finally figured out her value and her worth, but she did figure it out. So, yes, that was hard. Yes, it was Dog. Scary. But, man, it's so good to know that the bible is true to its word, and that when you train up a child in the way of the lord when they're older, they will not depart from it.

    Kelly K [00:18:06]:
    Dog. And to see her marrying a godly man means so much to me, and I'm so excited and so happy for her. But it did go through struggles of us having to take her bedroom door off Dom. For a year, having some hard conversations and and groundings and dealing with broken hearts and but, man, keep speaking the value. Even if they don't Docs. See it. Keep going till you're blue in the face because eventually, it's gonna quicken them. They're gonna remember your words.

    Kelly K [00:18:29]:
    They're gonna remember what you said. And, man, to see that it it worked out and it the Panned out the way God said it would is just man, it's beautiful to me. But that's the hardest part is just getting them to understand their value. There's something about Docs. Being girls and women and guys too, but I think women deal with it more of just understanding their their own worth and really who they are and who god made them to be. That's just the way the devil really attacks women, and it's our job as men of God, especially godly fathers and husbands, is to keep instilling that value not only into our daughters, but into our wives Dogs as well.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:00]:
    So I mentioned that you are a pastor, you are a staff pastor at Limitless 405 Church in Oklahoma. The And one of the things that you have really done to connect not only with your own parishioners, but the Even broader to a much broader audience is bring forth scripture, bring forth the bible, bring forth the religion and spirituality to social media, and you have attacked that on many different platforms, but specifically the On TikTok. And I guess going through becoming a pastor yourself, I don't know if you would have ever thought That this is where you would end up. Maybe you did. But talk to me about being a pastor and being able to the Share what you're sharing now to a I'm gonna say a young demographic because there's not a ton of people our age the that are on TikTok. There's some, but a much larger of the audience is very young. And but you're relating to them, and you're bringing a message that the Has to be relatable because of the numbers that you're seeing. So talk to me about that and maybe what you had to do to be able to to the change the way that you thought about preaching, about being a pastor, to be able to bring this to a broader audience like that.

    Kelly K [00:20:24]:
    You know, first, Docs. I'll just be honest with you. I did not want to get on TikTok. I don't even like first off, I just thought it was people dancing. Alright? And I was like, oh, well, I don't wanna I can't even dance anyway. Why do I need a TikTok? Duck. But my wife for years was like, Kelly, you need to get on TikTok. And, god started speaking to me, and I just knew he wanted me to get on TikTok.

    Kelly K [00:20:41]:
    So when god starts telling you, the You can ignore your wife, but you can't ignore God. Right? So, eventually, I said, alright. So, actually, it was a year ago. It was last December when I got on TikTok. Here's the deal, though. The I see social media as the mission field, and I think everybody should. You know, we we send people overseas, and we raise all this money for missions, and we're sending people to go preach. The But understand, the Internet, your phone is a mission field in itself.

    Kelly K [00:21:06]:
    You can reach people from all over the world right there on your phone. The The truth is people are holding their phones, scrolling all day long watching videos and content. It's just how it is. And you can have people that get mad saying, oh, this the The world isn't what it used to be, and I wish these kids weren't doing you can get mad all day long, but it's not gonna change anything. You can get mad or you can do something about it. And the said, you know what? I'm gonna do something about it. I see this as a mission field. If everybody's sitting there watching videos and scrolling, I'm just gonna put something in front of them that's worth watching.

    Kelly K [00:21:34]:
    So here's the deal. How do you keep yeah. Because I'm I'm old. I get it. Fair enough. How do you get a younger audience to engage? I mean, I'm getting between 23,000,000 views a week on Domino's. The only way that's possible is, for 1, you need to understand that this generation, they're looking for real, and they want real.

    Kelly K [00:21:52]:
    They recognize real. So if you get on there trying to be fake, trying to be somebody that you're not, they're gonna notice it right away. Nobody's gonna watch your content. Dog. So for 1, I've never tried to pretend to be something that I'm not. 2, I get on there, and I just answer questions that people have that I think Pastors aren't really talking about. You know, I've done videos on, you know, why do we go to church, how do we know Dog. This is the right religion.

    Kelly K [00:22:16]:
    What does god say about divorce? Do dogs go to heaven? I mean, I've touched on every single topic that you can think of Dog. Because that's what real people wanna know. They have real questions, especially people that are afraid to go to church because they feel judged. They have all these questions, and they don't know where to go for these answers. Dog. So I'm just giving them biblical truth in a way that they can understand because I just speak like it's me and you. And I never the Understood. When I was graduating seminary, I had classmates that would go and preach these big sermons using all this the Greek and Hebrew and these big words.

    Kelly K [00:22:50]:
    Like, they were trying to flex on everybody, and I never understood that, like like showing off their knowledge. Dog. I thought that we went to seminary so that we could understand complex subjects and then make them easy for others to understand. I thought that was the point. Dog. So what I do is I try to take these tough subjects that the Bible talks about, and then I try to find a way that anybody at any age, Dog. Any race, any level can connect to, can relate to, because that's what we're supposed to be, all things to all people. Right? We're not supposed to be a stumbling block.

    Kelly K [00:23:20]:
    We're I'm not if I just got on TikTok the started using all my Greek and Hebrew, trying to make these flashy messages. No one's gonna watch them. But the fact that I look like everybody else, I sound like everybody else, And I'm giving you what you want to know in a way that you can understand it. People connect with that, and they keep watching. You know, I I do scriptures that everyone have read a 1000000 times,

    Kelly K [00:23:41]:
    I'm just giving a fresh perspective on it because I'm making it fit today's society. I'm not changing the word of god. How did Jesus teach? He told stories. Docs. He used things that people understood from their day and age, and that's the exact same thing that I'm doing. And it's just working. Now I gotta give God all the credit the Who am I? Or I'm just some crazy looking dude on the Internet. God is doing all the work.

    Kelly K [00:24:02]:
    I'm just trying to be obedient. So that's how I got started and how I've been doing this thing.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:07]:
    So I also talked about the fact that you also have taken those messages and you've become an author as well. And you've got a brand new book that is gonna be coming out very Docs soon called Think About That for a Minute, volume 2, 40 day 40 day devotional for a fresh perspective. Talk to me about the Not only this book, but talk to me about what led you into wanting to move into writing. I've been an author before. Door. I've written I've written a book myself. It's not easy.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:39]:
    It it takes a lot of time, a lot of patience, a lot of effort. The So was that calling that made you say, I need to bring these messages out to the world, and what is now bringing you Doc. To writing this new book to help people in a different way.

    Kelly K [00:24:54]:
    I never thought I was gonna be an author. I never wanted to be an author. Docs. I barely graduated 8th grade English class, man. But it was in 2016 when I released my first book, Reckless Love Revolution, and the only reason I wrote it is the god laid it so heavy on my heart to write that book that I didn't know what else to do. So I wrote that book, put it out. It did alright. It sold the Between 510,000 copies, something like that.

    Kelly K [00:25:16]:
    I mean, that's over a 5 years span. And then after I wrote reckless love, I wrote get lit, say lit, Docs. Which is about how to get on fire for Jesus and not burn out. I wrote that one because as I I'm a full time traveling evangelist. I'm the associate pastor in our church, but Dog. 3 weeks out of the month, I travel and preach to other churches. And what I noticed around the country, everywhere I went, is I was seeing burnt out Christians Dog. Everywhere I went, and it was breaking my heart.

    Kelly K [00:25:41]:
    So I wrote this book about getting on fire and staying on fire because the truth is we can live on fire 247. We don't have to burn out. So Dog. I write those 2 books. They did okay. Like I said, a few 1,000 copies. Nothing crazy. Then I start praying, alright, god.

    Kelly K [00:25:56]:
    What Dog. Do you want me to write next? And I really felt like God was saying, Kelly, the words of Kelly Kaye aren't gonna change anybody's life. The It's my word that changes people's life, so feed my sheep. And I said, okay. And then I remembered Psalms 1 1 through 3 that Docs. Says that if we meditate on God's word day and night, we will prosper in all seasons of our lives. Here's the problem. Most Christians aren't prospering.

    Kelly K [00:26:18]:
    Why? Because they're not spending time in the word. The truth is we live in the most biblically illiterate generation of all time. People do not know what the Bible says because Noah. Nobody's reading it for themselves. So I really felt like God was calling me to feed the sheep, meaning give them his word. So I said, alright. I'll write this 40 day devotional. Now I was finishing it up right at the time that God called me to get on TikTok.

    Kelly K [00:26:40]:
    So I've been on TikTok for about 3 months. I had about 50,000 followers. The I released that book. Now my other 2 books, like I said, did about 5 to 10000 copies each, something like that over, you know, span of 5 years. Dog. I was expecting this one to do the same. But as the TikTok following kept growing, at the end of every video, I would just say, hey. If you like this message, check out my new book.

    Kelly K [00:27:00]:
    It's a 40 day devotional. The That book started selling like crazy. Like, it started selling around 200 copies a day simply because of the views on TikTok. Doc. And I knew when I wrote that, I called it volume 1 because I just had a feeling god wanted me to write more of those, and now I totally see why. The response from that the 1st devotional. And I I call it think about that for a minute based on Psalms 1 because all you're doing is meditating on god's word. That means thinking about it.

    Kelly K [00:27:26]:
    That's all it is. Dog. I'm giving you a scripture each day to think about and meditate on so you get the word in you. The response from that book has been insane. People saying they love the fresh the perspectives and and the way that I break down scripture and and tell stories. So naturally, writing another one was just the The next thing to happen. So it's completely finished. It's just going through the editing and the finalization period right now, volume 2.

    Kelly K [00:27:51]:
    Dog. And I think we've already told probably close to 500 preorders for that book. So I I cannot wait to see what God is gonna do with it. But, man, just seeing people every day write Docs. That they've given their life to Jesus, so they got on fire for Jesus again or rededicated their lives simply because they got in that book and it the It just helped them with their walk with God. Man, that's what it should be anyway. You don't need my book. All I did was give you a scripture, and I helped you meditate on it daily.

    Kelly K [00:28:17]:
    All I did was help you fulfill the Bill, the promise God gave to you that if you will get into his word and meditate on it day night, you'll prosper in every season of your life. It's nothing that I did. The I just gave you the word and made it simple. I'm telling you. It blesses me that this book has done so good. And what even blesses me more than anything was that Docs. It wasn't anything that I did. I just gave them God's word.

    Kelly K [00:28:38]:
    You know, I wrote 2 books trying to knock it out of the park myself, and they were wildly mediocre. And then here, I just Give god's word, and it's a huge hit. And it's like, god, you're so good. You you know exactly what people need. They don't need me. They need you, the that's what I give them. So that's why I'm so pumped about this new book about to come out because it's just more of what already worked, more of God's word.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:59]:
    So as you think about the future, what's next?

    Kelly K [00:29:02]:
    Dog. For me, all I wanna do is I wanna keep traveling, and I wanna keep preaching. I wanna keep writing I I just want to get Jesus in front of as many the people as I can. It just there's a passion. It just burns inside of me. I want to see people get set free. I want people to understand the freedom that Jesus paid for on the cross and that eternity doesn't start in heaven. It starts here on earth, and you can have an abundant life here.

    Kelly K [00:29:28]:
    We don't have to wait till we die to have the blessings that god's got for us. I want people to step in to the amazing freedom and just the relationship Docs. They can have with Jesus. And, I'm not slowing down. So, I mean, my calendar is already filling up for next year. I'm gonna keep making videos every single day. I'm gonna keep writing books. Dog.

    Kelly K [00:29:46]:
    I have plans to go to all 5 regions of Africa this next year, to go to Tokyo, to go to Australia. Man, I'm just gonna put Jesus in front of as many people as I can. That's what's next Me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:55]:
    Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5 where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Kelly K [00:30:02]:
    Let's go.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:02]:
    In one word, the What is fatherhood? Love. When was a time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Kelly K [00:30:10]:
    The day that the Britton and I were driving in the truck, and she said, I finally see that you've been my dad all along. And that was just Dog. My heart slowed up. It was just the greatest moment remembering all the pain and trials we went through while she was growing up to see that doc. We finally had the relationship that I'd wanted since day 1. That was it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:30]:
    Now if I was to have your kids here, you know, I was talking to them, how would they describe you as a dad?

    Kelly K [00:30:36]:
    They would say that I the think I'm funny. He thinks he's funny. That's what they would say. And they think I am too. They just won't let you know that. But I'm I'm hilarious. I got the best dad jokes. Docs.

    Kelly K [00:30:45]:
    Okay.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:45]:
    Are any dad jokes good?

    Kelly K [00:30:47]:
    Every single one of them, I tell it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:50]:
    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Kelly K [00:30:52]:
    My stepmom. Knowles. She passed away a couple years ago at 55, but I still think about her every single day when it comes to being a parent. She showed me what it's like Dog. To love. No matter what, she showed me what it looks like to be a Jesus follower. She showed me what it looks like to love like Jesus. She's been my biggest inspiration as a parent for sure.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:11]:
    The Now you've talked about a lot of different things today, things that you've learned along the way, things that have helped you to be a better dad, and you've given a lot of piece of advice. As we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Kelly K [00:31:23]:
    Give grace, give mercy, and instill value. If if you will do those things right there, if you will give your kids grace, show them mercy, and you will teach them who they are, the I'm telling you when they grow up and I've I've got kids that are 2, and I've got kids that are 24, so I've seen it play out. If you will do that, you will have some godly the Adults, godly kids that grow into amazing godly adults. And what you want is for your kids to do the same thing with their kids and sell value, Doc. Show mercy and give grace and just keep that cycle going. That way, your kids aren't gonna have to break off horrible generational curses that you pass down. The We get to choose what we pass on to our kids. Be intentional about it when they're little so you're not having to fix it later when they're adults.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:07]:
    Now, Kelly Kaye, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here for the your story. If people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

    Kelly K [00:32:14]:
    You can go to kellyk ministries.com. You can get my books there. You can find all my socials there. Honestly, you can Google Kelly Kaye Ministries or Kelly Kaye Preacher, and you will find more than you care to find about me. I promise you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:28]:
    Well, Kelly Kaye, I just wanna say thank you again for your time, your passion, and for sharing your own journey as a father today.

    Kelly K [00:32:35]:
    It's an honor. Thank you for Daughters. Having me. I really enjoyed our time together and hope we get to do it again.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:39]:
    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. And the fatherhood insider is full of resources and information the that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step by step road maps, the and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out at fathering together .org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:26]:
    Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters the And be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:38]:
    We're all in the same boat, the and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. The Dogs. Presents. Bring your a game because those kids are growing fast. The time the just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, Domino's. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Insights on Fatherhood, Loneliness, and Parenting 8 Children from JP DeGance of Communio

    Insights on Fatherhood, Loneliness, and Parenting 8 Children from JP DeGance of Communio

    · Dads With Daughters

    Fatherhood is a unique journey that provides an opportunity to shape the lives of our daughters. In a recent episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, JP DeGance, the president of Communio, shared valuable insights on fatherhood, relationships, loneliness, and the importance of community in raising daughters to be strong and independent women.

    Impactful Moments of Fatherhood

    In the podcast, DeGance shared his experience as a father to eight children, highlighting the significant impact of fatherhood on his life. He emphasized how his relationship with his daughters has shaped his perspective on parenting. He touched upon the realization of a different connection and relationship with his daughters compared to his sons.

    Understanding the Unique Bonds

    DeGance discussed the importance of forming unique relationships with each of his children despite their different personalities and age ranges. He highlighted the significance of spending quality time with each child individually and fostering connections that are tailored to their individual needs and interests. This approach emphasizes the importance of understanding and supporting each child in a personalized manner.

    Challenges of Raising Daughters

    The discussion delved into the challenges of raising daughters in the modern world, particularly in terms of relationships, healthy partnerships, and the impact of societal changes on their well-being. DeGance shed light on the implications of the current cultural trends on daughters' perceptions of relationships and the importance of guiding them to discern healthy and meaningful connections.

    Insights on Loneliness and Community

    DeGance's organization, Communio, has conducted extensive research on loneliness, uncovering concerning trends in societal well-being. The study revealed alarming insights about the epidemic of loneliness and its impact across different demographic groups. Particularly, the podcast emphasized the importance of community and mentorship among men, highlighting the profound impact of having connections outside the family unit to combat loneliness and reinforce purpose in life.

    Cultivating Meaningful Relationships

    One of the key takeaways from DeGance's insights was the emphasis on cultivating healthy, purpose-driven relationships within the family and the broader community. He stressed the significance of modeling a parent-centered home rather than a child-centered one, highlighting the role of the marriage relationship as the foundation for trust and social trust in children.

    Guiding Fathers to Be Present

    DeGance shared invaluable advice for fathers, encouraging them to live life with their children and actively engage in their lives. This guidance underscored the importance of being present and actively involved in children's lives, especially during their formative years.

    In conclusion, JP DeGance's insights provide a comprehensive understanding of the impact of fatherhood, relationships, and community in raising strong daughters. His perspectives on building unique connections with each child, navigating the challenges of parenting, and the significance of community involvement offer valuable lessons for fathers striving to raise empowered and resilient daughters.

    As fathers, our role in shaping the lives of our daughters extends beyond mere presence. It encompasses creating a supportive and purpose-driven environment, fostering meaningful connections, and nurturing strong, independent women. Through prioritizing father-daughter relationships, active involvement, and community engagement, we can contribute to the holistic development of our daughters and empower them to navigate the complexities of the modern world with confidence and resilience.

    By embracing the insights shared by JP DeGance, fathers worldwide can deepen their understanding of their pivotal role in raising strong, empowered daughters and actively contribute to their daughters' journey toward a fulfilling and purposeful life.

    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads With Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad who wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most are figuring it out as they go along. The Fatherhood Insider is full of valuable resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, an interactive forum, step-by-step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts but, more importantly, with dads like you. So check it out today!

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:

    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:

    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Docs. Really excited to be back with you again this week. Every week, I love sitting down with you and being able to talk to you about this journey that we're all on called fatherhood. And it is a unique journey in many ways, but it doesn't have to be. There are so many ways in which we can learn and grow from the offered from the people that are around us, from other fathers, and this show is all about connecting you with other people's experiences to be able to help you to be the father that you wanna be and to help you to raise those strong independent women the that you have in your homes. Every week, I love bringing you different guests, different dads, and different other individuals with resources that can help you to do just that. And this week, we got another great guest with us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:12]:

    JP DeGance is with us today, and JP is the president of Communio. He is also the founder and president. I should say, let me step back. JP DeGance is with us today, and JP is the president and founder of Communio. And we're gonna talk more about the organization and some of the things that they've been finding inside, like, a recent study that just came out about loneliness. And we're also gonna be talking about the fact that he's a father of 8. And I was talking to him before we started today and said that it just kinda blows my mind because I think 2 is enough for me, but 8 is a whole new game. So I'm excited to have him on. JP, thanks so much for being here.

    JP DeGance [00:01:52]:

    Hey, Christopher. Thank you for having me. It's great to be here with you. Thank you so much.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:57]:

    It is my pleasure having you here today. I love that we're able to talk about fatherhood and Communio. I guess, 1st and foremost, I wanna turn the clock back in time. I love being able to have this power when when I talk to people and being able to turn the clock back. And I know you've got 8 kids. I'd like to go back to that 1st moment. That first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter, what was going through your head?

    JP DeGance [00:02:20]:

    You know, for us, it was number 3. And I'll tell you. It was funny. I told my wife brings this up to me all the time. She says, I see, oh, I'm gonna treat, you know, my kids the same. I'm gonna, you know, my son's daughter's gonna be the same. And then, I had my daughter, and I realized, we have a different connection, a different relationship. And I love my girls.

    JP DeGance [00:02:42]:

    I've I've we're we're all tied up. Chris for four boys and four girls. It's about as evenly distributed as you can. But being able to bond with my daughters and having daughters, I'm confident, makes me a better a better man. It causes me to want to be more in comparison to my sons, who I'll rough up. I relate a bit differently to my daughters, and it's been beautiful, not great. And my wife has called me out on it quite a number of times that you don't really treat them the same. Later on, I got a quote from my father That I love. He's like, you treat all of your children equally.

    JP DeGance [00:03:18]:

    You don't treat them the same. And I think that there's a lot of a lot of wisdom in that.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:23]:

    I love that. Now a lot of dads that I talk to I talked to a lot of dads over the years, and a lot of dads say to me that having that daughter in their life. Is not only an amazing thing, but it also brings some fear with it as well. And I guess for you, As you look at the fact that you have eight kids four girls and four boys, what has been your biggest fear in raising daughters?

    JP DeGance [00:03:47]:

    Nobles. Because of my work, and you mentioned some research that we've been doing, I run an org and a ministry that really seeks to equip churches to champion and encourage healthy relationships, marriage, fatherhood, and healthy fatherhood. And as I've gotten into the data, you can't help but understand That there is a retreat from marriage that's occurring that's gonna affect our sons and daughters, and that means something, especially for our daughters and how they grow and Dom. And and how they discern healthy relationships. I think the culture has cheapened relationships and meaningful relationships. And so coming alongside my daughters to help form them is so that they can know what the healthy guy looks like and how to avoid problematic relationships and toxic relationships, and then form friend groups, right? That reinforces that. Right? My mom used to say, you know, you are. I'm sure I'm not the only one whose mom said this. Right? You are who your friends are, who you associate with.

    JP DeGance [00:04:51]:

    You often reflect in terms of your personality and who you are. So those are just some of those things that, you know, recognizing. You know, the reality is is even at Conley, and you think about college, no, today's college is now 60% women, 40% men, and in the last, most recent most recent class. And what that actually mathematically means as a dad is it's gonna be actually harder mathematically for our daughters to find a guy who is of historically speaking woman marries someone of the same academic attainment level. And that means, if her daughters pursue college, it'll become harder to identify someone just because it just becomes a math problem. These are just some of the things I think about.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:30]:

    Now with eight kids, I know that even with twoo kids, each child is very different. I'm sure that with eight kids, you've got many different personalities and many different perspectives. And as you father 8 children, you have to build those unique relationships with each one of those kids in different ways. How do you do that, and how do you balance being able to build those unique relationships with each of your children, especially based on the age range that we're talking about?

    JP DeGance [00:06:04]:

    We spend a lot of time together, a lot of our social time as a family. And the kids enjoy being around each other. These kids we, we fight. The kids fight. Right? The kids argue, and that's all normal. But I will say our 18-year-old, our 17-year-old, and our 15-year-old are strange in that they don't complain when it's family time and we're Doing something social and fun. That said, it's it you're absolutely right. It's critical to find that time where you can spend time together individually with dog.

    JP DeGance [00:06:34]:

    A child. So I do a number of things. I travel for work, not infrequently, and so I try to bring one of my kids with me on a work trip Periodically so that there it's just with dad. If I'm going out, I have to go to Montana periodically, and that's a fun place to go and drive around and see the natural wonder of that heart of the country, and I'll do that. I've I've had to go on trips to Denver. I'll take one child. And one of the things that we'll do is try to do different types of rites of passage kind of experiences with our with a kid with our children when they hit a certain age, particularly, like, right before puberty, you know, they go on a trip. With me.

    JP DeGance [00:07:10]:

    It's a son who goes with me, and the daughter goes with mom. And we make a trip away, and we do a bit of the bird and the bees, conversations and, you know, how life is gonna be changing and really try to lay the groundwork there. Then when they graduate high school, we've done this once Now. We'll be doing it again this summer. We've taken our oldest. We've just selected that point to be just a trip with an experience that we just do with a high school graduate and celebrate that moment, let them know how important that moment was and their achievement and and and, obviously, in our as a family of 8, really appreciate that time when it's just me and them Or me and my wife and my child. And so those are some of the ways. And then you, you know, every child, you're absolutely right.

    JP DeGance [00:07:57]:

    Every child is different. Right? They need different things. Okay. I've grown to notice that my sons and I are studying this area; they want to know If they're competent, they wanna know. If I think that they're competent, they're they're they're effective. They can do they can do things. And so frequently, that's part of how I reinforce the My sons and my daughters so frequently wanna know if, and they range again from age 4 to age 15. They wanna know if they are actually beautiful. Are they being reinforced? I think they're certainly reinforcing your self-image and, Letting her know that Dad knows that they're they're a beautiful young lady, beautiful inside and out, and that's important in a way.

    JP DeGance [00:08:39]:

    They react differently, my sons and daughters, on these things, and I've seen that as really important for my daughters.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:45]:

    We talked about fears and how raising kids can be smooth sailing. It can also be challenging at times. What's been the hardest part for you In being a father to a daughter?

    JP DeGance [00:08:57]:

    Yeah. The hardest part of being a father to a daughter. My kids have struggled with dyslexia, sons and daughters. And realized that the traditional school model for us wasn't wasn't working for my daughters. What it wasn't working for my sons. I ended up having a series of conversations with a businessman that I thought very highly of, and he helped me open my eyes to thinking differently about education, particularly educating my daughters. Right? In the end, it led us to decide to alter what we were doing. We ended up Moving into a homeschool model where we could allocate capital for the kind of tutoring they needed and the kind of pace in the areas they needed.

    JP DeGance [00:09:40]:

    And that's been a really good thing. I think mom is really good at handling things like ways to dress and what have you. And so I don't have to do much of that. My wife is all over the stuff, and the and the girls, That's been a good thing for us, and the girls, I think, have, with some reluctance, taken to mom's guidance on such Dutch Things. Mom dresses well, and so they see that you can dress beautifully elegantly, and you can also dress modestly in those ways.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:12]:

    I mentioned that you were the president and CEO of Communio, and you sort of started to talk a little bit about what Communio is and what it focuses on. Tell me more about Communio, and then we'll talk about some of the research. I wanna hear more about the organization first.

    JP DeGance [00:10:28]:

    Sure. So we function like as a business to business, a b to b, so to speak, as a business model. So our customers always and everywhere, the local church. Okay. We equip the local church to evangelize through the renewal of healthy relationships, the Marriage, and the family. And a major part of, obviously, that is fatherhood. And so we do that through Coaching churches, training churches, and evidence-based strategies on relationship health. We do help produce No.

    JP DeGance [00:10:59]:

    A transformation in the mindset of pastors in the church is that investing in the strength of your marriage or your relationships is something everybody does. If you wanna be healthy, happy, and holy, no. And then that's what that's what one ought to do. And a big thing is part of that message is for men. Right? Heavily, on dads. If I love my children, One of the best ways for me to love my children is, whenever it's possible, to love the mother of my children more than my own children because when I do that, it spills over and has lifetime benefits on our children.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:33]:

    I mentioned the fact that your organization had been doing some research into loneliness. So talk to me about That and why your organization chose to start doing research on this topic.

    JP DeGance [00:11:46]:

    I've been startled like many of the Folks who've who've looked into space; we've got shortening lifespans. We are, as a country, when I was a kid. When you were a kid, people talk futurists saying, you know, maybe we're gonna live to a 100 or maybe a 110 in the future. It'll just be normal. No one ever thought 40 or 50 years ago that people would be short, living shorter and shorter lives. And that's that's where we are, particularly men as of recently, but it's also women. And we're heavily divergent from similar countries. So if you look at other countries of high wealth, we are having a sharp decline in our lifespan.

    JP DeGance [00:12:20]:

    That has a heavy relationship to the loneliness problem. In 2008, the first year in the United States, the surgeon general said that we had an epidemic of loneliness, and it's only increased. And so we work with our client churches to a small number of factors, no And one of those is loneliness, and there's something called the UCLA summary loneliness index. It's a 3 question tool that when you use it, depending on how you answer it, no If you score 6 or higher on it, you fit the public health definition of loneliness, which means your lifespan is basically the difference between dying in your the Mid-seventies to dying in your late fifties or, you know, right at sixty. Okay. And that's how significant it is. And and so.

    JP DeGance [00:13:03]:

    We wanted to make folks aware of what's going on with it. And, well, one of the things that stuck out sadly is some of the findings were it's not who you think Dog. Is lonely. Right? You would think it would make sense that it's the elderly and it's the widowed are the most likely to be lonely. And the reality is that the loneliest folks in the survey were the never married in their thirties and also the divorced in their thirties. Those were the two loneliest groups. They were lonelier than widows, and there was the loneliest group of widows were widows in their Fifties, which makes sense, and widowers and widows in their fifties, which makes sense. It's premature to have lost a spouse.

    JP DeGance [00:13:46]:

    That age, or maybe you're a recent empty nester, and so there's a major life change. But even still, someone who's 30, the 4-year-old who's never married, or 33 who's divorced. They're actually lonelier by a significant margin than those folks and Docs. Making sure, you know, when we talk to our client churches, like, this is something you need to be aware of. Right? Like, this is as a pastor, Doc. If you're talking about the importance of forming a heterogeneous community between singles and married, divorced and widowed, the Young and old. That should be a normal part of life in thinking through how to form those kinds of interlocking communities. The folks can have meaningful relationships and have the kind of purpose that flows from meaningful relationships that undo all of the horrible health effects of loneliness.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:34]:

    So, a part of the Organization that this podcast is all about is called Fathering Together, and we talk about the importance of building community. And this show is all about raising our kids. I think that things that you just said are things that we need to reinforce with our kids in many different ways. As your organization delves deeper into not only some of the causes and the groups that are being affected to raise the consciousness of society around us, it will be able to start making changes internally. But are there things that your organization may have identified that, as parents, we should be aware of To be able to reinforce with our own kids as they're getting older to help them not lead that lonely life the As they

    JP DeGance [00:15:22]:

    get older. Yeah. You know, first, it's critically important, and this is gonna sound to some listeners paradoxical. One of the most important things is not to build Not. A child-centered home, but a parent-centered home. And I mean that in the sense of whether there's a marriage in the home or you're parenting with a spouse, Dom. The most important relationship is the spouse. And when that happens, a child can actually feel safe and trust That our ability to form social trust, one of the big things that social scientists have uncovered is that our levels of social trust in America are in rapid decline.

    JP DeGance [00:15:55]:

    We first learned to trust others based on those most primal relationships with our parents. And then when we see it model the Father to the child, but then when the child sees the dad relating frequently to the spouse. And so what's key is to model a life where, no, you know, it's easy. Right? I've paid kids, but you can do this with two kids. You can revolve your entire life around youth sports, youth activities, academic competitiveness, anything that you want, whatever you want to turn fashion into the idol, I think. The reality is that when it's a child-centered home, You raise people who will become self-centered later. Okay? Because they see themselves, hey. The most important people in my life communicated that I was the most important person in my life.

    JP DeGance [00:16:48]:

    And then now I'm going out into the world, and I'm the most important person in my life. No. And the paradox of happiness is living for the other. We're wired deeply to live in some in a sacrificial way to not go out of our way for the other. That's what love is. And so I think a key in raising our daughter's dog. They see that we love their mothers and that we model the kinds of healthy friendships that should be in our lives. And then, obviously, that doesn't mean that you don't do your sports, and it doesn't mean that you don't want your child to be competitive and great at what they're doing.

    JP DeGance [00:17:25]:

    No. But rightly ordered is the key here that these things are held, intention. There's moderation in such things. So sometimes there is a hard decision that needs to be made that as a husband, right, I need it's maybe not the best thing for my marriage that I I don't see my wife For thirteen weekends in a row because we're doing travel sports every weekend. I'd not say that that being in a hyperbolic example. Right? And then if you're you're a single dad, okay, you're an unmarried dad, Then I think that that's important to model a life of moderation. Right? So that a child can see and live a life of moderation where the child is Nuts. Encouraged and supported by that relationship between father and daughter, if I can't trust that my dad's there for me, it spills over into lots of other areas of my life later as I grow up.

    JP DeGance [00:18:15]:

    And I can't then trust that a future person who pursues me, as a man pursuing your daughter in the future, It's harder for that daughter to trust in the relationship. It's harder for her to trust certain friendships or business in relationships Dog. So much of who we are is formed in our family of origin.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:34]:

    Appreciate that. Now, as you think about relationships with other men, In regard to the importance of having bonds with others as well, what is your study found about the importance of having those connections to people outside of your family that Can help you to stave off loneliness?

    JP DeGance [00:18:57]:

    Yeah. Look. I'm a huge fan. I'm a big believer in mentorship and community Among men. So I have had a friend group of other dads that range in age, that are ranged about a dozen years older than me and Dog. About a dozen years younger than me. And we're actually on a text thread together, and we'll text each other. We'll get together periodically, Socially, mostly, but sometimes we do, what you would consider a Christian small group activity, but it's certainly a mix.

    JP DeGance [00:19:27]:

    And I have benefited so much from just being pals with dads who have some kids who are Doubt. 10 years further ahead of the journey on me and being able to talk to him. Nothing structured and formal,, you know, being able to Go over for a barbecue and a beer and talk and talk about challenges of fatherhood and the Thinking of being thoughtful about forming our children is just incredibly important and incredibly important within the realm of loneliness. Right? There's so many, so many men. We are Wired, Richard Reeves wrote a book on boys and men. He's actually a progressive scholar but spends a lot of time writing about men. Dog. And it's his argument that I'm I kinda persuaded on that in a lot of ways, masculinity in its social manifestation is no A bit more fragile than femininity, and his argument is that you know, we're wired for purpose.

    JP DeGance [00:20:22]:

    Humans are wired for purpose. Right? And we derive our sense of purpose most frequently from being a husband and then being a father. Okay? And when we walk through life, and we got those 2 things out of our life, what you're seeing doc Is ex what researchers identified is this epidemic of loneliness because and you've got an explosive growth in opioids and substance abuse, men died, and liver cirrhosis. Doc. All of this is what happened. It's the social manifestation or the psychological manifestation of social phenomena where you no longer have that sense of purpose is now void, no And

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:20:54]:

    it needs to be filled with something.

    JP DeGance [00:20:54]:

    And frequently, it's found in forms of escape. And our role as a dad Should be for anybody listening; this should be a place where I derive a deep, deep sense of purpose in my life. Ideally, the Best outcomes occur when you're a married dad. But then, if you're not a married dad, then it's how do I find ways to function in a healthy way as frequently as I can as a single dad. And understand this is deeply who you are, Dog. And you've created another person. A daughter shares your DNA, half of your DNA, and her self-image, her mental health, her future decisions on who she couples up with, who her spouse is, her future feelings of loneliness or isolation or the lack thereof, Doc. Wrapped up in her relationship, whether you like it or not with her.

    JP DeGance [00:21:47]:

    And so that should actually, I don't share that to scare any of the listeners. No, I show that to encourage you and just know you've got a big job. We've got big jobs as dads. We're not replaceable. Nobody else can serve that role as a dad. And so the Latin phrase, be a man. We have to step up and be a man.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:06]:

    You sharing that. Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five. We're gonna ask the Five more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    JP DeGance [00:22:14]:

    Yeah. Go ahead.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:15]:

    In one word, what is fatherhood?

    JP DeGance [00:22:17]:

    Fun. I don't know. I feel like it's a lot of fun.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:19]:

    When did you finally feel like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    JP DeGance [00:22:24]:

    I read a book to my teenagers. I read we do a lot of read-aloud books, no, And we've done stuff like Tolkien and Baham. I picked a book called How to Avoid Falling in Love with a Jerk. And I told my kids, and I told my daughter. I told my teenage boys and my teenage daughter that I read to them. I told them, look. It's too late for your mother, but it's not too late for you. And my daughter, at the end of it, okay, this is about as high praise as you can get. From a 14-year-old, she said, Dad, this is the 1st book you read to me that was interesting.

    JP DeGance [00:22:51]:

    And so I felt like knowing my daughter, that's, like, spiking the football. She's like, this is the greatest thing ever is what what that Dawson. So I felt like that was a major win.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:58]:

    I love that. I haven't read that book, but I think I might have to check it out.

    JP DeGance [00:23:01]:

    It's a great book. Read by my friend John Van App. He's a great scholar And a student of human relationships.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:07]:

    Appreciate you sharing that. Now if I were to talk to your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?

    JP DeGance [00:23:12]:

    I think they would say I'm the Don Juan. But I also know, you know, they'd say fun and that dad likes to teach us. And so because when we're eating dinner at the table, I'm usually we're doing pop Dog. Quizzes, whether it's on matters of deep importance or or matters of college football. It just depends.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:30]:

    Who inspires you to be a better dad?

    JP DeGance [00:23:32]:

    All 8 of my kids. I feel an awesome responsibility that I know Doc. No one will have a greater impact on our likelihood of living a healthy and happy life later than me and certainly their mother. But there's a lot of data. It says, particularly for our daughters, that there's this outsized major impact that dads play, and so I just can't help, but when I see my kids in the morning, especially my little 4-year-old, I can't help. Lucy, my youngest, is a daughter, and she runs the house, as my older kids all know. I

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:16]:

    You've given a lot of pieces of advice today. As we finish up today, what's 1 piece of advice you'd want to give to every dad?

    JP DeGance [00:24:21]:

    Live life with your children. And I mean that song, The Cats in the Cradle and the Silver Spoon. A little boy, blue, and the man on the moon. When you come home, son, I don't know when. I think so. Many times, it's so critical for us to abide and be around our children and enjoy when they're little to be with them And in the things that they love to do. Even though it may not be the most fun thing for us when our little ones are little push yourself to find the joy in playing and condescending to your daughters when they're really little. And because as you do that and continue to do that, As they get older, they will want to spend time with you, and you will want to spend time with them.

    JP DeGance [00:25:02]:

    The thing that I've gotten the most joy out of is actually these teenage years. Now that I am a college freshman, all of my teenagers actually enjoy spending time with me, and they like spending time with their friends. But when it's time to do something, they look forward to it. And they're okay with an occasional Friday night or Saturday night and dad, I'm watching some games with dad or or spending some time with dad. And that's all built on years of living life with them from a young age.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:31]:

    Well, JP, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your journey, for sharing this study. If people wanna find out more About you, about your organization, where should they go?

    JP DeGance [00:25:40]:

    Go to communio.org, particularly to get the study, which goes into the slowness of data, the Goes into a lot of interesting stuff. Particularly, it goes into a lot of research on fathers' impact on faith practice, Which for dads who are interested in understanding that, it's communio.org backslash study. It's the relationship with our earthly father. That has an impact on whether or not you believe that there's a heavenly father out there who loves you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:08]:

    Well, JP, I just wanna, again, say thank you. Thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing and being able to help fathers to be able to see the importance of finding that community around them, and I wish you all the best.

    JP DeGance [00:26:18]:

    Hey. Thank you so much, Christopher.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:20]:

    If you've enjoyed today's Dads with Daughters podcast episode, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the resource for any dad who wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. The And the Fatherhood Insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, an interactive forum, step-by-step road maps, and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out atfatheringtogether.org.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:59]:

    If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis:

    Dad's with Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters And be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis :

    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents. Bring your A-Game because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

  • Mack Brock: Faith, Family, and Finding Balance as a Dad

    Mack Brock: Faith, Family, and Finding Balance as a Dad

    · Dads With Daughters

    In a heartfelt and candid conversation on the Dads with Daughters podcast, Mack Brock, a renowned Christian musician, opens up about his fears and hopes as a father raising daughters. Emphasizing the need to protect and nurture his daughters into strong, independent women, Brock highlights the importance of understanding and engaging with each of his three kids in a way that resonates with their unique personalities and interests.

    Balancing Public and Private Life

    As both a musician and a parent, Mack Brock acknowledges the challenges of balancing his public persona with his private family life. He discusses the importance of creating a sense of family unity by involving his kids in his work and ministry, providing them with a glimpse into his passion and dedication to music while maintaining a healthy boundary between his public and private life.

    Embracing Change through Fostering

    The conversation takes a poignant turn as Brock shares his family's decision to become foster parents. The Brock family's journey began with a temporary foster placement that has since evolved into a long-term arrangement. Mack and his wife have navigated difficult conversations with their biological children about fostering, emphasizing the impact and importance of being adaptable and supportive as a family, irrespective of the changing dynamics.

    Nurturing Resilience and Emotional

    Well-being Brock delves into the emotional complexities of fostering and the potential impact of reunification with Z, their foster child, with his biological parents. The family has consciously chosen to shift their mentality from a temporary arrangement to embracing Z as a beloved member of their family, regardless of the duration he stays with them. They discuss the possibility of reunification and the potential need for family and individual child therapy to navigate the emotions and challenges that may arise.

    Music, Obedience, and Family Unity

    Mack Brock's music career and success have been a result of taking small obediences to the Lord and being open to opportunities as they arise. His commitment to faith and artistry is interwoven with his dedication to nurturing his family, demonstrating the harmony between his professional pursuits and familial responsibilities. The Brock family's journey reflects the utmost importance of faith, humility, and optimism in overcoming the challenges of parenthood and fostering.

    Mac Brock's thought-provoking insights and exemplary approach to parenting inspire us to embrace the challenges and joys of nurturing strength, resilience, and compassion in our children, whether biological or foster, amid life's ebbs and flows. His unwavering commitment to music and family shines a light on the transformative power of faith, love, and unwavering devotion in shaping a wholesome and nurturing family environment.

    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads With Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad who wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most are figuring it out as they go along. The Fatherhood Insider is full of valuable resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, an interactive forum, step-by-step roadmaps, and more, you will engage and learn with experts but, more importantly, with dads like you. So check it out today!

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:

    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:

    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. Every week, I love sitting down with you and going on this journey that you and I both are on in raising those strong, independent women in our lives, and we can't do this alone. We have to have community, we have to be able to listen and learn the stories of other fathers around us. And through those stories, you and I can become stronger fathers ourselves, and we can be more engaged. We can be better intentional fathers to our daughters as well. I love being able to be on this journey with you.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]:

    I love being able to bring you different dads and different people every week from so many different walks of life who are fathering in different ways. I've said this before, and I'll say it again. There's no one right way to father. Every one of us does it a little bit differently, and that's okay. We can learn from each other, though, and know that Even if you started on 1 path toward fatherhood, you can pivot. You can change. You can make adjustments along the way because, Especially as your kids are young, they're gonna be forgiving, and they're going to accept you who you are, but you have to be willing to change too.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:43]:

    And you have to be willing to move in that other direction and be willing to say, you know what? This is not working. Or, yeah, this is working. And keep going. So this week, we got another great guest with us. Mac Brock is with us, and Mac is a is the CEO of Proverbs 31 Ministries. has 3 kids. He also has a ton of worship songs that you may or may not have already heard, and we're gonna talk about that music too. And that includes Foods, an RIAA-certified double platinum single, Oh Come to the Altar, a platinum-certified Do It Again, which amazingly has over 129,000,000 YouTube views, and a gold track resurrecting that has 49,000,000 YouTube views. I can't even imagine that many YouTube views, But I would love to have that many YouTube views. But we're gonna be talking about his music as well as well as talking about his journey as a father. Mac, thanks so much for being here today.

    Mack Brock [00:02:41]:

    So good to be here. I need to correct one thing. It's it's my wife who is the CEO of Proverbs 31. She is the boss lady. I'm just a musician. All I do is write and sing songs. My wife is, like, the superstar, rock star that kinda handles things that are way above my pay grade. Well, I

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:00]:

    appreciate that because we gotta give credit where credit's due. And, Meredith, keep up the awesome work. Keep rocking it. You can tell Mac is on your side, and we're all on your side. The So Mac, what I love starting these opportunities to talk with an opportunity to turn the clock back in time. Wouldn't that be great if we just had the power to snap our fingers and we could go back? But we're gonna turn the clock back in time to that first moment, that first moment that you found out that you were going to be a dad to a daughter. What was going through your head?

    Mack Brock [00:03:29]:

    Man, for both of my kids, I have a son first and then a daughter second. And for both of them, I was very wrong on the gender. I thought I was gonna have a daughter first, then I thought for sure I was gonna have another son. And so finding out I was having a daughter, it was just such a little bit panicky because I was like, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to handle girls. I don't know how this it feels very scary and overwhelming. And then when she came, it was even that was even more magnified of like, alright. What am I supposed to do? But over the years, Step by step, day by day, I feel like me and my wife have learned together how to raise our little girl.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:09]:

    Talking about fear, I talked to a lot of dads. And especially dads with daughters, I hear constantly that there is some fear. There is some fear about stepping into the role of being a father the To a daughter. As you've had your daughter in your life and you reflect back on that, what was your biggest fear or what is your biggest fear in raising a daughter? Dog.

    Mack Brock [00:04:30]:

    I think, you know, we naturally have that protection instinct. And so there's just like, I want to protect her from everything. I wanna protect her from the world, the And, and that's not reality. We can do our part, but, eventually, you know, our goal is to raise up women and to raise up strong women who are independent and can go out into the world. And so I think it's still not I don't know if fear is the right word, but it's still on my mind the know my heart a lot of, like, navigating that, and how do I pour continue to pour into her and to steward her magical imagination, her creativity, and then also steward her strength And Steward, we're growing in to be a woman of the lord and and a woman that is confident and believes in herself.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:24]:

    I did mention you're a father of 3, and you have 3 different kids with different personalities, and different needs.

    Mack Brock [00:05:31]:

    All different. Very different.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:33]:

    As You look at all 3 of your kids, and you look at yourself as a father, I know that even with two kids, I have to Be engaged with my kids in different ways. I have to understand them differently to be able to spend that unique time with them. To be able to build those relationships, what do you have to do to be able to not only, You know, be the father you wanna be, the husband you wanna be, the musician you wanna be, but what do you have to do to be able to build those unique relationships with each of your kids?

    Mack Brock [00:06:09]:

    The Yeah. That's such a good point because it is so wild how vastly different my daughter and my son are, the two oldest. They come from, you know, me and my wife, same DNA, same the Same everything, and they are so different. And so I've had to learn just like everybody, they have different interests, different Hobbies and different ways to connect. And so, for my son, it's a lot of playing Fortnite. It's a lot of we have the same sense of humor, so we'll watch Docs YouTube videos where we'll kinda sit and enjoy something together. And my daughter is so different. For my daughter, it's a lot of Reading stories together or sitting down and playing LEGOs together and just having that kind of playtime.

    Mack Brock [00:06:53]:

    Dog. And even, like, bedtime routines are, like, way different between my kids. You know, my daughter really likes to, like, lay in bed and snuggle and talk and tell the stories to each other. My son was kinda never that way. But I've realized, man, this is like a small the Way to build, like, a deep connection with my daughter that is hopefully building and planting seeds and building a foundation that will last, Like, the rest of our lives in our relationship.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:20]:

    I love that because I think you're right. I mean, I think you have to go with the flow in so many ways, and you have to be willing to understand and get to know your kids, what makes them tick, but also what makes them light up the And add more fuel to that fire while at the same time, as you said, stewarding them the in other directions to be able to help them in many different ways. As you look at the fact I said, you are a musician. You live a public life in that way. People know you and your music, and they at least feel like they know you and know your music. Doc. Me about separating that and being able to live the public life while at the same time Protecting the private life while at the same time having your kids see that public life and understanding Who you are publicly versus privately.

    Mack Brock [00:08:19]:

    Oh, I totally know if I even know how to answer that question because I feel at the core of what I do, I'm just like a worship leader. Dog. You know, I don't feel like this, like, big artist or anything like that. Like, For my career, and my calling in life is to Lead worship, and sometimes that's at our local church in Charlotte. But a lot of times, it's me traveling out and going out, you know, across the country and across the world to lead worship in other places. I think a big thing for me that's always been at the forefront is that I've been very careful for my kids not to ever feel like it's ministry and the church that takes their dad away, and that's, like, the bad thing. You know? Like, my dad's a pastor, and he was very, very good about that. Like, I grew up not hating the church because it kept my dad busy. Like, my dad was very, very good at Connecting the family to everything that he was doing, and I tried to do the same. And so, you know, whether it's, like, bringing my kids along no travel with me or whether it's just, like, having open, constant conversations about what I'm going to do or what I get to be a part of. And so for us, it doesn't feel totally like there's this public persona, and then there's this private persona as much as it feels like this is what your dad does. This is his calling in life. This is when he goes out, and he sings about Jesus, and he tells people about Jesus. And my kids, in some respect, get to feel like they're a part of what I do. And so it's not just me going out and doing my job. It's like Doc. Our family is a part of this thing. And even with my wife's ministry and her running Proverbs 31, it's one big, like, unit of, like, this is what our family's calling are these different ministries that we get to be a part of. And I think just having conversations, allowing our kids to feel somewhat a part of that. I don't know. It's been really special and cool for us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:15]:

    Now, raising sons and raising daughters are very different things in many different ways, And it takes a different touch. It takes a different perspective and a different way of parenting. What's been the hardest part for you in being a father to a daughter?

    Mack Brock [00:10:34]:

    I think, going back to what I said earlier, that I want my daughter to be. She's our creative. She's our magical thinker. She lives in, like, this like, her own world of, you know, just constantly creating stories. She's a songwriter. She's only 8, but, like, that's one of the ways that we connect. And so I think, as I said earlier, I think it's like learning to the Steward that and the learning to pour into all the things that make her magical and make her special and the Finding ways to just, like, cultivate and build that into her while at the same time wanting to build strength the in her. And that's one of the things like, my wife is such a strong woman, and she's such a she's just tough.

    Mack Brock [00:11:17]:

    And I lean on her of, like, how can we cultivate that in Cyrus' life and in Cyrus is hard. How can we make her have that same kind of bigger that my wife has without the Kind of hardening of the soft parts that Cyrus has? She's such a soft, tender, special spirit. And so it's just navigating those 2 things. Docs. It's tough now, but I think it's gonna be even tougher as she gets older and, like, learning how to just navigate that. I think another hard thing, just to be Totally real, is when you have a busy job and when you have, like, a demanding career, whatever it might be, traveling a lot or just, you know, busy at home. It's those moments where your daughter says like, hey.

    Mack Brock [00:11:57]:

    Will you do this with me? I want you, you know, can you come and sit down and play Legos with me? And you're worn out and tired, and you're like, no. Honestly, I just wanna I need to veg out for a minute. And it's hard to say, like, No. I have got to value and treasure these moments that my daughter is like she's verbally requesting, like, I want a connection with you, and it's the putting down your, I guess, your own, like, rest to make sure you're still, like, getting those connections with your kid.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:26]:

    So important. And I have definitely had those experiences where, as you said, You come home. You're just wiped, and your kid says, will you do this with me? And you just wanna say, I just need to the Sit down.

    Mack Brock [00:12:42]:

    And I fail a lot. I'm, you know, I mess I failed that test a lot, but it's something I've been challenging myself with a lot more, too, and just being aware of it And saying like, man, when when your kid is just asking. You know? And it's usually a very simple thing. They're not always asking, like, hey. Will you take me To this or take me to go do this? It's a lot of times it's just like, hey. Will you sit in my room and play with me?

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:04]:

    As they get older, that's when they say, will you take me here? Will you take me there? Right.

    Mack Brock [00:13:09]:

    Right. I'm not quite there yet. Yeah.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:10]:

    I get that. I completely understand that. So I know that one of the other experiences that you and your wife have had has been in the foster arena and that you stepped a number of years back now into the world of being a foster parent too. And you've had a son come into your life that way. And so talk to me about that journey and what made you and your wife choose to step on that path and bring him into your life.

    Mack Brock [00:13:42]:

    Yes. Just a quick rundown. So we have, our oldest son, the biological son, Harvey, he's 12. My daughter, Cyrus, is 8. Then in 2020, we decided, we got our foster parents' license and decided to start fostering. And we got a little boy come to live with us named Z, and he's been with us for about three and a half years now.

    Mack Brock [00:14:02]:

    Fostering was always something that was on my wife's heart, and it wasn't really on mine. But it was kind of like, I'll take the classes, and I'll read the books and take it one step at a time, and ultimately, It became a big portion of my heart as well of, like, feeling the call to do that. And yeah. And so it was just a lot of little yeses that ultimately led to, like, the big yes of you get the phone call, and they're like, hey. We have this little boy. He's five months old.

    Mack Brock [00:14:31]:

    He needs a place to stay for the immediate future, then we'll figure out what's next. In the immediate future, a week turns into a month, turns into six months, turns into three and a half years. And so that has been, it's been a gift for us. It's been a challenge, obviously. I mean, just having a 3-year-old is a challenge. So that is what comes with the territory. But I think one of the things that is talking about parenting and all that aspect is there's been a lot of the healthy but also, like, difficult conversations with our bio kids of saying like, hey. Like, we're bringing in Doubt.

    Mack Brock [00:15:06]:

    This other person that's gonna take a lot of our attention, and he's gonna have a lot of things that we have to focus on. And that's gonna take attention away from you, or that's gonna take the time away from you. And so even just being honest about the realities of fostering or the realities of adding another kid to your family. Those have been healthy conversations. It's also just been the reality of, like, they're difficult. Those are difficult things for kids to go through, and it's led to a lot of, like, just good connections. And I think it's interesting because, for my wife and me, that's something that we say yes to.

    Mack Brock [00:15:42]:

    And when we decided to say yes to it, we wanted to bring our kids in, explain to them, here's where we're leaning. We want to make sure y'all feel comfortable with this as well. And they're kids, and so it's not like they can totally create here's my consent, and here are all the things of, you know, all these the arguments or whatever, but they were very excited about it. But it's something we've had to continue to have conversations about throughout the whole journey, and the Three and a half years that Z has been with us continue to have conversations about where they're at, how their own heart is feeling, how their own emotions are feeling. Sometimes they're up, and sometimes they're down, but thing is the openness of the conversation has been the best thing for us.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:22]:

    So talk to me a little bit about being a foster dad and how that differs for you from how you parent your other kids, if it is different. I'm sure that there are people who hear about or know people who have fostered, but they don't know How you have to parent in either the same or different way.

    Mack Brock [00:16:45]:

    So when Z first came to live with us, there were a lot of obstacles right from the get-go, but you're loving him like you would love any baby, and and you would love any child that's in your care. And I think to be totally transparent and vulnerable a little bit; there was a time early on where it was like, you know, part of fostering is the goal ultimately is reunification with bio parents. That's the goal. And so it is, by definition, like a temporary thing. And me and my wife, the We felt ourselves a little bit switch into this mentality of almost, like, just caring for this child instead of bringing this child in as our son for the time that he was with us. And we felt that in our hearts even if it was, like, unspoken. And we had to have a conversation with each other very early on of, like, hey. Are you feeling this way? Like, I don't like I don't like that I'm feeling this way.

    Mack Brock [00:17:38]:

    And I think that we have to switch our mentality and switch our heart. Like, we can't treat this as temporary. Even if it is temporary, We can't treat we have to treat z as our son, and we had a very open conversation about that as a couple of saying, like, we're gonna make the decision. Like, We're gonna love him like our son. We're gonna treat him like our son. Our mentality, our heart is gonna treat him like he is ours, Whether it's for 6 months or what it's become now, you know, where he's been with us for a long time. And that was such a pivotal switch for us mentally in the way that we were able to, like, just love on him. And he is my son.

    Mack Brock [00:18:16]:

    And even if it's temporary, it's something that I had to make sure I felt that in my heart and expressed that to him.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:24]:

    I can only imagine, especially I mean, he's been there longer than some placements Probably would happen. And as you said, you put your whole heart into him as your son and Not as just caring for someone in a temporary capacity, and you've had your those conversations with your own children the As he came to live with you, but they're seeing him as a part of the family too. And there may come a day when Z goes back and is reunified. And I'm sure that while there's probably some training that they try to put you through, It's not gonna be easy. And have you thought about that in how you and your wife and your family will be able to reconcile with that as well?

    Mack Brock [00:19:11]:

    Yeah. I mean, that's the reality with foster care, and those are heavy things for a child to walk through. And so we definitely had a lot of conversations of, like, what if this happens? What if this happens? How how are we gonna handle it? And there are a lot of resources for, like, the Family therapy and group therapy and then individual, like, child therapy to, like, walk through just even, like, the grieving process If you have to walk through something like that. And so we've had a lot of those conversations. We haven't had to walk through that personally. We've had a lot of friends that have a lot of foster Parent friends that have had to go through that. But, yeah, we haven't had to cross that bridge, but we've definitely talked a lot about what are the steps we would need to take. If that came to pass.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:56]:

    I mentioned at the beginning, you are an artist and, as you said, a worship leader and an artist. So talk to me about that story for yourself, and what drew you into wanting to be not only A worship leader but beyond that, an artist that has 100,000,000 views on YouTube and having people that are really connecting to the music that you're putting out into the world.

    Mack Brock [00:20:25]:

    Yeah. I mean, I grew up in the church, like I said before, and so I grew up. My mom's a musician. She's a drummer and grew up around music and ministry. That was, like, my whole life all growing up. And so naturally, kinda led into, It's just a part of my life and one of the things that I was constantly, like, in front of me.

    Mack Brock [00:20:43]:

    And when I look back, me and my wife, we've been married for 17 years. And Dog. Even in our marriage, when we look back, we didn't have these grand here's our 5-year plan, our 10-year plan, our 15-year plan for our marriage or for even my career or anything like that, it was it's a lot of the step by step the Small obediences to the lord when they're in front of us that I feel like has led to where we're at now. And so that led to Doubt. We moved to Charlotte to be a part of Elevation Church when it was first getting started to pouring into that ministry and and writing those songs and then stepping Dog. Of Elevation Church into, like, kind of a solo career. It was just something that was, like, always stuff that was always in front of us, saying yes and trying our best to be obedient with what was in front of us. And so now we look back, and we see, wow.

    Mack Brock [00:21:37]:

    Look at what the lord has done. Look at it's amazing, and and it's wild. And it's Crazy to to see what he's done, but it was never, and we're both planners. Me and my wife are both type a. We like goals. We like to have a plan. We like to know what's ahead of us, what we're working towards, but it's pretty crazy to see that even with all of our own personal goals or all of our own, like, dreams, It all boils down to what's in front of us, being good stewards of what's right of what we have today, the And being obedient to what we have today, and that's kind of what's led to where we're at now.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:13]:

    I love that. Now you talked about the fact that you started Elevation Church, and you worked with Elevation the church, and then you broke off into that solo career. And I'm sure there's, as you talked about within foster care, I'm sure that you put all your heart and soul into elevation. And then, as you broke off, there's probably some grieving that happens. And not having that one church that you're there all the time and you're part of, and now you're putting your heart and soul into the solo career in the music itself. But talk to me about the difference there for you And now going from being at the church and worshiping at that church to now being in the solo career, not having the same community that you're constantly being a part of, but you have a broader community now that you're a part of and sharing the gospel with.

    Mack Brock [00:23:06]:

    Yeah. I mean, I'm such, and I grew up playing in bands. I love being a part of a team doing, like, Mac Brock, quote, unquote. It's, like, never, like, in the cards for me. I was like, that sounds awful. But when we felt like the lord was calling us to step away from elevation. It wasn't to pursue a solo career. It was just we felt like we were supposed to be obedient to that calling of stepping away, not sure what was next.

    Mack Brock [00:23:32]:

    But then it naturally led to me continuing to write songs, me wanting to, like, the Still create music, and so that's kinda what led to even where I'm at now. And, yeah, it is different. It's like you said, there there is a different type of community. No. There's a different type of team that I'm a part of, and I still have lots of musician friends that still travel with me, or it's not necessarily, like, a Part of a specific, you know, worship ministry, church, whatever, but there's still a core group of people that are Still, like, heavily involved in what would I do, and I don't feel like I'm alone or solo in that sense, which I'm very, very grateful Dollar.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:10]:

    Well, I know you've got a new album out. Just Like You've Always Done is your newest album that's out. And I guess Dog. Talk to me a little bit about the writing process and what you do to Bring these new, not only the new songs but these new albums out into the world, what you have to go through personally To be able to not only come up with the inspiration but be able to put them all together than to create the new album for your fans.

    Mack Brock [00:24:42]:

    The hardest part is is, the Like, the songwriting aspect. You know? There's just a lot of writing, and it's a lot of reworking. And, I mean, there's so many songs that come into the process of making, like, a full album, which I'm, like, still, like, kind of in the middle of. I'm still navigating, like, what songs are gonna be on, what's, you know, what songs are getting cut. So there's it's such a long process in that respect. Even today, I was kinda, like, pacing around the house, and Meredith could tell, like, she's the She's like, something's, like, going on with you. I was like, man, I had just had I can't crack this 1 song that I'm, like, working on. There's something about it that I gotta, like, penetrate to fix it, and I can't figure it out right now, and it's bothering me.

    Mack Brock [00:25:23]:

    And so there's just a lot of, like, that digging and the the next layer. You know? Because, Basically, there's a lot of songs that start, and you write it with a group of people, you know, hit a couple of people, or you write it by yourself. That's almost like the easy part is to, like, start a song and get it going. But it's the next layer of digging and trying to figure out, like, what's the best version of the song? Am I really communicating in the most efficient way or the best way that I want to communicate? And so it's that digging. And then when you have the song done, then it's like, how do we want it to sound? And, you know, how are we gonna get it out? Doc. So there's just so many different layers. Every step of the way, there are so many different ways to make a song succeed and make a song, like, work or make it not the best version of itself, which I've done several times.

    Mack Brock [00:26:14]:

    And so it's just being diligent and persevering through the process, knowing that it is just a process. And so I love the process, as frustrating as it can be, as discouraging as it can be. Like any creative, You go through this cyclical thing of, like, I think this is awesome. Oh, wait. This sucks. Oh, wait. No. It's not as bad as I thought it was.

    Mack Brock [00:26:36]:

    The Oh, okay. It's not as great as I thought it was gonna, you know, like, there's just this cyclical thing, but I think being aware of that for me helps me know the This is part of the process. I just gotta, like, push through and keep working, keep digging. And I'm always grateful for when it's finally done and out, and I'm able to, like, release it out into the world.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:54]:

    I love that. And people have not heard the music on this album. What should they be looking forward to the most, and what do you hope that people are gonna take away from the music?

    Mack Brock [00:27:03]:

    So the album is still kind of in progress. I released the song just like you've always done. That's the 1st single for the album. And then the album releases early next year. And there are a lot of songs that I just am, like, so excited for people to hear. But just like you've always done, the song that's out now has been such a great I think that's a great start to the song because it's thematically, or it's a great start to the album because the Thematically, it hits so many things that I'm very passionate about. One of the biggest things that I'm passionate about is remembering and declaring them and helping people focus on just the faithfulness of God. Because if you're a dad out there, you know that seasons come and seasons go, and there are the highs, and there are lows, and there are mountain tops, and there are dollies.

    Mack Brock [00:27:45]:

    And it's so easy to get your mind or your eyes off of the Lord no And to be discouraged and to feel like whatever season you're in, if you're in a down season, it's never gonna end. And so just to be reminded of, like, the consistency and the steadiness of who Jesus is in our lives and trusting that, I find so much hope in that. Dog. And there are so many songs on the new album that kinda touches on that as well, and so I'm very excited about it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:12]:

    Well, we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood five, where I ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready?

    Mack Brock [00:28:18]:

    Okay. Let's go.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:19]:

    In one word, what is fatherhood? Chaos. When was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?

    Mack Brock [00:28:27]:

    Honestly, this past week, I was talking to Cyrus came with me to a band rehearsal. And at the end of the night, we had a big prayer time. And when she was driving home, just hearing her process, what we talked about in our prayer time, how she talks to Jesus and what she does when she's feeling anxious. No Just even having that conversation with her, I don't know if that felt like I've succeeded as a father, but it was a big win.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:50]:

    If your kids were here and I was talking to all 3 of them, How would they describe you as a dad?

    Mack Brock [00:28:55]:

    Not cool. I'm always trying to tell my kids that I'm a cool dad, and They don't believe me.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:02]:

    Now who inspires you to be a better dad?

    Mack Brock [00:29:04]:

    I've got several friends that I look to often and see the way that they're raising their kids and the relationships that they have with their kids that are, like, teenagers now or college that very inspiring, and I'm constantly, like, the Asking. Alright. Help me in this season. What I'm doing now helps me cultivate these relationships that you have with your kids now.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:25]:

    You've given a lot of pieces of advice, a lot of things people to think about today; as we finish up, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?

    Mack Brock [00:29:33]:

    Be as present as possible and be even for me, I travel so much with my work, but I've worked it out in a way that that when I'm home, I can just be present, and I'm home a lot. And so just be present and make yourself, like, seen and known, and make sure that your kids know that you're seeing them and knowing them. It's just so easy, even when you're home, to be on your phone or be locked in on Netflix or whatever it might be, and I do. I'm guilty of all those things too, but I'm challenged myself, and I'm challenged to make sure that my kids know that I see them, that my Them. Kids know that I'm there present with them.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:05]:

    Well, Mac, I want to say thank you. Thank you for sharing your own journey today and for sharing the things that you've learned as you've gone through fatherhood. If people wanna find out more about you, about your music, or about Meredith's organization, whatever it may be, where should they go to find out more?

    Mack Brock [00:30:23]:

    I mean, you can go to MackBrock .com, but there's also just Mac Brock on Instagram or Mara Brock on Instagram. That's where you'll find us. We're there a lot.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:32]:

    Well, Mac, thank you so much for sharing your story today, and I wish you all the best.

    Mack Brock [00:30:37]:

    Thank you. This is great. Appreciate it.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:39]:

    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the fatherhood insider. The fatherhood insider is the essential resource for any dad who wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. The And the Fatherhood Insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, an interactive forum, step-by-step road maps, and more. You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out atfatheringtogether.org.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis:

    Dad's with Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters And be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis :

    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents. Bring your A-Game because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters, and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

  • From Protectiveness to Empowerment: Dai Manuel's Insights on Parenting and Letting Go

    From Protectiveness to Empowerment: Dai Manuel's Insights on Parenting and Letting Go

    · Dads With Daughters

    In a recent episode of the Dads With Daughters podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis delved into an insightful conversation with guest Dai Manuel, focusing on the unique challenges of fatherhood, maintaining resilience in relationships, and embracing whole-life fitness as a means of self-improvement. As the father of two daughters and an advocate for holistic well-being, Dai Manuel shared his experiences as an "on-demand dad" and discussed the emotional journey of transitioning into the empty nest phase. In this blog post, we'll explore the valuable insights and practical advice shared by Dai Manuel on navigating fatherhood, fostering resilient relationships, and pursuing holistic fitness for a fulfilling life.

    Fatherhood and the Empty Nest Phase

    Dai Manuel candidly shared his experiences of fatherhood, particularly as his daughters have grown up and moved out of the family home, leaving him and his wife as empty nesters. As a father, he discussed the emotional challenges of letting go and acknowledging the everlasting nature of parenting, even as children grow older and become independent. He highlighted the importance of recognizing the evolving role of a parent and the continuous support needed by children, even into adulthood.

    Resilience in Relationships

    The conversation also delved into the impact of empty nesting on the relationship dynamics between parents. Dai Manuel emphasized the need for intentional, consistent, and persistent efforts to build resilience in relationships, especially during the transition to empty nesting. He shared insights on the importance of using specific language and establishing a dedicated weekly date night as effective tools for strengthening the bond between partners. Dai's recommendations of relationship books such as "The 5 Love Languages," "The Four Agreements," and "Conscious Loving" serve as valuable resources for maintaining healthy and resilient relationships.

    Navigating Parental Concerns and Relationships

    Dai Manuel reflected on the challenges of navigating parental concerns, particularly in his youngest daughter's relationship. Drawing from his experience in men's coaching and relationship work, Dai shared a meaningful conversation he had with his daughter about recognizing toxic behaviors in her relationship. He emphasized the significance of stepping in as a father to help children perceive situations that they may not fully understand. Additionally, he recommended the book "The Way of the Superior Man" and highlighted insights from it, which played a pivotal role in his conversation with his daughter.

    Embracing Vulnerability and Whole Life Fitness

    Dai spoke about the impact of vulnerability in fostering deep connections with his daughters and in his relationships. This vulnerability extends beyond parenting and into his brand new podcast, "The 2% Solution," which focuses on whole-life fitness. He emphasized the significance of engaging in physical, emotional, spiritual, relationship, and financial fitness as essential components of a fulfilling life. The podcast aims to provide actionable strategies that can be implemented in as little as 30 minutes a day, focusing on areas such as releasing trauma, clarifying values, and using fitness as a catalyst for overall well-being.

    Taking Action for Holistic Well-Being

    Dai Manuel's encouragement for incorporating a nutrient-dense green smoothie and 30 minutes of brisk walking into daily routines is a practical example of taking action for holistic well-being. He emphasized the positive impacts on sleep, stress management, food choices, physical changes, and metabolism, urging listeners to embrace these simple habits for positive transformation.

    In summary, Dai Manuel's insights offered a wealth of wisdom on navigating the empty nest phase, fostering resilient relationships, embracing vulnerability, and pursuing holistic fitness. His commitment to supporting fathers and individuals in their pursuit of well-being serves as an inspiration for all. As we navigate the complexities of parenthood and seek personal growth, Dai's advice and experiences serve as a guiding light for creating meaningful connections, building resilience, and embracing holistic well-being through intentional actions.

    Download Dai's Green Smoothies here

    Learn more about Dai here

    In the spirit of continuous improvement, the Dads With Daughters podcast extends an invitation to join the Fatherhood Insider and the Dads with Daughters Facebook community for ongoing support, resources, and connection with fellow dads.

    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads With Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The Fatherhood Insider is the essential resource for any dad that wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most are figuring it out as they go along. The Fatherhood Insider is full of valuable resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, interactive forum, step-by-step roadmaps, and more you will engage and learn with experts but more importantly with dads like you. So check it out today!

    TRANSCRIPT

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]:

    Welcome to Dads With Daughters. In this show, we spotlight dads, resources, and more to help you be the best dad you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]:

    Welcome back to the Dads with Daughters podcast, where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. I am really excited to have you back again this week, every week. I love being able to sit down with you and talk to you about the journey that you're on, share some of my own experiences, and really delve into the things that are challenging you and bringing people to talk to you about the journey that they have had the And things that they can offer to help your journey be even smoother than it may have already been. Every father comes to fatherhood in different ways. There's no one right way to father. We've talked about that numerous times in numerous episodes, Dog. And it's so true because the way that you fathered, the way that I fathered, is going to be just a little bit different. But that doesn't mean that we can't learn from one another.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:07]:

    That doesn't mean that we can't be vulnerable with one another and talk about our challenges because there will be challenges. It's not always going to be the Roses. It's not always going to be easy, but if you surround yourself with people who will help you, we'll lift you up. That is only going to help you be a stronger father and be there, more engaged, and a better parent in the end for your kids. Every week, I love being able to bring you different guests, different men, different people who have lots of different experiences that they can share with you. This week, I am really excited to be able to bring back the Repeat guest, Di Manuel, who is with us today. Di is a repeat guest. As I said, he was first with us on May 18th, 2020.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:58]:

    It's been two and a half years. Been quite a while. Things have changed in Dai's life, and we're gonna talk about some of those changes that have happened. We're Doc. We're also gonna be talking about some of the things that he's doing right now to support dads and people to be able to really change their mindset, Dog. Think about not only fitness, wellness, and more but really changing your mindset to moving yourself in the right direction toward whole body fitness. And when I say fitness, it's not just about exercise, so we're gonna talk about that too. Di, thanks so much for being here today.

    Dai Manuel [00:02:31]:

    Chris, man, I gosh. The Last time we chatted was, like, a new lockdown. It was. Crazy, right, to think about wow, dude. This is awesome. I mean, it's, no, but it's funny, right, because we're connected online. Right? Like, I see you show up in my feed regularly. I see each other commenting in different groups.

    Dai Manuel [00:02:49]:

    So I feel like We've been there all the time. You know? So it's, but it's nice to be here in this formal, wow, return guest. I mean, I'm just honored to be back again. I'm like, wow. Do I have something extra to talk about? I'm sure gonna try.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:03]:

    Well, as I said, things have changed since the last time we talked. And the last time we talked, your kids were you had one that was graduating. You had another that was still in high school and getting ready to keep going on in high Doc. Since then, they've both been out of the house. They're both doing their thing. They're adulting in their own ways, and now they have grown and flown. And I guess I wanted to talk a little bit about that and some of the new reality for you and your spouse and to talk about some of the things that you've had to do as your kids have moved out of the house to now be able to still be a be their dad, But maybe in a little bit different way.

    Dai Manuel [00:03:47]:

    DOD, the acronym. I'm a dad on demand. Alright? Docs. It's quite literally. You know, when I think about it now, my kids, are quick to ask for help when they need it, But that's about it. Otherwise, they're exerting their independence every which way they can. And you know what? Right on. Because I mean, I remember when I was 18 and moving away from home.

    Dai Manuel [00:04:10]:

    I moved all the way across the country. You know? At 18, I graduated high school, and I was okay. Peace out. I'm gone. Dog. And I literally went from Toronto, you know, like, on Ontario all the way to Vancouver, which is the furthest I could go on the West Coast. And so I remember the excitement, the exhilaration, but also the fear, right, associated with all that. Now, with my daughters, they're both still in the province, which is awesome.

    Dai Manuel [00:04:32]:

    So they're within distance. My one daughter, you know, literally an hour away. My other daughter is about 6 hours away. So I don't see them as much as I'd like to. Of course. That transition from them leaving home, That move-out day, because we moved them. We did. We moved both of them into the universities, one on campus, the other one renting a room and shared home.

    Dai Manuel [00:04:53]:

    And just the act of moving them and then driving away. It was really hard. I didn't realize how challenging it was gonna be. I mean, I remember my mom just bawling your eyes out that day that I was leaving to get on the plane to move to Vancouver. Right? Like, I remember just losing it and being like, What's up, Mom? What's wrong with you? You know? Like, don't worry about it. It's not like I'm dying here. I'm just I'm just moving. I get it now.

    Dai Manuel [00:05:19]:

    I get it. And, obviously, I didn't bawl like my mom did, but I shed some tears. There was this feeling of a clap and just being all choked up. And that's just the, I guess, part of life. Right? We all process it a little bit differently. It was much harder on my wife, full disclosure. It was definitely more challenging for her, especially when our 2nd daughter moved away because now it was, like, the 20 years of having kids around to no kids around. And what should be the 1st to say that I'm kind of a big kid?

    Dai Manuel [00:05:44]:

    But, anyway, I at least clean up after myself. But it's been just an interesting last few months. We're in a great place now. We talk to the kids regularly. We always have a Sunday night Zoom call, all of us on the call. We do message. We have a very active WhatsApp Family feed that we're constantly sharing. We also have a family feed on Instagram for us to share some of the funny posts that we're consuming.

    Dai Manuel [00:06:04]:

    And so there's lots of regular the contact still, but it's not that face to face like I was used to. So all that being said, it's just, I hate the cliche, but I'm gonna say it anyways. You know? Such as life, and it just goes on. Right? So but, yeah, that's that's more or less, you know, the update over the last few months because it's it's been interesting. The One

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:22]:

    of the things that I guess that I wanna follow up on and ask you about there is the fact that you and your wife are now empty nesters, the We're gonna say Right. You're out of the house, and it's just the 2 of you now. And that is a transition for many as you have gone from a dynamic of the 1st 4, then 3, and now just the 2 of you. How has that changed your relationships, and what have you had to do? To be able to fill that gap and maybe even reconnect in some ways now that the kids are not there.

    Dai Manuel [00:06:56]:

    Great question, Chris, because I also know that this is well, let's be honest. This is a big issue for a lot of couples. You know? When the kids move out of the house, I mean I, and I hate to say this, but we all sorta know what the underlying Reality is here. And a lot of times, parents stay together until the kids leave the home. I remember my parents, they did that for the longest as they could, but they eventually got to a place where it's like, no. Dog. My dad's mental health, my mom's mental health, they needed to split. But I know that it went on for years, trying to keep the family unit together. Even though the relationship between the parents, you know, was not something to emulate.

    Dai Manuel [00:07:32]:

    You know? Like, you could tell there are issues. So this whole piece around relationships and that dynamic constantly variable relationship, this romantic relationship, you know, between my wife and I, I have to be well, then I'm gonna share with you. You know, there's 1 thing that's helped us navigate this really well. And what I mean by that is it's the resiliency to deal with stress. That's what we're all looking to improve In every aspect of life, right, like resiliency, you can make yourself more resilient, being consistent and persistent enough To build up certain tolerances, if you will, or buffers. Right? And what I mean by that is, obviously, if you do some of that exercise and work out fairly regularly, You're gonna be on the far end of healthy. Right? So if you get sick or an injury, you're gonna shift back a little bit, but you might go from being uber-healthy to healthy. So you have a bit more buffer where, you know, some people might be struggling to be healthy.

    Dai Manuel [00:08:23]:

    They get a major injury or sickness. Woah. They go to unhealth very quickly. And so it's, again, building up resilience in all these different ways. And when it comes to our relationship, there's one thing that I think's given us a lot of resilience as a couple. And I think we might have shared about this before, but Chris, I use a certain type of language. Anybody who sees my social or hears me talking about my wife, I always say we've been dating for x amount of years. Like, I've been dating my wife now going on 23 years.

    Dai Manuel [00:08:50]:

    I am very selective with that language. I'm intentional with that language. Because my wife today, Chris, is very different than the woman I met almost 23 years ago. But if I didn't intentionally, with a lot of diligence and patience, but also a wanting to constantly reconnect. Rediscover all those aspects that are shifting in us if I didn't do that, obviously, that idea of growing apart. Is a reality, but we wanted to grow together, not apart. And for that, we had a dedicated date night that was nonnegotiable.

    Dai Manuel [00:09:27]:

    Both of our calendars every week, Saturday night, 5 to 11. Boom. Nonnegotiable. Like, we have friends that call us, and they'll be like, oh, no. It's Saturday night. We can only ask Diane Christie if we ask them as a couple. You know? It's not like one or the other. Dog.

    Dai Manuel [00:09:42]:

    But this has been really a godsend for us. You know? Like this dedicated evening every week, doesn't matter how busy life is, the How much chaos is going on around us or for us or into us. Right? We know we have this little oasis to look forward to where we have that intentional energy shared with each of us, between us. And so that has been one thing that has really helped us with the resiliency in our relationship. There are other things as well. For, I recommend people read the 5 love Languages and the four agreements, two great books that I highly recommend, and there's also a book called Conscious Loving. Those are three key relationship books I recommend to anybody and everybody who listens to me, and quite frank, you don't need any other relationship books. If you had those 3, you've got everything covered.

    Dai Manuel [00:10:26]:

    The Okay? But that's really it. That piece that's allowed us to sort of sustain that part of us, you know, as a couple. And since the kids have left, It's been even more important to honor that weekly date, if you know what I mean, because it is interesting because it was just so many opportunities for us to do things during the week When the kids are around. When the kids weren't there, all of a sudden, it's like saying yes to, you know, she might come home late after work, or I might do an impromptu workout with a buddy or Go for a bike ride. Like, before, we would have had this time to come together and meet and start preparing dinner, etcetera, and that's not happening as regularly now. And so intentional date night is even more important now than it was when we had kids, which is interesting. And I know some people are thinking, oh, that's Different, but, no, it's true. It really is true.

    Dai Manuel [00:11:08]:

    Because I can see how couples grow apart when the kids go away. I really do see that. So we're doing our darndest not to let that happen.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:15]:

    You talked originally about the kids and how you are letting them fly and that they are they're dads on-demand type of aspect. Dog. Talk to me about what you've had to do to let go because for many men, for many fathers, you want to still be a part of their lives, and you want to stay engaged, but as you said, dad on demand, and you have to give them that space to be able to do the things that they need to do to adult, to learn, to grow, but that's not always easy. So talk to me about what you've had to do to be able to get into that mindset or get yourself in that place where you can let go.

    Dai Manuel [00:12:00]:

    Wow. That's a great question. That's a really, really great question. And, you know, I'm like, geez. I wish I could've listened episode that gave me this information before. You know? So with us, actually, I'll bring it back a step for a second. The Wonder, how do I present? Well, I'm just gonna say it as it is. You know? Whatever.

    Dai Manuel [00:12:19]:

    I'll let that it'll come out in the wash. My daughter's both dating. Okay? They both had some boyfriends boyfriend. My eldest daughter just went through her 1st big breakup, so she's sort of in that state of being single again and figuring out what that looks like, but she's been in a long-term relationship for over three years with the same guy and great guy. We, like, became part of our family quite literally. And so us as his parents, Obviously, we could be very naive and think, wow. I thought they'd be together forever. You know, it's like she's barely 21.

    Dai Manuel [00:12:50]:

    Right? Forget about it. But There was that feeling of wanting to protect them emotionally and psychologically, being there to console them, to protect And guard them against any negative. But that was something that we had to try, and it's been easier for me than my wife. The Okay. She's had a hard time with this because we both have an idea of how she can handle things better. How can you handle the breakup a little bit better? What's the intention? Where are you going after this breakup? Like, really just asking some very specific questions that are challenging, but to also help her be more reflective, But also learn from this experience because that's the thing with kids. And, I mean, we can all probably attest to this. We've been in the exactly same place where it's like Done.

    Dai Manuel [00:13:34]:

    Moving on. Right? And it's like, well, listen. The only way we prevent patterns from happening again and again is you have to recognize there is a pattern or Set some intentions before a pattern is created. And so we found that wanting to have these conversations with our girls is very, very present for my wife and I, and we've had to stop trying to force those conversations. That has been one of the hardest things for us is to just let go and let them live their lives. Let them make mistakes because we see them making them. You don't believe me. Do you see what I'm making? I'm like, dude.

    Dai Manuel [00:14:08]:

    I've done that one, like, 10 times. You just listened to me. Maybe I could have saved you some Doesn't matter. They wanna do their thing, and it's been the hardest thing, man. Like, honestly, I struggle with it a lot. But a little case in point: As parents, I don't think we can ever 100% let go. We can. At least, I don't believe I can.

    Dai Manuel [00:14:25]:

    I think that would be impossible because I'm until the Day I die, they're still gonna be my little girls. You know? Like, I could be a 100-year-old. They could be, like, in their seventies, and they're still my little girls. Right? Like, whatever. I'm still gonna parent, though. And here's the thing. My youngest daughter has been in a relationship for a couple of years. The Guy's a really nice guy.

    Dai Manuel [00:14:45]:

    He's stand-up-ish, but he is young. Maturity isn't quite there yet because, I mean, they're both under 20. Right? Like, they're they're just young. But we've recognized that there's been some signs of toxicity in the relationship. Certain tendencies in communication, Dog. The way they talk to one another, the way that they communicate through text or TikTok or whatever they're talking through. Right? Like, There are just certain aspects that aren't respectful. And in fact, because of our knowledge and experience, you know, like, I work with a lot of men and I do men's coaching, etcetera, etcetera.

    Dai Manuel [00:15:18]:

    I've also done a lot of work for the last 15 years on myself when it comes to relationships. So I'm much more in tune and mindful of what I'm observing. And people are probably familiar with the four apocalypses. Right? The writers of, and I'm not talking about the biblical sense, but I'm talking about the relationship killers, You know, like stonewalling, right, or gaslighting. And there are certain habits that are killers when it comes to relationships, And that growth that we can actually experience being in a healthy relationship, you know, and we sort of, and it's often based around fear and insecurities and just not knowing a healthier way the doing things. We've started to recognize in our daughters some of these tendencies, whether they're on the receiving end or sometimes they're on the dishing end. And I had this great conversation with my youngest daughter where I don't normally meddle in relationship conversations. Okay, Chris? I don't.

    Dai Manuel [00:16:09]:

    I don't talk about that. I'm very surface when it comes to talking about relationships, and because I just know that that's something that they gotta work through, but also, being that they're girls, They relate better with my wife when talking about relationships. My wife is great with that. She likes dealing with that. So I know I'm sort of, like, the backup pinched hitter when needed. Okay? And I was needed. Coach put me in because we could tell that there was something very wrong, and there was a pattern that we wanted to deal with and address. I sat down with her.

    Dai Manuel [00:16:37]:

    You know, both of us are sitting there, but I just started to explain some of the things I was observing in her boyfriend, But also things I was observing in her, how they started to compromise on some of their values. Some of the things that they were attracted to initially are now becoming so biased to one way, meaning very controlling type of things, wanting to know where they're at because they're also in a distance relationship right now. So some of these added pressures have now been added in, and so we brought this up with her and educated her, but also empowered her with some language around this. And this is the win. A week later, she came back and said, I had a conversation with them, and it went amazing. We're both working on it. Like, just to see them take that, which was really sensitive, especially Giving them some relationship advice, right, or coaching or mentorship, but seeing her receive it and then actually go and try to apply it. It was like A very proud moment for me when I got them to pat me on the back.

    Dai Manuel [00:17:30]:

    I was like, yeah. It went. But even my wife, after the fact, she's like, you know what? That was exactly what she needed to hear. I don't get involved in those conversations very often, but when I do, I'm very specific in what I'm observing and try to share it in a way that's not antagonistic, more reflective, and more inquisitory. Right? Like, I'm here to ask more questions to help her come to that discovery. And so everything that I'm sharing right now, hopefully, is just giving people ideas of ways to maybe navigate some of the harder conversations because this is really when we start talking about vulnerability, right, and that ability to utilize vulnerability as a skill to deepen connection and understanding and relatability. So, yeah, that's really it right there. But I mean, I don't know if that answered your question fully, but I touched on it from both sides of the fence.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:15]:

    I think that so often, dads would not step into those conversations because you wanna give them that space. You want them to learn and grow. You want them to sometimes fail, but I love what you said there that there are times when you need to step in, and you need to show leadership, and you need to be able to help your child to be able to see things that may be right in front of them, But that they can't see.

    Dai Manuel [00:18:43]:

    Exactly. Spot on. And to be fair, I also the There's a book I recommend to a lot of men, and you could be a father or not a father. It doesn't matter. This book will be relevant, but it's called The Way of the Superior Man by David Dita. And just so you know, I know when I brought that book home the 1st time, my wife's like, what a chauvinistic book. She just looked at the title, and it does. It sounds extremely chauvinistic, But it is not what you think.

    Dai Manuel [00:19:07]:

    The way the superior man is really about this idea of what it means to be a great man or how to continuously evolve into a better version of oneself. But this speaks from a man representing a man's standpoint in their viewpoint. Great book. And so I had just reread that. So There were also some insights that I gleaned from that that I remembered from a couple of the chapters that was literally I could put it side by side what my daughter was the in her relationship. It was like the exact example shared in the book. So that also helped me with articulating, but also painting the picture. Sure.

    Dai Manuel [00:19:40]:

    But also Chris is the big one. And to echo exactly what you said, this idea about vulnerability and being able to step in, I shared some of my own past experiences where either I was on the receiving end or on the giving end and explaining how it made me feel and how it affected my relationships in the negative. So, being able to share that intimate knowledge with my daughter was also a piece that I could see just in her eyes when we were sharing that. It was just like it registered. Like, it was like, okay. I get it. This isn't like it's just a problem that I'm dealing with. This is a problem that everybody deals with.

    Dai Manuel [00:20:11]:

    Even my dad dealt with it. And I think one thing I've had to take The heart is I've been very selective about some of the past stories I share with my kids. You know? Like, until I did my TEDx talk a couple of years ago On vulnerability, but actually speaking about my challenges with alcohol for a good 15 years of my life, my daughters had no idea about that, and a lot of the things I shared in that talk. And I remember the day I gave that talk to them as a dry run-in one of my rehearsals the week before I actually went on the stage to do it. And remember their tears welling up and crying from a place of love, understanding, and respect. And, that was the best hug I ever had. In fact, the delivery of my TEDx Duck was far better than the one I did on the stage. But, again, it's all about this idea of sort of tapping into some of these emotions and learning how to better articulate them.

    Dai Manuel [00:20:58]:

    It is not easy at all. Full disclosure: it's hard, but it's also extremely worth it. And so I'd want to encourage and invite people to start doing it. Don't worry. You can't Chew this up. Okay? You can. Just the fact that your kids see you trying, wow, it will be inspiring, and it will bring you closer together with your kids.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:15]:

    Speaking of that TEDx talk, it makes me wanna transition and talk a little bit about your brand new podcast because you did just the Share that TEDx Talk on your podcast, The 2% Solution. And I guess, first and foremost, I mean, you've been out there for quite some time. Dog. You know, you've shared videos and, you know, you've done a lot on fitness and working with men and women, just people that want to live healthier lifestyles. And Now you've brought what you have been sharing from an exercise end, wholesale cyclical Doc. To the point of now talking about what you're calling the 2% solution. Talk to me about that. What is your goal with this podcast? Why now? And why is it important to get this message out?

    Dai Manuel [00:22:02]:

    Thanks, Chris. Well, first of all, my book that was published a while ago is now Doc. It was called the Whole Life Fitness Manifesto, and it was a resource that allows people to better understand how to get started with creating more whole-life health and well-being for themselves. And what I mean by whole-life fitness is that fitness is an action. It's an activity that will help move the needle forward in certain areas, in particular, health areas. Right? Like, we wanna see blood pressure decrease well. Start walking 5 times a week for 30 minutes a day, you know, drink some extra water, and increase your fiber intake. Wow.

    Dai Manuel [00:22:36]:

    Look. All of a sudden, those markers start to improve. So we can quantify things quite nicely, But we can also qualify based on how we feel once we've achieved the result. But this is more than just physical fitness. We can talk about emotional fitness. We can talk about spiritual fitness, Relationship fitness, and financial fitness. Right? This really implies the activities we're doing to see those areas get stronger, Healthier, and more resilient because it does imply intentional actions to see the results through. But a lot of us get confused.

    Dai Manuel [00:23:08]:

    What's the best action to start with? How often do I do it? The How do I do it? Why the hell do I even rather do this? You know, like, there there's all these big questions that sometimes we just skimp over. We don't give the the necessary Dime or attention to really get clear with ourselves on what's the path in front of us. A lot of the time, we just feel like we're bushwhacking. We got a big machete, and we're just trying to get our way through it as best we can, but it is not a very efficient way to travel. You're gonna get really tired, and you probably will give up because it's not very fun. The Whole Life Fitness Manifesto teaches people how to leverage 2% of every 24 hours. That's where the 2% solution comes in. 2% of every, 24 hours is almost almost 30 minutes a day.

    Dai Manuel [00:23:49]:

    So it's really 30 minutes. I just tell people 30 minutes. I'm rounding up a little bit, but it's 30 minutes a day of intentional activities to see your physical body, your mental and emotional body, as well as that spiritual body. And all these parts of you gain resiliency. Get healthier. The 2% Solution podcast is just an extension of that where I'm now talking to different guest Docs on different subjects and sharing some great actionable tips and strategies that can be applied in as little as 30 minutes a day. To see improvement in the area that those subject matter experts are speaking to. Also, on every Monday, I've got a Monday motivation, super short. The Episode is always less than 7 minutes, which sets you up mindset-wise for the week ahead.

    Dai Manuel [00:24:34]:

    And then Fridays, I have Fit Tip Fridays which sets some healthy intentions for the weekend. Because I know Mondays and Fridays are important days to get the mindset right. Monday for the week that we're about to experience, the Friday because usually, the weekends are when people let themselves go. It's a weekend, which is a break from the week. You know? It's like my vacation from the week, and that's often where I find my clients would let their guard down, their intentions down, and awfully undo, unfortunately, a lot of what they did during the week. And then they start the week over again, feeling like they're right back at 0 again. And it's like, oh, no. Let's. I'm gonna help you with this.

    Dai Manuel [00:25:09]:

    And so those 2 short episodes on Monday and Friday are really to get the mindset in the right place And give you actionable tips and tricks and strategies to take in the weekend. So it's 3 episodes a week. And why? Because I want to the Fire, motivate, and educate people, and I am always gonna strive to do it in a fun way. And what better avenue than a podcast? So that's Really It.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:29]:

    So you've put out a number of different episodes already, many of which have been the chapters of your book in talking about some of the things that you should be thinking about. Dog. And you've gotten to almost pretty much the end of the book in regards to those episodes. So what's next, and what is coming next the As you go down the path, you talked about the Monday Friday, but you're gonna have that midweek episode too. But what's the plan for the future?

    Dai Manuel [00:25:56]:

    Well, there are a few different aspects. I've recognized that this is really my own frustration. So out of my own necessity, I felt this idea is every time I have a guest on, we co-create an action sheet, a 1-page actionable sheet That summarizes the key things shared in the episode but also gives some actionable steps to start to implement the Some of the things talked about, and all those activities will always be less than 30 minutes a day. These resources will be accessible in the 2% Collective, which is the community of the 2% solution, and it's free for people to join. And, because, again, I want people to have access to the information so they can do something to see life get better. Because life only gets better when you start doing things. Okay? You can sit there and try to manifest the best life in the world, and that's great. You might have a very positive mindset, but unfortunately, just thinking about things doesn't necessarily make things Happen.

    Dai Manuel [00:26:54]:

    So we need to think about it. We need to reflect on it. We set some intentions, but now we go forward and do something. And so that's really the premise of the Podcast is to inspire people to do the right things for the right reasons to produce the right results. And in that, I feel I'd live in my purpose. Like, really, that's what it boils down to. I feel very fulfilled putting this kind of content out. And so in the future, I've already got over 100 people that have applied to be a guest.

    Dai Manuel [00:27:18]:

    So I've got plenty of amazing experts in so many different areas. I just recently had a conversation with somebody about some of the best strategies to release trauma In a healthy, constructive way, as well as how to use fitness. I just talked to somebody about the 3 best questions to ask if you wanna get very clear on what your values are. So there are all these sorts of types of people that are gonna be coming on to share this wisdom. And so, yeah, I'm just excited to be the conduit to get people the right Stop.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:44]:

    So let's talk action then. Right now someone, you know, so a person's listening, they're hearing this, they're saying, okay. I'm gonna check out this podcast, but today, I'm listening, and I wanna do something. I wanna do something to just start moving in the right direction. What's one thing that they can start doing today that'll start to kind of turn the tide in helping them to find that whole life fitness for themselves.

    Dai Manuel [00:28:10]:

    Well, there are two things I ask people to do a lot of the time. 22 little things. 1 involves fuel. The second one involves activity, and the 2 are not mutually exclusive, by the way. Okay? They tend to feed each other quite literally. But the first one is to start your day with a green smoothie. Just every day, have a green smoothie. People are like, well, what kind of green smoothie? What do I put in it? Don't worry.

    Dai Manuel [00:28:31]:

    I've got a free book on that. I've got a recipe book with 10 of my favorite green smoothie recipes. It's free. People can have it. I'll provide you with the link, Chris. You can share it in the show notes. So everybody's listening, you can get a copy of this. So there we go.

    Dai Manuel [00:28:44]:

    Get rid of that excuse. Right? I don't have the time. Yes. You do. Because here's the thing. It's starting your day with this injection of nutrient dense Food. And it's in a liquid form, so it's easier to consume. You can do it on the fly because I hear so many people; oh, I don't do breakfast because I'm just too busy.

    Dai Manuel [00:29:01]:

    Just, like, I can't. Mornings are too chaotic. Gotta get the kids to the school. I gotta do this, that. Yo. You need a good meal to start your day. A green smoothie is the best that I found, it works great for my lifestyle. I've been doing this for over 15 years.

    Dai Manuel [00:29:15]:

    This is how I start my day every day, and it's awesome. And I tell people, do it for two weeks and tell me it doesn't make your difference. So that's the challenge. Throwing down the gauntlet right now. Okay? Do it for 2 weeks. Now, 2nd to that, if you wanna really get even more out of this 2-week commitment, I invite people to walk for 30 minutes every day Outside at a brisk pace. I mean, it's not just some sort of saunter. Right? Like, you're you're going with the intention of elevating the heart rate a bit, Doc.

    Dai Manuel [00:29:42]:

    So you feel like you're actually working. And so just 30 minutes, and I always say listen to a podcast like Chris', you know, or some the piece of information. So you're at least injecting something positive into your mind while you're doing your walking. I know it's technically 3 activities, but it's really just 2, but 2 are as one. So that would be it, and I invite people. Just do that for 2 weeks. And I know they're probably thinking, well, I mean, I don't have to work out at the gym. I don't have to, like, you know, measure my food.

    Dai Manuel [00:30:06]:

    Like, the Hell no. Okay. Like, it's about doing something that's realistically going to move the needle, but also, I want you to feel how simple it was to move that needle. I want people to experience a win that feels more effortless to attain. And this is believe me. After 2 weeks of doing this, you're gonna start to sleep better. You're gonna be managing your stress better. You're gonna be making better decisions around your food because you start your day with something healthy.

    Dai Manuel [00:30:31]:

    It gets the energy in a great place. When you're feeling great, you don't wanna stop feeling great. So you instinctively will start to choose different fuel sources just automatically because of how you're feeling. Also, because of the movement, you're gonna start to see physicality change. Your heart rate's gonna get better. You're gonna handle stress a little bit more effectively because you're actually releasing a bit of stress. You also start to boost your metabolism. So you start to have more metabolic health, meaning that you're using a lot more of those calories you put into your body as well for a healthy thing.

    Dai Manuel [00:31:03]:

    These are just some of the high-level stuff that you can expect within just as little as 2 weeks. And then after two weeks, oh, believe me. There are so many different things you can do, but that's a great place to start.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:12]:

    Well, I appreciate that. I love that you threw down the gauntlet, and we'll definitely put a link in the notes today with your green smoothies and definitely, challenge Domino's. People to take you up on that challenge. Now if people wanna find out more about you, about your podcast, Where should they go?

    Dai Manuel [00:31:30]:

    On my website, Diamondwell.com or any social platform, Diamondwell. It's a nice thing about having a really Weird unique name. It's unencumbered everywhere. I'm the only one, but Dae is a Welsh name for David, dai. Manuel is Portuguese. It's m a n u e l. If you can spell it somewhat right, don't worry. You'll find me.

    Dai Manuel [00:31:50]:

    But as far as social, I'm most active on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram. Those are my three primary platforms. The primary ones that I tend to hang out on the most are my website, where I have lots of content and free resources. Over 1500 articles I've published over the last ten years. We're all geared toward helping people optimize their happiness, fulfillment, and joy in life. And so I always say, hey. Good luck, but it is a bit of a rabbit hole. So, when you go down the rabbit hole, be prepared. You're gonna get lots of great information, but you might find you're losing some time.

    Dai Manuel [00:32:19]:

    And I've had people message me like, oh my gosh. I was in there to read 1 article, and I ended up being on there for 2 hours. So, like, I always say thank you. And then, 2nd, thank you. Anyways but thanks for asking, Chris.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:30]:

    Although, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your story today about you and your daughters, the challenges that have been happening at your own home, and how each of us can find fitness in our own lives in small, independent ways; I wish you all the best.

    Dai Manuel [00:32:46]:

    Chris, thank you, and it's an honor to be back. Thank you for having me back, but I can't wait To switch roles and have you as a guest on my podcast; I'm throwing down another gauntlet. Boom. So those that are listening, You make sure you follow up with Chris to make sure he's getting on my podcast too. Anyway, I can't wait to have you on to talk about being a father with daughters, but especially the organization that you've cofounded, Fathering Together, and some of the amazing things you're doing there because that is something that we all need to learn more about, and I can't wait to have you on.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:33:18]:

    If you've enjoyed today's episode of the Dads with Daughters podcast, we invite you to check out the Fatherhood Insider. The Fatherhood Insider is the Dads With resource for any dad who wants to be the best dad that he can be. We know that no child comes with an instruction manual, and most dads are figuring it out as they go along. The And the Fatherhood Insider is full of resources and information that will up your game on fatherhood. Through our extensive course library, an interactive forum, step-by-step road maps, and more, You will engage and learn with experts, but more importantly, dads like you. So check it out atfatheringtogether.org. If you are a father of a daughter and have not yet joined the Dads with Daughters Facebook community, there's a link in the notes today.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:04]:

    Dad's with Daughters is a program of fathering together. We look forward to having you back for another great guest next week, all geared to helping you raise strong, empowered daughters And be the best dad that you can be.

    Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:16]:

    We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents. Bring your A-Game because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and musclemen. Get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

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