Afleveringen
-
Christopher Rufo is arguably the most successful activist of the MAGA era. He rose to prominence fighting D.E.I. initiatives and critical race theory. In President Trumpâs second term, heâs had a huge influence on policy, from Trumpâs executive orders against D.E.I. and the attacks on the Department of Education to the ICE and C.B.P. deployments to Minneapolis.
Rufo, helpfully, calls his shots. He has published a guide, âThe New Right Activism: A Manifesto for the Counterrevolution,â in which he argued for the value of âagitpropâ and counseled that âpolitical life moves on narrative, emotion, scandal, anger, hope, and faith â on irrational, or at least subrational, feelings.â But more recently, in his writing and on the podcast he co-hosts, âRufo & Lomez,â he seems worried about the new right he has helped build: its attraction to conspiracy theories, its racialist thinking, its internal fissures.
So I wanted to have him on the show to talk about the problems he sees on his side, but also to interrogate whether he may have scored short-term victories while seeding profound long-term problems.
Rufo is a senior fellow and director of the initiative on critical race theory at the Manhattan Institute. Heâs a contributing editor of City Journal and the author of âAmericaâs Cultural Revolution: How the Radical Left Conquered Everything.â
This episode contains strong language.
Mentioned:
âThe New Right Activismâ by Christopher Rufo
âThe Numberâ by David D. Kirkpatrick
âThe unraveling of a cat taleâ by Jacqueline Sweet
Book recommendations
Unmasking the Administrative State by John Marini
The Revolutionary by Stacy Schiff
The Managerial Revolution by James Burnham
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Jack McCordick. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Kate Sinclair, Mary Marge Locker and Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld. Mixing by Pat McCusker, Efim Shapiro, and Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser. Transcript editing by Kate Wilkinson and Marlaine Glicksman.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
A hypervisual, looks-obsessed, wellness-crazed, postliterate society where weâre constantly staring at screens and evaluating one another based on metrics, as the country around us feels like itâs falling apart: That sounds like the world we live in. Itâs also the world Gary Shteyngart created in his 2010 novel, âSuper Sad True Love Story.â
Iâve been thinking about the book a lot recently, especially with the rise of the âlooksmaxxingâ influencer Clavicular and the longevity guru Bryan Johnson, and this feeling that people are upset and agitated but grabbing at the wrong things to fix it. It feels uncannily like the experience of living inside Shteyngartâs novel.
But Shteyngart isnât just a dystopian prophet, heâs also an expert at living well amid the worldâs darkness. His forthcoming book, âThe Sensualist: Adventures in Pure Pleasure,â is an essay collection about his efforts to do exactly that. So I wanted to have Shteyngart on the show to understand how he predicted so many of the grimmer aspects of our present, but also how we might delight in the worldâs âendless buffet of pleasureâ in spite of them.
This episode contains strong language.
Note: Weâre recording an "Ask Me Anything" episode soon. If you have a question, please email [email protected] using the subject like "AMA." We'd love to hear from you.
Mentioned:
âThe End Point Of Viral Contentâ by Ryan Broderick
âHow Jokes Won the Electionâ by Emily Nussbaum
âA Visit to Seoul Brings Our Writer Face-to-Face With the Future of Robotsâ by Gary Shteyngart
The Intimate City by Michael Kimmelman
âDonât Just Take the Slow Road; Design It,â Commencement address at Wesleyanâs 194th Commencement Ceremony, Chris Murphy
Book Recommendations:
Men Like Ours by Bindu Bansinath
A Tender Age by Chang-rae Lee
Motherland by Julia Ioffe
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Mary-Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Zijn er afleveringen die ontbreken?
-
Attention is working in really unusual ways this election cycle.
Graham Platner, a political unknown a year ago, ended up dominating his Senate primary against Maineâs sitting governor â even as his campaign was rocked by a series of scandals. James Talarico also seemed to come out of nowhere to become the Democratic nominee for Senate in Texas. Jon Ossoff has ginned up a ton of excitement as a potential 2028 presidential contender, in part because of his viral videos. Meanwhile, the former reality TV personality Spencer Pratt became a political star on X during his bid to become mayor of Los Angeles and yet failed to make the runoff.
All of this has a lot of lessons for how attention is working right now in American politics. So I wanted to have on my favorite person to talk to on this topic. Chris Hayes is the host of âAll In With Chris Hayesâ on MS NOW and the author of âThe Sirensâ Call: How Attention Became the Worldâs Most Endangered Resource.â
Mentioned:
âDonald Trump is going to win the election and democracy will be just fineâ by Jared Golden
âWe Took AOC to a Deep Red Data Center Townâ by More Perfect Union
âAmerica Dissectedâ by Dr. Abdul El-Sayed
âCan James Talarico Reclaim Christianity for the Left?â with James Talarico, The Ezra Klein Show
âJoe Rogan Experience #2352 - James Talaricoâ with James Talarico, The Joe Rogan Experience
âWhy Everyone Wants Jon Ossoff to Run for Presidentâ by Michelle Goldberg
âObama Suddenly Panicked After Gazing Too Far Into Futureâ by The Onion
Book Recommendations:
Transcription by Ben Lerner
The Godfather by Mario Puzo
Alan Opts Out by Courtney Maum
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Julie Beer and Kate Sinclair. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker and Aman Sahota. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
The Democratic Party is in the middle of a rupture over foreign policy â with Israel and Palestine at the center.
In recent weeks, the Democratic senators Brian Schatz and Chris Van Hollen both called for a break with the Biden administrationâs policies toward Israel. Schatz said the next administration needs âa whole new crop of foreign policy staffers,â while Van Hollen went further, accusing Bidenâs senior decision makers of âcomplicity.â And Gaza has become a central issue splitting Democrats in primaries around the country. Itâs become such a profound fault line, it reminds me of how the Iraq war remade the Democratic Party years ago.
And Democrats face huge foreign policy questions beyond Gaza, too. Trump has taken a wrecking ball to the rules-based order, and the American public has become increasingly cynical about U.S. interventions abroad. Do Democrats want to try to restore what came before Trump? Is that even possible? Or is there a vision for something new?
Matt Duss is at the center of foreign policy thinking on the left. Heâs the executive vice president at the Center for International Policy, previously served as Senator Bernie Sandersâs foreign policy adviser and is currently advising Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. So I thought heâd be the perfect person to ask: What would a left foreign policy actually look like? What would it try to do in the world?Mentioned:
âThe Hard Truth My Party Needs to Faceâ by Chris Van Hollen
âDemocrats Canât Avoid a Reckoning With Gazaâ by Matthew Duss
âWhy We Need a Progressive Foreign Policyâ by Chris Murphy
âCongressman Jason Crowâs New Vision for American Foreign Policyâ by Jason Crow
Book Recommendations:
Crisis of the Common Good by Chris Murphy
From Life Itself by Suzy Hansen
Book of Mercy by Leonard Cohen
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Julie Beer and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones and Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
A new masculinist movement has gone mainstream on the right.
The prominent voices in this movement yearn for an earlier time, when men were men and women were women. Sometimes that time seems to be the 1950s, like when Tucker Carlson extols a world where men go to work and women stay at home. But sometimes it goes way farther back. The pastor Doug Wilson advocates household voting, in which men vote for their wives. And Costin Vlad Alamariu, better known as Bronze Age Pervert, harks back to the Bronze Age â specifically the ancient Hittite and Mitanni Empires.
Helen Lewis wrote a recent cover story for The Atlantic about this new antifeminist backlash, which she calls âthe single most important force holding together the American right.â So I wanted to have her on the show to talk about these ideas, the political program of this movement and how seriously we should take it.
Lewis is a staff writer at The Atlantic and the author of âDifficult Women: A History of Feminism in 11 Fightsâ and âThe Genius Myth.â
This episode contains strong language.
Mentioned:
Difficult Women by Helen Lewis
âWhat Is the Longhouse?â by L0m3z
The Last Men by Charles Cornish-Dale
Bronze Age Mindset by Bronze Age Pervert
The End of History and the Last Man by Francis Fukuyama
âThe Men â and Boys â Are Not Alrightâ with Richard Reeves, The Ezra Klein Show
âDid Liberal Feminism Ruin the Workplace?â with Helen Andrews and Leah Libresco Sargeant, Interesting Times with Ross Douthat
âThe Great Feminizationâ by Helen Andrews
âThe Women Leaving the New Rightâ by Sam Adler-Bell
Book Recommendations:
Christie Malryâs Own Double-Entry by B.S. Johnson
Madame de Pompadour by Nancy Mitford
The Genius Factory by David Plotz
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris and Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones and Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Kyle Grandillo. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Over the past month, there have been two dominant stories in American foreign policy. One, of course, is the war with Iran. The other is the much-anticipated summit between President Trump and Xi Jinping of China. And I think if you look closely at both of these stories, you see that our foreign policy has entered into a period of absolute incoherence.
Iâm not even sure what the status of the Iran war is at this point. What is Trump trying to achieve? What is he willing to accept?
Taking a more hawkish approach to China has been a core and consistent principle of Trumpâs since his first term. Heâs been insistent that China has taken advantage of the United States and that America needed to change that dynamic and flex more power. But is that happening? Is that even Trumpâs position anymore?
So I wanted to do an episode looking at China and Iran and trying to assess Trumpâs foreign policy in general and the ways heâs remaking what America means on the world stage.
Ian Bremmer is the president and founder of Eurasia Group, a political risk research and consultancy firm, and the global affairs publication GZero. Heâs also the author of, among other books, âEvery Nation for Itself: What Happens When No One Leads the World.â
Mentioned:
Bowling Alone by Robert D. Putnam
The J Curve by Ian Bremmer
âThe âVibecessionâ Is Over. The âPermacessionâ Is Here.â by Annie Lowrey
âDisney and the Decline of Americaâs Middle Classâ by Daniel Currell
Eurasia Groupâs Top Risks for 2026
Book Recommendations:
The Hitchhikerâs Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams
A World Appears by Michael Pollan
The Chronoliths by Robert Charles Wilson
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu and Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon and Isaac Jones. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker and Carole Sabouraud. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
President Trump doesnât seem to care that much about winning the midterms. Heâs more unpopular at this point in his second term than basically any of his modern predecessors. Democrats seem poised to retake the House and have a real chance of retaking the Senate. You might expect a president in that position to pivot to the center, to focus on votersâ top concerns and try to boost the strongest Republicans in key races.
Trump isnât doing any of that. Instead, he announced a $1.8 billion slush fund to pay out âvictims of lawfare,â he threatened to re-escalate the Iran war, and he intervened in Republican primaries in ways that are gifts to Democrats, like endorsing the scandal-plagued Ken Paxton over the incumbent, John Cornyn, in Texasâ Senate race.
Why doesnât Trump seem to care more about winning?
Liam Donovan is a Republican strategist and a president at Targeted Victory, a Washington public affairs and digital marketing firm. He has worked on the National Republican Senatorial Committee and for Cornyn. In this conversation, we discuss the moves Trump is making, the rough political environment for Republicans and what the paths to Democratic victories look like.
Mentioned:
âGraham Platner Thinks a Political Revolution Is Comingâ by The Interview
Thomas Massie interview in The Washington Examiner
Book Recommendations:
The Right by Matthew Continetti
Apple in China by Patrick McGee
The Frackers by Gregory Zuckerman
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Jack McCordick. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Julie Beer and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
What are the conditions that enable a country to become great â or great again? The Trump administration â and other right-wing movements in other countries â offers a vision of greatness based on power and domination abroad, and a mix of shared national and religious stories at home. And that vision is clearly appealing to a lot of people. Liberals in the U.S. and elsewhere have been struggling to tell a story that can compete.
What story would Yuval Noah Harari tell? One of the through lines of Harariâs best-selling books â âSapiens,â âHomo Deus,â âNexusâ â is the huge role that stories play in shaping the arc of history, driving humans to cooperate on a grand scale to achieve great things, or divide violently against one another.
So I wanted to ask him about the stories that the U.S. and Israel, in particular, seem to have embraced right now. What does history tell us about the power of this story? And why does the liberal story seem so weak right now?
Mentioned:
Sapiens by Yuval Noah Harari
Homo Deus by Yuval Noah Harari
Unstoppable Us, Volume 3 by Yuval Noah Harari
âUnderstanding AIâ by Timothy B. Lee
Book Recommendations:
The MANIAC by Benjamin Labatut
Chimpanzee Politics by Frans de Waal
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones and Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Isaac Jones. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker and Aman Sahota. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
We have entered a world of maximum gerrymandering warfare. Any guardrails that once existed, from the Constitution or the courts, have been bulldozed over the last decade â most recently in the Supreme Court decision that gutted the Voting Rights Act and made it harder for minorities to challenge racially discriminatory voting maps.
Red and blue states alike have been aggressively trying to redraw their congressional maps in response to all these developments. And there is no sign that will end in 2028; legislatures will just continue trying to tweak their lines to squeeze out advantage for whatever party is in power. And competitive districts in this country â already an endangered species â now teeter on extinction.
That is, unless something dramatic changes.
Lee Drutman is a senior fellow in the political reform program at New America. Heâs one of the most persistent and thoughtful advocates of selecting House members through proportional representation â a system used in many other countries that would make gerrymandering much more difficult. Heâs the author of the 2020 book âBreaking the Two-Party Doom Loop: The Case for Multiparty Democracy in Americaâ and writes the newsletter Undercurrent Events.
Mentioned:
Breaking the Two-Party Doom Loop by Lee Drutman
âUndercurrent Eventsâ by Lee Drutman
Why Weâre Polarized by Ezra Klein
âHow one country stopped a Trump-style authoritarian in his tracksâ by Zack Beauchamp
Book Recommendations:
Tyranny of the Majority by Lani Guinier
American Politics by Samuel P. Huntington
The Recognitions by William Gaddis
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Claire Gordon. Fact-checking by Kate Sinclair, Julie Beer and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Aman Sahota and Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
What do you do when you feel anxious or insecure? Many of us try to push the feeling away, or we ruminate on it, or try to solve it, or avoid the thought altogether. But what would happen if we did the exact opposite?
The Buddhist nun and teacher Pema Chödrön is the author of many beloved books, including âWhen Things Fall Apart,â âWelcoming the Unwelcomeâ and â my personal favorite â âComfortable With Uncertainty.â And she has a way of inviting people to befriend the parts of life that typically induce dread â from uncertainty and suffering to loss and discomfort. And she argues that the process of sitting with these experiences and emotions actually releases their power over us. In a time as chaotic and tumultuous as ours, she has so much practical wisdom to share.
In this conversation, she shares what it looks like to actually let go of difficult emotions, the art of âcollaborating with realityâ when things donât go as expected, and how to awaken yourself to the ânownessâ of life.
Mentioned:
Comfortable with Uncertainty by Pema Chödrön
When Things Fall Apart by Pema Chödrön
Welcoming the Unwelcome by Pema Chödrön
Another Kind of Freedom by Pema Chödrön
Book Recommendations:
Shambhala: The Sacred Path of the Warrior by Chögyam Trungpa
Zen Mind, Beginnerâs Mind by Shunryu Suzuki
Enlightened Vagabond by Matthieu Ricard
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Kristin Lin. Fact-checking by Kim Freda. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Michelle Harris, Rollin Hu, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Diane Wong, Dan Powell and Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
On Friday, I moderated a forum with the top Democratic candidates for California governor, focusing on the stateâs housing crisis.
Californiaâs current governor, Gavin Newsom, came into office in 2019 promising to build millions of homes. And in the years since, dozens of pro-housing laws have passed, designed to cut red tape and spur more construction. And yet the number of homes being built in California is basically the same as when he took office, and the stateâs housing crisis remains, arguably, the worst in the country. So I wanted to know what the next governor would do about it.
We taped this at the Calvin Simmons Theater in Oakland, Calif. The candidates on the stage were Xavier Becerra, a former attorney general of California and health and human services secretary under President Joe Biden; Matt Mahan, the mayor of San Jose and a tech entrepreneur; Katie Porter, a former U.S. representative; Tom Steyer, a former San Francisco hedge fund manager, a climate activist and a philanthropist; and Antonio Villaraigosa, a former mayor of Los Angeles and speaker of the California State Assembly. This panel was recorded live. The Times did not fact-check candidatesâ remarks.
Mentioned:
âCost to Build Multifamily Housing in California More Than Twice as High as in Texasâ by RAND
âWhat Worries Me Most About âAbundanceââ with Derek Thompson and Marc Dunkelman, The Ezra Klein Show
Book Recommendations:
The Hour of the Predator by Giuliano da Empoli
Rain of Gold by Victor Villaseñor
Yesteryear by Caro Claire Burke
Why Nothing Works by Marc J. Dunkelman
Ours Was the Shining Future by David Leonhardt
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu, Marie Cascione, Kristin Lin and Marina King. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld. Our recording engineer is Johnny Simon. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Annie Galvin, Michelle Harris, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Shows is Annie-Rose Strasser. And special thanks to Argus HD.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Hereâs a shocking number: One out of eight American adults is taking a GLP-1, like Ozempic or Zepbound, according to a KFF poll.
GLP-1s are the biggest pharmaceutical story since antidepressants. But thereâs still so much we donât know.
âWeâre only at the beginning of whatâs been called this Ozempic era,â the journalist Julia Belluz told me. âI think weâre really just at the beginning of discovering the benefits and the harms of these drugs.â These discoveries begin in the research but are also expanding into how we think about our punishing beauty standards and the blurry lines between illness and wellness.
Belluz is a contributing Opinion writer and the author, with Kevin Hall, of âFood Intelligence.â Sheâs one of the best health and science reporters I know and has been reporting on GLP-1s for years.
In this conversation, Belluz takes me through what we know â and donât know â about GLP-1s, their unexpected uses, how they are clashing with a culture obsessed with thinness and looksmaxxing, and whether everyone should be on them.
Mentioned:
âThe obesity pay gap is worse than previously thoughtâ by The Economist
âThe Great Ozempic Experimentâ by Julia Belluz
Book Recommendations:
Behave by Robert M. Sapolsky
The Poison Squad by Deborah Blum
Ultra-Processed People by Chris van Tulleken
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Transcript editing by Sarah Murphy and Marlaine Glicksman.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
In the U.S., illiberalism is in power. I donât think anybody really argues against that. But Iâve been surprised by how weak liberalism has felt in response.
Donald Trump isnât a popular president; he isnât making people want more of what he is. But if the forces of illiberalism are really going to be turned back in this country, I think more people need to be excited and inspired by liberalism itself. We need a liberalism that stands for more than ânot Trump.â
So Iâve been on my own esoteric journey, reading a lot of books on the history of liberalism, trying to understand what excited and inspired people in the past, and how liberals overcame crises like the one weâre in. And reading one of those books, âThe Lost History of Liberalismâ by Helena Rosenblatt, it felt like an epiphany â that this was a piece of the puzzle.
So I wanted to have Rosenblatt on the show to talk about it. Rosenblatt is a professor of history, political science and French at the Graduate Center of the City University of New York, and in this conversation, she walks me through the history of liberalism that she uncovered, and the values that once lived at its heart.
Mentioned:
Democracy in America by Alexis de Tocqueville
Liberalism by Edmund Fawcett
Book Recommendations:
Liberalism against Itself by Samuel Moyn
Liberalism as a Way of Life by Alexandre Lefebvre
Thinking With Machines by Vasant Dhar
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Jack McCordick. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Kate Sinclair and Julie Beer. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Johnny Simon. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta and Lauren Reddy. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Transcript editing by Filipa Pajevic and Marlaine Glicksman.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
âAbundanceâ came out a little over a year ago. Itâs been exciting â and a little disorienting â seeing how itâs rippled out into the world, and the ways itâs been embraced and debated and critiqued. So I wanted to take a moment to talk through whatâs really happened in the last year â with Derek Thompson, my âAbundanceâ co-author, and Marc Dunkelman, whose book âWhy Nothing Worksâ came out around the same time, and circles the same ideas.
What has the abundance movement actually achieved in the last year? Where has it fallen short? And what have the three of us learned from our critics?
Mentioned:
Ezra is moderating a forum on housing and affordability with some of the top California gubernatorial candidates. The event is on Friday, May 8, in Oakland, CA. You can buy tickets here. Use the code EKSHOW for 20 percent off your order.
Abundance by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson
Why Nothing Works by Marc J. Dunkelman
Derek Thompsonâs Substack
The Power Elite by C. Wright Mills
The Power Broker by Robert A. Caro
âThe Most Expensive Mile of Subway Track on Earthâ by Brian M. Rosenthal
âWhy Are Palantir and OpenAI Scared of Alex Bores?â by The Ezra Klein Show
âThe Anti-Social Centuryâ by Derek Thompson
Bowling Alone by Robert D. Putnam
The Permanent Problem by Brink Lindsey
âBernie Sanders: âThere Ainât Much of a Democratic Partyâ by Bernie Sanders and David Leonhardt
Book Recommendations:
Making a New Deal by Lizabeth Cohen
Stuck by Yoni Appelbaum
Cadillac Desert by Marc Reisner
Mere Christianity by C. S. Lewis
The Secret History by Donna Tartt
Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy, Narrated by Richard Poe
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Annika Robbins and Kate Sinclair. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones and Aman Sahota. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta and Lauren Reddy. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. And special thanks to Brianna Johnson.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Stewart Brand might be the most influential philosopher of the internet â at least in its more idealistic era. In the 1960s, Brand was the central bridge figure between the San Francisco counterculture and the emerging technology scene. He created the legendary Trips Festival with Ken Kesey in 1966, and was there at âthe mother of all demosâ in 1968. And he created and edited the Whole Earth Catalog, which Steve Jobs called âone of the bibles of my generationâ and âGoogle in paperback form, 35 years before Google came along.â
Brand has seen Silicon Valley evolve in the decades since. And along the way, he has written many brilliant books about our relationship to technology, the built environment and the natural world. His latest book is âMaintenance: Of Everything, Part One.â
In this conversation, we discuss everything from dropping acid to the genesis of the Whole Earth Catalog, what he thinks A.I. will reveal about humanity, the 40 years heâs spent living on a tugboat and the importance of maintenance in a culture that prizes novelty and disposability.
Mentioned:
Ezra is moderating a forum on housing and affordability with some of the top California gubernatorial candidates. The event is on Friday, May 8, in Oakland, CA. You can buy tickets here. Use the code EKSHOW for 20 percent off your order.
Maintenance: Of Everything, Part One by Stewart Brand
âWe Didnât Ask for This Internetâ with Cory Doctorow and Tim Wu, The Ezra Klein Show
I And Thou by Martin Buber
Book Recommendations:
The Beginning of Infinity by David Deutsch
The Perfectionists by Simon Winchester
The Scottish Enlightenment by Arthur Herman
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Kelsey Lannin. Our recording engineers are Aman Sahota and Johnny Simon. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Michelle Harris, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Special thanks to Fred Turner.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Leading the Future, a super PAC whose funders include the founders of companies like Palantir and OpenAI, is spending millions of dollars this election cycle, and a considerable amount of that money is going toward attack ads against Alex Bores â even though Bores himself used to work for Palantir.
Bores is a New York state assemblyman who is running for Congress to represent New Yorkâs 12th District. His campaign includes an extensive A.I. policy platform, including demands for A.I. companies to be more transparent about safety, and an idea for an âA.I. dividendâ that would redistribute some of the profits of A.I. companies to the public. So his race has turned into a central battleground over the future of the A.I. industry and who has the power to shape it.
In this conversation, we discuss how Bores went from working for Palantir to running a campaign that would regulate the A.I. industry, the major issues he thinks A.I. policy needs to address, and his response to the attacks against him.
Mentioned:
Give People Money by Annie Lowrey
âAlex Boresâ AI Policy Framework For Congressâ
âNY Congressional Candidate Faced Palantir Sexual Comments Claimâ by Laura Nahmias
âAI populismâs warning shotsâ by Jasmine Sun
Book Recommendations:
A Theory of Justice by John Rawls
World Eaters by Catherine Bracy
Bird by Bird by Anne Lamott
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Lori Segal. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota and Isaac Jones. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Michelle Harris, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta and Lauren Reddy. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. And special thanks to Gregory C. Allen.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
Jeff Bezos, Michael Bloomberg and Warren Buffett are three of the richest people in the world, but they pay little in income tax relative to their wealth.
In 2021, ProPublica published an investigation built on leaked tax documents that reveal what some of the richest Americans really pay â or donât. Warren Buffett had a true tax rate of 0.1 percent. Jeff Bezos: 0.98 percent. Michael Bloomberg: 1.3 percent.
Ultra-wealthy Americans have essentially been written out of the tax system. âItâs wrong as a matter of principle. Itâs wrong because we need their money. Itâs wrong as a matter of fairness. It is wrong for so many reasons,â the law professor Ray Madoff told me.
Sheâs the author of the new book âThe Second Estate: How the Tax Code Made an American Aristocracy,â and sheâs interested in helping people understand how broken the American tax system is and how to fix it.
In this conversation, we discuss the techniques the ultra-wealthy use to evade the tax system, why they think âsalaries are for suckersâ and what tax reform could look like.
Mentioned:
âThe Secret IRS Files: Trove of Never-Before-Seen Records Reveal How the Wealthiest Avoid Income Taxâ by Jesse Eisinger, Jeff Ernsthausen and Paul Kiel
The Second Estate by Ray D. Madoff
Taxation: The Peopleâs Business by Andrew W. Mellon
Philanthrocapitalism by Matthew Bishop and Michael Green
Book Recommendations:
The Age of Extraction by Tim Wu
The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal Order by Gary Gerstle
Crossroads by Jonathan Franzen
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Shannon Busta and Lauren Reddy. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. And special thanks to Edward Fox.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
For decades, most discussions of Israel and Palestine were framed around the eventual creation of a two-state solution. That effort has been dead for years. What has emerged in its place is what the political scientists Marc Lynch and Shibley Telhami call the âone-state reality.â Their book on this â edited with Michael Barnett and Nathan Brown â came out before Oct. 7, 2023.
Since Oct. 7, that reality has become further entrenched: Thereâs been a record pace of settlement construction in the West Bank. Israel now occupies more than half the territory of Gaza. And Israelâs push into Lebanon has displaced more than a million people.
So what does it mean to reckon with Israelâs one-state reality â to see the facts on the ground rather than the frames of the past?
Shibley Telhami is the Anwar Sadat professor for peace and development at the University of Maryland, College Park. Marc Lynch is the director of the Project on Middle East Political Science at George Washington University. Lynch is the author, most recently, of âAmericaâs Middle East: The Ruination of a Region.â
Mentioned:
âIsraelâs One-State Realityâ by Michael Barnett, Nathan Brown, Marc Lynch, and Shibley Telhami
The One State Reality by Michael Barnett, Nathan J. Brown, Marc Lynch and Shibley Telhami
Israelâs Religiously Divided Society, Pew Research Center
Summary of a Year of Terror, Expulsion, and Annexation â 2025 in the Settlements, Peace Now
Book Recommendations:
Justice for Some by Noura Erakat
Wars of Ambition by Afshon Ostovar
The Second Emancipation by Howard W. French
Mayors in the Middle by Diana B. Greenwald
Israel by Omer Bartov
Tomorrow Is Yesterday by Hussein Agha and Robert Malley
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Jack McCordick. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Kate Sinclair and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. And special thanks to Mark Mazzetti.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
When President Trump didnât annihilate âa whole civilizationâ on Tuesday, as he had threatened to do, much of the world exhaled. But the damage of his statements â a U.S. president, the commander in chief of the worldâs most powerful military, threatening to commit war crimes â continues to linger in the shadow of an uncertain cease-fire.
Fareed Zakaria is the host of CNNâs âFareed Zakaria GPSâ and the author of âAge of Revolutionsâ and other books. In this conversation, we discuss whether Trumpâs threats on Truth Social worked as a negotiating tactic, the significance of crossing this kind of moral line and how the decline of American leadership is already reshaping the world.
This episode contains strong language.
Mentioned:
Age of Revolutions by Fareed Zakaria
âThe Predatory Hegemonâ by Stephen M. Walt
âIran is an imperial trap. America walked right in.â by Fareed Zakaria
Book Recommendations:
A World Safe for Democracy by G. John Ikenberry
The Irony of American History by Reinhold Niebuhr
The Quiet American by Graham Greene
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Kate Sinclair and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our recording engineer is Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Jack McCordick, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker and Aman Sahota. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
-
In a prime time address on Wednesday, President Trump proclaimed that America was âon the cusp of ending Iranâs sinister threat.â But he also kept open the option of boots on the ground. The effective closure of the Strait of Hormuz is also about to start really biting â as countries get hit with shortages, which would spike prices across the globe.
So what are Trumpâs options? What would happen if he just declared victory and walked away from the fight? What kinds of military operations are on the table? If Trump ended the war without achieving his strategic goals, what would that mean for the United States, for Iran and for the world?
âI donât see a victory in real terms at the end of this crisisâŠ,â Suzanne Maloney told me. âAnd that is a very dangerous outcome for the long term.â
Maloney is one of Washingtonâs leading Iran experts. She has advised several presidential administrations and has written or edited a number of books on Iran. She is the vice president and director of the Brookings Institutionâs foreign policy program.
Note: This conversation was recorded on Wednesday morning, before Trumpâs speech on the war. But the speech reflected Maloneyâs analysis almost perfectly.
Mentioned:
The Iranian Revolution at Forty by Suzanne Maloney
President Trump Addresses Nation on War with Iran
âTrump tells Post war against Iran wonât last âmuch longerâ âStrait of Hormuz will reopen âautomaticallyâ after US exitâ by Steven Nelson
Book Recommendations:
The Twilight War by David Crist
American Hostages in Iran by Warren Christopher and Paul H. Kreisberg
Democracy in Iran by Misagh Parsa
Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at [email protected].
You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.
This episode of âThe Ezra Klein Showâ was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris with Kate Sinclair and Mary Marge Locker. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The showâs production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.
Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
- Laat meer zien
