Afleveringen
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🎙️Award-winning journalist and Atlantic staff writer McKay Coppins joins us to explore the delicate intersections of politics, faith, and journalism. From shadowing Donald Trump to chronicling the political journey of Mitt Romney, McKay shares what it takes to pursue truth in turbulent times.
What We Discuss:
What it’s like getting rare access to Trump, Romney, and the Murdochs
How to navigate political rationalizations without losing your soul
McKay’s writing rituals and creative process
The powerful role of curiosity in building bridges across divides
Why faith and civic life matter more than ever
Episode Highlights:
00:02:00 – McKay’s infamous 2014 Trump profile and its surprising legacy00:10:00 – How luck and sincere curiosity lead to exclusive access00:16:00 – Late nights, caps lock, and McKay’s writing habits00:29:00 – The chilling effect of political intimidation on journalism00:41:00 – Why many GOP leaders stay silent—and what Romney heard behind the scenes00:50:00 – Do you lose your soul in politics? A deep dive00:57:00 – The spiritual vacuum in modern America and how faith might fill it01:02:00 – Why curiosity is the cure for today’s civic divide
Featured Quotes:
"He seemed like he desperately wanted affirmation all the time... and it was like empty calories." "To be somebody who has faith is to constantly have it tested and to have it evolve.""We need leaders thinking more about their obituaries than the next news cycle.""Curiosity is an underrated virtue in politics."
Resources Mentioned:
📘 Romney: A Reckoning – Simon and Schuster📘 The Wilderness – Hachette Book Group📰 McKay’s articles at The Atlantic – Visit
📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this episode, host Corey Nathan shares a candid reflection about a recent encounter where he was right on the facts and the law—but completely wrong in how he presented them. Yet if we're honest with ourselves about when we make mistakes, it's a good opportunity to learn, reminding us that how we communicate is just as important as what we communicate.
What You’ll Learn:
Why being right on the law isn’t enough in a conversation
How righteous anger can derail productive dialogue
Why due process matters for everyone—especially those who aren't guilty of crimes
Tools for engaging in hard conversations with empathy and curiosity
How the Constitution and Judeo-Christian values intersect in public discourse
Episode Highlights:
[00:02:00] Corey introduces the story and the key lesson he learned
[00:05:00] Breakdown of the Alien Enemies Act and a real legal case
[00:06:45] A stranger challenges Corey at a restaurant
[00:07:30] Corey "goes Jersey" and loses his cool
[00:13:00] What due process really protects and why it matters
[00:16:00] How Isaac Saul, David Brooks, and Mónica Guzmán inspired a better way to respond
[00:18:00] Reading the First and Fifth Amendments to ground the conversation
Featured Quotes:
"I was completely right on the facts, but I was completely wrong on the delivery." — Corey Nathan"Due process is there for the innocent just as much as the guilty—even more so for the innocent." — Corey Nathan"Ask at least three questions before making your point." — inspired by Isaac Saul📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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Zijn er afleveringen die ontbreken?
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In this episode, we sit down with Isaac Saul, founder of Tangle, a widely respected, nonpartisan political newsletter. Isaac and his team bring a fresh approach to political journalism by curating multiple perspectives—right, left, and independent—on major stories of the day. Corey, a fan and avid reader of Tangle, dives deep into Isaac’s upbringing in Bucks County, PA, how that shaped his civic “multilingualism,” and the genesis of Tangle during a particularly difficult phase of his career. Together, they explore the challenges of journalistic ethics, political polarization, media bias, and the future of trustworthy news.
What We Discuss:
Why Bucks County, PA, is so friggin' awesome! And why it plays a crucial role in shaping moderate political thinkers.
How Isaac Saul built Tangle from the ground up as a response to media frustration.
The journalistic principles and ethical guardrails that guide Isaac’s work.
How to discern quality journalism in an era dominated by clickbait and misinformation.
The dangers of polarization and what gives Isaac hope about our democratic future.
Episode Highlights:
[00:01:00] Isaac Saul shares the mission behind Tangle and what inspired him to create it.
[00:05:00] Corey and Isaac explore how growing up in politically diverse Bucks County cultivated empathy and civic fluency.
[00:10:00] Isaac discusses his unique way of reaching conspiracy-minded friends—by “using their language” and exposing financial incentives in media.
[00:15:00] Isaac describes his journalistic background and the importance of reporting with integrity and skepticism.
[00:24:00] Isaac recounts his “f*** this” moment that led to launching Tangle after being rejected from multiple major outlets.
[00:34:00] Corey explains his methodical approach to reading Tangle and how it helps refine his own viewpoints.
[00:40:00] Behind the scenes: How Isaac and his team choose stories and fairly represent both sides of complex political issues.
[00:54:00] Isaac shares his hopes and fears about political division, executive overreach, and the role of media in democracy.
Featured Quotes:
"The people who are really politically engaged on the right and the left right now are living in just different realities." – Isaac Saul"I know what I think. It’s the least interesting thing on the planet. I live with this brain all day. I want to hear what others think." – Isaac Saul"You should treat every click like you're handing a news outlet a dollar." – Isaac Saul"Centrism is an ideology in and of itself. I’m not trying to land in the middle—I’m just being honest about my real reactions." – Isaac SaulResources Mentioned:
Tangle Newsletter – www.readtangle.comIsaac Saul’s TED Talk: “What Media Doesn’t Tell You” – youtu.be/543mYKKh1EE?si=CjdQv94HzT04vknhHow Media Bias Works (Tangle article) – www.readtangle.com/why-the-media-is-broken/Isaac on Twitter: x.com/Ike_Saul📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this deeply moving episode, Corey Nathan welcomes Rabbi Sharon Brous, the senior and founding rabbi of IKAR, a groundbreaking Jewish community based in Los Angeles. Rabbi Brous is also the author of The Amen Effect: Ancient Wisdom to Heal Our Hearts and Mend Our Broken World. Together, they explore ancient traditions, mental health, spiritual leadership, and how to foster deeper, more compassionate human connections even across profound divides.
What We Discuss:
The ancient ritual of turning toward the brokenhearted and its modern relevance.
The profound impact of being seen and embraced in moments of vulnerability.
How leaders carry and process communal pain—and why that matters.
Practical wisdom on staying curious and compassionate across ideological divides.
The role of community design in spiritual experiences.
Episode Highlights:
[00:01:00] Rabbi Brous explains the Mishnah Middot and the ritual of turning toward the brokenhearted.
[00:08:00] Corey and Rabbi Brous discuss the concept of sin as a burden like mental illness.
[00:15:00] The transformative power of being truly seen and how crying makes space for new realities.
[00:20:00] Rabbi Brous reflects on the toll leadership can take and how caregivers must process pain.
[00:24:00] The design of IKAR’s prayer space and how it fosters visibility and community.
[00:34:00] Navigating discomfort with changes in religious leadership and traditions.
[00:42:00] How to stay at the table with those who hurt or anger us—and why it’s critical.
[00:53:00] A powerful story about transformation through simple presence and blessing.
Featured Quotes:
"Sometimes you don’t even want to get out of bed. Yet, sacred tradition compels us to show our brokenness—and trust that we will be held with love." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"If you don’t metabolize pain, it will metastasize inside of you." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"We can create new neural and spiritual pathways—by allowing ourselves to be seen and to receive love." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
"It takes courage to be curious about someone who hurt you, but that’s the only way to heal." — Rabbi Sharon Brous
Resources Mentioned:
The Amen Effect by Rabbi Sharon Brous: https://ikar.org/the-amen-effect/the-big-idea/
IKAR Jewish Community: https://www.ikar.org/
How to Know a Person by David Brooks: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/652822/how-to-know-a-person-by-david-brooks/
Fierce Love by Rev. Dr. Jacqui Lewis: https://jacquijlewis.com/fierce-love/
I Never Thought of It That Way by Mónica Guzmán: https://www.moniguzman.com/book
📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this heartfelt and wide-ranging episode, host Corey Nathan sits down with a very special guest — his own son, Emerson Riley Nathan. Together, they dive into Gen Z’s unique perspective on faith, politics, and culture. As a young adult navigating the complexities of belief, identity, and creativity, Emerson offers refreshing candor about his spiritual journey, social views, and passion for music. This conversation is an inspiring look at how different generations can engage in meaningful, respectful dialogue.
What You Will Learn:
Insights into Gen Z's evolving relationship with faith and spiritualityHow Emerson balances skepticism and open-mindedness about religionThe impact of politics and social media on young people's worldviewHow music and community-building are vital for mental health and connectionThe dynamic of a father and son having open, vulnerable discussions about big life questionsEpisode Highlights:
[00:01:00] – Emerson's "graveyard shift" lifestyle and its impact on his creativity[00:03:00] – Emerson shares his journey growing up between Christianity and Judaism[00:07:00] – How the 2012 election and political polarization shaped Emerson’s views[00:11:00] – Moving away from organized religion and questioning traditional beliefs[00:20:00] – Emerson's current agnostic beliefs and embracing uncertainty about the afterlife[00:27:00] – The healing power of kindness and defining what it means to be good[00:32:00] – Emerson’s passion for dubstep, rave culture, and community through music[00:45:00] – Corey and Emerson discuss responsible adulthood, fatherhood, and finding purpose[00:59:00] – How politics today have created both division and a sense of helplessnessResources Mentioned:
Sugar Magnacious on InstagramDebased Sound on Instagram📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this episode, we welcome back political journalist and author Will Saletan. Will, formerly of Slate and now a writer for The Bulwark, is known for his sharp insights on American democracy, political corruption, and authoritarianism. Will reflects on the pivotal events leading up to and following the 2024 election, including Joe Biden’s withdrawal, Kamala Harris’s campaign, and Donald Trump's return to power. This thought-provoking conversation dives into the state of democracy, the rise of authoritarianism, and how ordinary Americans are responding.
What You Will LearnHow Will Saletan processed the chaotic political landscape leading up to the 2024 election.
Why many Americans seem indifferent to threats against constitutional rights.
Will’s analysis of Trump’s authoritarian tendencies and the implications for democracy.
The emerging role of European allies as America’s commitment to NATO and democracy weakens.
Practical strategies for handling misinformation and toxic discourse on social media.
Episode Highlights[00:01:00] Introduction to Will Saletan and a reflection on major events since their last conversation.
[00:03:00] Will discusses his surprise at Biden’s physical and verbal deterioration during the 2024 campaign.
[00:07:00] The challenges Kamala Harris faced stepping into the race and why the "change election" dynamic mattered.
[00:11:00] Corey and Will examine why many Americans rationalized or minimized January 6th.
[00:23:00] Will explains how fear and profit motive lead companies and law firms to capitulate to authoritarian pressures.
[00:29:00] How self-censorship and fear of government retribution are stifling free speech.
[00:54:00] Will shares the "general idea" he’s concluded about the Trump administration: incompetence and stupidity at historic levels.
[01:03:00] Hope on the horizon: how European nations are stepping up to defend democratic values.
[01:06:00] Final reflections on the resilience of democracy beyond America’s current political struggles.
Featured QuotesWill Saletan: "What clicks for me is very simple: they’re idiots. They're really stupid, and they think they're smart."
Will Saletan: "The danger isn’t just the lies themselves—it's the machinery of intimidation that stops people from even trying to tell the truth."
Corey Nathan: "It's encouraging when you realize people are so much more than the hat they might wear."
Will Saletan: "Even though America has faltered, there’s still goodness in the world—and it’s stepping up."
Resources MentionedWill Saletan at The Bulwark
Will's book: The Corruption of Lindsey Graham: A Case Study in The Rise of Authoritarianism
Will on Bluesky - @saletan.bsky.social
(Note: If Will referenced any other external resources or books you want linked specifically, just let me know!)
📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this solo episode, host Corey Nathan takes a deep dive into one of the foundational guidelines we've used in curating conversations both in person and online: handling misinformation. Corey reflects on his experiences moderating political and religious discussions, the evolution of social media moderation, and the fine balance between protecting free speech and maintaining civil discourse. We invite listeners into an honest exploration of free expression, civic engagement, and fostering better conversations, even with those we deeply disagree with.
What We Discuss:
Why it could be worth rethinking the rule to report and remove proven falsehoods from these forums.
The importance of understanding the First Amendment and time, place, and manner restrictions on free speech.
How maintaining civil discourse matters more than ever, even with the spread of misinformation.
Reflections on the lessons learned from controversial public conversations, like Gavin Newsom’s podcast guests and protests on college campuses.
How personal experiences during the pandemic and political unrest shaped Corey's approach to moderating tough conversations.
Episode Highlights:
[00:03:00] Corey’s initial set of rules for moderating conversations on social media.
[00:08:00] Why platforms like Meta and Twitter are no longer actively flagging misinformation.
[00:10:00] Revisiting the meaning of the First Amendment and its application to private forums.
[00:18:00] Discussing time, place, and manner restrictions in the context of campus protests and public demonstrations.
[00:23:00] Reflecting on the events of January 6th and the perpetuation of election fraud narratives.
[00:36:00] Learning from Gavin Newsom’s engagement with controversial figures like Steve Bannon and Charlie Kirk.
[00:43:00] Why civil engagement—even with those we strongly disagree with—might be more powerful than silencing falsehoods.
[00:52:00] Corey’s updated stance: allowing proven falsehoods to remain visible for educational and relational purposes.
Featured Quotes:
"Congress shall make no law... but that doesn’t mean I, a private individual, can’t curate conversations in my own forums."
"When we disagree is when it’s most important to protect free speech."
"Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Let the worst ideas stand up to scrutiny."
"Staying in relationship with those we disagree with gives us a better chance to understand and grow."
Resources Mentioned:
The Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression (FIRE)
Gavin Newsom’s Podcast
📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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This conversation with David Brooks was a real highlight. We originally recorded our talk just after his most recent book HOW TO KNOW A PERSON was released. Enjoy.
You might recognize David Brooks from his columns in The New York Times or his essays in The Atlantic. Perhaps you’ve seen him on PBS NewsHour or Meet the Press. He’s also a prolific author. In fact, his 2019 book The Second Mountain was a major inspiration for this program. We discuss that as well as David’s new book, How to Know a Person: The Art of Seeing Others Deeply and Being Deeply Seen (Penguin Random House).
Our conversation with "Brooksie" went in a number of surprising directions:
Sociological observations (and confessions) of New York Mets fans;The way lifelong friends enrich our lives;Depression - fair warning that this section gets pretty gritty and candid;How, as observant Jews, we both discovered Christianity later in life;As Jews who are Christian, whether we have any ambivalence;American Evangelicalism - talk about ambivalence!David's writing process and the motivation of deadlines;and much, much more!Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what’s broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it.
Please support our wonderful sponsor Meza Wealth Management:
www.mezawealth.com
And you can find Corey on all the socials @coreysnathan such as
www.threads.net/@coreysnathan.
David's new book HOW TO KNOW A PERSON:
www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/652822/how-to-know-a-person-by-david-brooks
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In this episode, host Corey Nathan welcomes back Monica Guzmán, Senior Fellow for Public Practice at Braver Angels, host of A Braver Way podcast, CEO of Reclaim Curiosity, and author of I Never Thought of It That Way: How to Have Fearlessly Curious Conversations in Dangerously Divided Times. Monica’s mission is to help bridge America’s political divides through fearless curiosity. With deep reflections on the 2024 election, evolving friendships across ideological lines, and her renewed commitment to bridge building, Monica shares how we can stay grounded and connected—especially when it feels impossible.
What We Discuss:How Moni processes political polarization and stays grounded—even when the world feels dividedPractical strategies for engaging with people across ideological lines without compromising your valuesWhy shared outrage across political lines can be a gateway to unityThe role of empathy, humility, and curiosity in depolarizing conversationsHow journalists and moderators can better navigate falsehoods without censoring legitimate concernsEpisode Highlights:[00:03:00] – Mónica explains how her emotional radar helps her know when to seek out conversations with people who see politics differently.[00:08:00] – Unexpected agreement: conservatives and liberals are both frustrated with Congressional dysfunction and executive overreach.[00:14:00] – Moni shares how talking with people who had different experiences during COVID reshaped her understanding and empathy.[00:21:00] – Corey and Mónica discuss boundaries in bridge building—when is it time to walk away from a relationship?[00:29:00] – Moderating contentious conversations: “police the structure, not the content.”[00:36:00] – The relationship between activism and dialogue—and why one without the other can be reckless or ineffective.[00:46:00] – Tips for recognizing quality journalism and avoiding emotionally manipulative content.[00:56:00] – Mónica’s closing advice: engagement is not endorsement. Curiosity and conversation don’t mean you’re compromising your values.Featured Quotes:“I’ve been persuaded over and over again that positions against mine are not ludicrous.” – Mónica Guzmán“Engagement is not endorsement. Having a conversation doesn’t mean you’re capitulating.” – Mónica Guzmán“Find your edge—and push it. That’s all you need to do to build a bridge.” – Mónica Guzmán“I don't want a decision or a position to get in the way of our relationship. I want to understand it better.” – Corey NathanResources Mentioned:I Never Thought of It That Way by Monica Guzmán - moniguzman.com/bookBraver Angels - braverangels.org📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors:
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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Can we bridge the partisan divide and have constructive dialogue about politics and religion with "them" - people who have different beliefs about democracy, politics and religion? Are we able to simply have civil, civic conversations?
(We're grateful to have a number of new listeners. So we thought it'd be good to revisit this episode that was first aired just after the inauguration.)
In this edition, host Corey Nathan explores how we can have meaningful, respectful, and productive conversations with those who think differently from us—politically, religiously, and ideologically. After four years of hosting the show and speaking with a wide array of guests, Corey shares his own insights, offering seven practical tools (plus a bonus tip) for engaging with “one of them” in a way that fosters connection rather than division.
What Is DiscussedHow to give yourself and others grace in difficult conversationsThe importance of setting proper expectations when discussing sensitive topicsWhy asking the right questions is more powerful than having the perfect comebackHow storytelling can humanize those with whom we disagreeThe value of being open to the phrase "I never thought of it that way"How to recognize when it’s time to step away from a conversation or to love someone "from a safe distance"Resources and organizations that can help you navigate difficult discussionsEpisode Highlights⏳ [00:02:00] – Reviews from listeners: the good, the bad, and the constructive⏳ [00:05:00] – The purpose of this episode: sharing tools for engaging with "one of them"⏳ [00:06:00] – Tool #1: Grace – Accepting that we will all make mistakes in these conversations⏳ [00:09:00] – Tool #2: Proper Expectations – Why we shouldn't expect to change someone's mind 180 degrees⏳ [00:12:00] – Tool #3: Asking Questions – Learning from Jesus' approach of responding with questions⏳ [00:20:00] – Tool #4: Storytelling – The power of narrative in understanding each other as human beings⏳ [00:25:00] – Tool #5: Being Open to "I Never Thought of It That Way" Moments⏳ [00:32:00] – Tool #6: Recognizing Your Line – Knowing when to step away from an unhealthy dynamic⏳ [00:35:00] – Tool #7: Equipping Yourself – Books, organizations, and resources for learning how to engage better⏳ [00:38:00] – Bonus Tip: Taking Care of Yourself – Mental, emotional, and physical well-being in this work
Featured Quotes📢 “Give yourself grace. You’re not going to get it right every time.”📢 “If we ask the right question, it allows that person, instead of being in a posture of combat, to tell their story.” 📢 “Trying to inform, like trying to win, can get in the way of trying to listen.” – Monica Guzmán (as quoted in the episode)📢 “People are mysteries, not puzzles.” – Monica Guzmán
Resources Mentioned📖 Books:
I Never Thought of It That Way – by Mónica GuzmánHow to Know a Person – by David Brooks🌍 Organizations:
The Village Square – Encouraging healthy civic discourseBraver Angels – Bridging political divides through dialogue🎥 Watch & Support the Podcast:
YouTube Channel – Subscribe for video contentPatreon – Support the show📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com🔹 Now go talk some politics and religion—but with gentleness and respect. 💡
#Politics #Religion #NeverTrump #Democracy #Faith #Justice #Civility #Polarization
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In this episode, host Corey Nathan reconnects with his longtime friend Gary Keifer, an expat currently living in Peru. Gary brings a refreshingly honest and “untethered” perspective to U.S. politics, unfiltered by party loyalty or institutional affiliation. With a background in comedy, improv, and theater, Gary offers thoughtful insights rooted in personal experience and global observations. The conversation spans topics from immigration and working-class politics to why Gary abstained from discussing American politics for years—until now. Together, Corey and Gary exemplify what it means to engage in civil discourse across ideological lines.
What We Discuss:Why Gary calls himself an "untethered expat" and what that means for his political views.How the Clinton-era Democratic strategy toward the working class contributed to the rise of Trump.Why immigration is the central issue Gary believes needs urgent resolution—and how both parties have failed on it.The limitations of elite political commentary and the value of everyday perspectives.Why Trump’s populism appeals to working-class voters despite his billionaire status.The potential dangers of overreaching political mandates and ignoring opposing voices.Episode Highlights:[00:02:00] – Corey introduces Gary, a longtime friend with a unique expat perspective on U.S. politics.[00:04:30] – Gary explains his belief in choosing “common people” over public figures for meaningful conversations.[00:08:00] – Why Gary broke his two-year vow of not discussing U.S. politics.[00:10:30] – How Bill Clinton’s shift away from labor shaped modern political realignment.[00:16:00] – A comedic (and thought-provoking) take on Trump’s origin story and Steve Bannon’s influence.[00:30:00] – Gary criticizes both parties for exploiting immigration and creating a caste system.[00:34:00] – Corey and Gary analyze Biden’s early decisions and whether reversing Trump-era immigration policies was a political mistake.[00:45:00] – The bipartisan immigration deal Trump blocked—and what it reveals about political strategy.[01:00:00] – Gary pleads: “Just give Trump the win on immigration so we can move on.”Featured Quotes:“Fascism doesn't just appear out of nowhere. It fills a void left by something else.” – Gary Keifer“You can’t skip Chapter One of fascism—how we got here matters.” – Gary Keifer“Compromise is the substrate of democracy.” – Corey Nathan“At the end of the day, we're just regular guys trying to have conversations most people are avoiding.” – Corey Nathan📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
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In this conversation, host Corey Nathan welcomes back Peter Wehner, contributing writer at The Atlantic and The New York Times, senior fellow at the Trinity Forum, and author of multiple books including The Death of Politics and City of Man. A former speechwriter for President George W. Bush, Pete brings a unique perspective shaped by his deep political experience, Christian faith, and unwavering moral compass. Together, Corey and Pete engage in a wide-ranging conversation on the 2024 election, the moral health of our nation, the role of the church, and the constitutional implications of a second Trump presidency.
What We Discuss:
How Pete Wehner processed the pivotal moments of the 2024 election, including Biden’s withdrawal and Kamala Harris’s campaignWhy Donald Trump’s reelection reveals unsettling truths about American society and the churchHow constitutional crises might unfold under Trump’s second termWhy thinkers like Vaclav Havel, Solzhenitsyn, and Tocqueville are essential guides in this political momentHow to have more effective and empathetic conversations across political and religious dividesEpisode Highlights:
[00:01:00] – Introduction to Pete Wehner’s background and career[00:02:00] – Pete reflects on Biden’s debate performance and why he felt Biden should have withdrawn sooner[00:05:00] – Analysis of Kamala Harris’s campaign, debate performance, and what ultimately cost her the election[00:09:00] – The moral reckoning: what Trump’s reelection says about American voters and the church[00:14:00] – Pete dissects why evangelicals have remained loyal to Trump and how rationalizations took hold[00:27:00] – A 30-page email exchange: Pete’s attempt to reason with a high-profile Trump supporter and what it revealed[00:34:00] – Trump’s “appetite for revenge”: Pete outlines troubling actions already taken in just 60 days of Trump’s second term[00:41:00] – Defining a constitutional crisis and what happens when a president defies court rulings[00:46:00] – Finding hope and moral clarity through leaders like Havel, Solzhenitsyn, and Tocqueville[00:50:00] – The TP&R question: Pete's insights on how to build better conversations across our differencesFeatured Quotes:
“Donald Trump is president because of the white evangelical vote. He touched something deep in the hearts of many Christians—and that should trouble us.” – Peter Wehner
“Hope is not the conviction that something will turn out well; it’s the certainty that something makes sense, regardless of how it turns out.” – Vaclav Havel (quoted by Pete)
“We're moving toward a constitutional crisis... If Trump defies a court order, we may find out how many divisions Chief Justice John Roberts really has.” – Peter Wehner
“We have to prioritize human relationships. The ripple effects for the country can be healthy.” – Peter Wehner
Resources Mentioned:
Peter Wehner’s articles in The Atlantic: https://www.theatlantic.com/author/peter-wehner/Peter Wehner’s columns in The New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/column/peter-wehner“The Power of the Powerless” by Vaclav Havel: https://www.nonviolent-conflict.org/resource/the-power-of-the-powerless/The Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn: https://www.amazon.com/Gulag-Archipelago-1918-1956-Experiment-Investigation/dp/0061253804Democracy in America by Alexis de Tocqueville: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/815/815-h/815-h.htm📣 Call to Action:If you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
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In this episode, we explore some essential tools for navigating difficult conversations in today’s polarized world. After all, we are part of The Democracy Group! And our goal with TDG and this program is to foster respectful, insightful discussions on politics, religion, and other sensitive topics—without resorting to hostility.
In this solo episode, Corey shares practical strategies for setting boundaries, "clearing the brush" (i.e. assumptions), and focusing on meaningful conversations rather than debates.
📌 What We Discuss:✅ Why having clear boundaries is crucial for productive dialogue✅ How to recognize and avoid being drawn into unproductive interrogations✅ The importance of "clearing the brush" (i.e. assumptions) and engaging in genuine conversations✅ Why listening and storytelling are more powerful than debating facts✅ How building relationships—not just “winning” arguments—creates lasting change
⏳ Episode Highlights:🕒 [00:00:00] – Welcome & Calls to Action: Corey shares updates on YouTube, podcast subscriptions, and Patreon.🕒 [00:06:00] – The Big Question: How do we engage in tough conversations without falling into arguments?🕒 [00:07:00] – Setting Boundaries: Recognizing when a conversation is an interrogation vs. a genuine exchange.🕒 [00:10:00] – Admitting Limitations: The power of saying, "I’m not an expert."🕒 [00:14:00] – No Need to Defend What You Don’t Believe: Why you don’t have to argue every point.🕒 [00:21:00] – Clearing the Brush: Breaking down stereotypes and assumptions before real discussions can begin.🕒 [00:26:00] – Seeking Conversations, Not Contests: The difference between dialogue and debate.🕒 [00:32:00] – The Daryl Davis Approach: How listening has led KKK members to renounce their beliefs.🕒 [00:35:00] – Final Thoughts: Tools for better discussions and how to support the podcast.
💬 Featured Quotes:🗣️ “There is no need to submit to an interrogation. If you want to have a conversation, let’s have a conversation.” – Corey Nathan
🗣️ “I don’t have to defend a position that I don’t hold.” – Corey Nathan
🗣️ “The road to solving a lot of what ails us is not in winning debates—it’s in having healthier conversations.” – Corey Nathan
🗣️ “Conversations lead to relationships, and relationships lead to epiphanies.” – Corey Nathan
📚 Resources Mentioned:🔗 Daryl Davis – Watch his TED Talk🔗 Braver Angels – Building Bridges Across Political Divides
📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
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Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.com🔥 Final Thought:Go out and have better conversations. Set boundaries, clear the brush, and seek dialogue—not debates. See you next time on Talkin’ Politics & Religion Without Killin’ Each Other! 🎙️
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In this episode, host Corey Nathan sits down with Charlie Sykes, a prominent conservative commentator, former talk radio host, and founder of The Bulwark, who's currently writing and podcasting on his excellent Substack To the Contrary. Known for his sharp political insights and willingness to challenge the current trajectory of the Republican Party, Charlie discusses the erosion of democratic norms, the transformation of conservatism, and what the future holds for both parties.
📌 What We DiscussHow the Republican Party shifted from traditional conservatism to a Trump-dominated movement.Why democracy faces real threats in the U.S. and globally.The importance of character in political leadership and why many conservatives abandoned this principle.Whether a pro-democracy coalition can hold back extremism in both parties.Charlie's thoughts on how we can have better political conversations without dehumanizing each other.⏳ Episode Highlights🔹 [00:01:00] Charlie’s Journey: From influential conservative talk radio host to political outcast in the Trump era.🔹 [00:05:00] The Evolution of Trumpism: Why Trump 2.0 is even more dangerous than his first presidency.🔹 [00:12:00] Engaging With Trump Supporters: Is it possible to change minds, or should we focus on mobilizing pro-democracy voters?🔹 [00:22:00] The Republican Party’s Transformation: How the far-right fringe became the mainstream.🔹 [00:35:00] Can Democrats Avoid the Same Mistakes? Learning from the GOP's takeover by extremists.🔹 [00:47:00] America’s Role in the World: Why the U.S. is no longer seen as the leader of the free world.🔹 [01:02:00] Building Bridges Across Differences: The importance of assuming goodwill and finding shared values.
💬 Featured Quotes"I’d rather be right than Marco Rubio right now." – Charlie Sykes"The Republican Party had multiple off-ramps to reject Trumpism, and they took none of them." – Charlie Sykes"We are living through history, and we don’t have the luxury of indifference." – Charlie Sykes"The challenge isn’t just about talking politics—it’s about figuring out how to get through this without killing each other." – Corey Nathan
📚 Resources MentionedCharlie Sykes’ Substack Newsletter: To the ContraryCharlie’s 2018 book: How the Right Lost Its MindThe Identity Trap by Yascha Mounk📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
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Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this episode, host Corey Nathan shares his candid thoughts on hope, concerns about the state of democracy, and the importance of engaging in meaningful conversations. Inspired by recent discussions with David French and Charlie Sykes, Corey explores whether he remains hopeful about the future—both at the national level and in his local community.
What You Will LearnThe state of American democracy and the balance of powerHow the First Amendment is being threatenedWhy the judicial branch has been a critical check on executive overreachThe role of civil discourse in bridging ideological dividesHow personal relationships offer reasons for hopeEpisode Highlights[00:00:00] – Introduction: Exploring the question of hope in today’s political climate[00:01:30] – Why Corey is concerned about the balance of power in government[00:05:00] – The judicial branch as a key safeguard against executive overreach[00:07:30] – Threats to First Amendment rights, including freedom of speech and the press[00:12:00] – The rise of online hostility and how it impacts public discourse[00:18:00] – Finding hope through local engagement and personal relationships[00:22:00] – The power of human connection in bridging political divides
Featured Quotes"I have concerns about the balance of power and our First Amendment rights—but that doesn't mean I’m without hope."
"When we engage with each other at the local level, it becomes about relationships instead of transactions."
"If we really want to change things, we have to start by recognizing each other's humanity."
📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackOur Sponsors
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this episode, we welcome back David French, columnist for The New York Times, former constitutional attorney, and author of Divided We Fall. We discuss the current state of American democracy, the challenges of political division, and how we can engage in civil discourse despite deep ideological differences. David also shares a personal update on his family and reflects on the profound trials and growth that come with adversity.
📌 What We Discuss:✔️ How David and his family navigated the challenges of a serious health crisis.✔️ The rise of political polarization and the factors driving it.✔️ Why distinguishing between “unwise, unethical, and unlawful” is crucial in analyzing political actions.✔️ How consuming different perspectives (even opposing ones) helps in understanding political dynamics.✔️ The role of Christian values in politics and how they are being redefined.
⏳ Episode Highlights📍 [00:01:00] – David French’s background and his journey from litigation to journalism.📍 [00:02:30] – Personal update: David shares his wife Nancy’s battle with cancer and their journey as a family.📍 [00:06:00] – How to navigate personal trials while maintaining faith and resilience.📍 [00:10:00] – The danger of political paranoia and the pitfalls of extreme polarization.📍 [00:18:00] – The "friend-enemy" paradigm in American politics and its influence in Christian fundamentalism.📍 [00:24:00] – Revisiting Divided We Fall: How America’s divisions have devolved since 2020.📍 [00:40:00] – The categories and differences of unwise, unethical, and unlawful political actions.📍 [00:55:00] – The balance between justice, kindness, and humility in political engagement.📍 [01:00:00] – The After Party initiative: A Christian approach to politics focused on values rather than policy.
💬 Featured Quotes🔹 "You don't know who you truly are until your values are tested." – David French🔹 "If we focus on the relational, we can have better conversations even across deep differences." – Corey Nathan🔹 "Justice, kindness, and humility—if you're missing one, you're doing it wrong." – David French🔹 "The United States has a history of shifting without repenting. We just move on." – David French
📚 Resources MentionedDavid French’s Writing: New York TimesDavid’s Book: Divided We FallThe After Party Initiative – More InfoAdvisory Opinions Podcast (with Sarah Isgur & David French) – Listen Here📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackDavid French:🔗 Twitter | BlueSky | New York Times
Our Sponsors
Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep talking politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️💡
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In this episode we dive into the complex issue of Ukraine, America's involvement, and the broader implications for democracy and global alliances. This episode is an exploration of how we can develop reasoned positions on global conflicts, engage in informed discussions, and recognize the limitations of our own expertise.
What We DiscussHow to approach discussions about Ukraine with a reasoned, principled perspective.The importance of distinguishing between facts and opinions in political discourse.How to recognize and rely on credible experts rather than self-appointed commentators.Strategies for engaging in meaningful conversations with those who hold different views.Why shared values and historical context matter in forming ethical positions.Episode Highlights[00:01:00] – Corey introduces the topic, emphasizing the importance of forming reasoned opinions based on principles rather than political affiliations.
[00:04:00] – The rise of divisive, “owning the libs” mentalities in political discourse and the shift away from virtues like decency and integrity.
[00:06:00] – Discussion of a powerful article by Dr. Russell Moore on the moral costs of ignoring Ukraine’s plight and the dangers of moral relativism in international affairs.
[00:09:00] – The importance of verifying facts through reputable sources like the Council on Foreign Relations, rather than relying on partisan opinionators.
[00:13:00] – Why experts like Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Anne Applebaum and military expert Alexander Vindman are critical voices in understanding the Ukraine conflict.
[00:18:00] – The dangers of allowing misinformation to shape public opinion and the tactics used in political debates to shift blame and avoid accountability.
[00:24:00] – Strategies for having better conversations, including finding shared values, hunting for points of agreement, and engaging with intellectual humility.
[00:28:00] – A reflection on balancing justice, kindness, and humility in both personal interactions and global politics, inspired by Micah 6:8.
Featured Quotes🗣 “We can formulate reasoned positions on complicated issues, including Ukraine, by starting with principles rather than political affiliations.”
🗣 “Opinion is not fact. There’s a difference between listening to a trusted expert and being swayed by a partisan commentator.”
🗣 “What does the Lord require of you but to do justice, to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God...” – Micah 6:8
Resources MentionedDr. Russell Moore’s Essay – The Moral Cost of Murdering UkraineAnne Applebaum’s Article – The End of the Post-War World Council on Foreign Relations – Ukraine Conflict Updates (CFR)Alexander Vindman’s Book – The Folly of Realism: How the West Deceived Itself About Russia and Betrayed UkraineRoss Douthat’s Opinion Piece – Trump and Vance Are Stripping Away Foreign Policy Illusions 📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation and subscribe on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
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Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s keep the conversation going—respectfully and thoughtfully! 🎙️✨
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In this episode we sit down with Congressman Ritchie Torres, a fighter from the Bronx who has spent his life advocating for his community. We discuss pressing issues such as the social safety net, housing inequality, mental health, bipartisanship, and Rep. Torres’ personal journey from public housing to Congress. We also touch on Israel, antisemitism, and the future of American democracy.
What We Discuss:How Congressman Torres’ personal experiences with poverty and public housing shaped his political career.His perspective on the Republican budget resolution and its impact on working-class Americans.Why mental health advocacy is deeply personal to him and the tools he uses to maintain his well-being.His unwavering support for Israel and the backlash he has faced because of it.Insights on the current political landscape, Donald Trump’s influence, and the need for bipartisanship.Whether Rep. Torres is considering a run for governor of New York and what motivates his political aspirations.How to engage in better political and religious discussions without hostility.Episode Highlights:[00:01:00] Introducing Ritchie Torres – His background, legislative achievements, and what drives him.[00:02:00] GOP Budget Cuts & Social Safety Net – Why the latest proposal is a “frontal assault” on working-class Americans.[00:04:00] Personal Story & His Greatest Hero – How being raised by a single mother in the Bronx shaped his worldview.[00:07:00] Mental Health & Politics – How Rep. Torres overcame depression and why he’s open about talking about mental health.[00:14:00] Facing Backlash for Supporting Israel – The threats and vitriol he has endured for his stance.[00:20:00] Avoiding Political Distractions – Why he focuses on core economic issues instead of social media trends.[00:22:00] Trump 2.0 & The Future of Democracy – His concerns about a second Trump presidency.[00:25:00] Political Future: Running for Governor? – Why he believes New York needs a new generation of leadership.[00:27:00] How to Talk Politics Without Killin' Each Other – The importance of intellectual humility and pluralism.
Featured Quotes:“Before I’m a congressman or a councilman, I’m first and foremost the son of my mother...”
“I refuse to live in fear of the extremes. I insist on doing what I think is right, even if it means standing alone.”
“Not only should civil discourse be possible, it’s a necessity for a pluralistic democracy like ours.”
“If you do the same thing over and over and expect a different result, that’s the definition of insanity.”
📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
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Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comLet’s continue the conversation with gentleness and respect—and have a great week! 🎙️
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In this timely edition of Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other, host Corey Nathan welcomes Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde, the Bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Washington, D.C., and the Washington National Cathedral. Bishop Budde is a well-respected spiritual leader who has appeared on PBS NewsHour, Meet the Press, Good Morning America, and The Today Show.
The conversation dives into Bishop Budde’s faith journey, her reflections on political and social issues, and her approach to leading with grace and courage in divisive times. The discussion also touches on the controversy surrounding her sermon and how she directly addressed Donald Trump at the National Cathedral following the 2025 presidential inauguration.
What We DiscussBishop Budde’s personal faith journey, from her early religious experiences to her leadership in the Episcopal Church.The challenges of navigating faith, politics, and national unity in today’s polarized climate.How to extend grace and practice mercy even in the face of criticism.The role of the church in advocating for social justice, particularly regarding immigration and LGBTQ+ rights.Strategies for engaging in difficult conversations while maintaining mutual respect.Episode Highlights[00:00:00] – Introduction to the episode and guest, Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde.
[00:02:00] – Bishop Budde shares her faith journey and the struggles she faced reconciling different religious influences.
[00:10:00] – The tension between faith and exclusivity: why some versions of Christianity felt limiting to her.
[00:15:00] – The discipline of grace: choosing to respond with compassion rather than anger, even when faced with opposition.
[00:26:00] – Bishop Budde’s response to the 2025 presidential inauguration sermon controversy and the importance of speaking truth with love.
[00:38:00] – Handling criticism and maintaining a sense of personal and spiritual balance.
[00:52:00] – Finding hope in uncertain times: How we can cultivate a spirit of resilience and faith amid societal challenges.
[00:55:00] – The importance of dialogue: How to foster better conversations across political and religious differences.
[01:03:00] – Final thoughts and how to follow Bishop Budde’s work.
Featured Quotes"If it’s not about love, it’s not about God." – Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde
"The discipline of grace is a practice, not a gift. It’s about choosing to respond with love even when it’s difficult." – Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde
"To be raised from the dead—whatever that means in our own lives—requires our consent to live again, to have our hearts broken again, and to take on all of life again." – Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde
"We need to ask ourselves: When was the last time I changed my mind? True dialogue requires being open to seeing the world differently." – Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde
Resources MentionedBishop Budde’s Book: How We Learn to Be BraveEpiscopal Diocese of Washington – www.edow.org📣 Call to ActionIf you found this conversation insightful, please:✅ Subscribe to Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other on your favorite podcast platform.✅ Leave a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen: ratethispodcast.com/goodfaithpolitics✅ Support the show on Patreon: patreon.com/politicsandreligion✅ Watch the full conversation on YouTube: youtube.com/@politicsandreligion
🔗 Connect With Us on Social Media@coreysnathan:
BlueskyLinkedInInstagramThreadsFacebookSubstackBishop Mariann Edgar Budde:Episcopal Church of Washington: WebsiteOur SponsorsMeza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.comProlux Autogroup: www.proluxautogroup.com or www.granadahillsairporttransportation.comThank you for tuning in! Now go talk politics and religion—with gentleness and respect. 🎙️✨
#Politics #Religion #NeverTrump #Democracy #BishopBudde #Faith #Justice #Inclusivity #SocialJustice #Civility #Polarization -
In this episode, host Corey Nathan takes on one of the biggest challenges in today’s society: toxic partisanship. He explores how political and social divisions have deepened, fueled by media, social networks, and entrenched ideological battles. But rather than just diagnosing the problem, Corey offers a powerful antidote—getting local and engaging in real-life, face-to-face conversations. He draws inspiration from scholars like Jonathan Haidt, Katherine Stewart and Robert Putnam, as well as his personal experiences, to make a compelling case for community-based solutions to polarization.
What We Discuss✅ The real extent of political division in America—and why it's not as bad as it seems✅ How social media and national narratives exaggerate our differences✅ The philosophy of Carl Schmitt and its impact on modern political discourse✅ Why local engagement—like city council meetings, PTAs, and even bar conversations—is the key to bridging divides✅ Practical steps to foster meaningful discussions and rebuild relationships
Episode Highlights⏳ [00:02:00] – The growing problem of toxic partisanship and how social media makes it worse⏳ [00:05:00] – A study from More in Common shows Americans want unity, but doubt the other side does⏳ [00:09:00] – Corey shares personal examples of online political attacks and how they reflect broader polarization⏳ [00:14:00] – A key solution: Local engagement and organizations like Village Square⏳ [00:17:00] – How shared community goals, like better roads and schools, help bridge ideological divides⏳ [00:20:00] – The inspiring story of Joe Walsh and Fred Guttenberg: Two ideological opposites who became close friends⏳ [00:23:00] – The challenge of engaging with people who seem beyond reach—and knowing when to step away⏳ [00:26:00] – A call to action: Take the first step, invite someone for coffee, and start humanizing one another
Featured Quotes🗨️ "Division defines the country, but the desire to be united transcends parties." – More in Common study🗨️ "The number one antidote to toxic partisanship is simply getting together." – Corey Nathan🗨️ "When you're with each other, you're no longer just a data point—you’re a human being." – Corey Nathan🗨️ "We don't have to agree on everything to build something better together." – Liz Joyner, Village Square
Resources Mentioned🔗 Village Square – Bridging divides through local community engagement🔗 More in Common Study – Research on polarization and unity🔗 Jonathan Haidt’s Work – Understanding social and political divisions🔗 Robert Putnam’s Bowling Alone – How community engagement strengthens democracy🔗 Joe Walsh & Fred Guttenberg’s Story – Bridging the political divide
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